Tryin, but failin, slide. Help?

Alright guys, this is the scoop. I have been trying to get ahold of slide for a long time. I would say that Duane Allman is one of the biggest reasons that I play day to day, I just wish I could handle slide.

For the slide setup I use a Gibson Les Paul in open E, with a pyrex glass slide, straight through to a 212 Hot Rod Deville. I understand blocking strings, but I just can't seem to play anything natural. It all sounds "cartoonish" and flat out crappy.

I guess I just don't understand any of the technique with it. I can't do string changes, or combinations, and I have trouble getting strings to ring through without killing themselves.

Does anyone have some tipes or technique that I am missing? Or perhaps some good resources. Thanks

I struggled with slide for a long time, until I went to a workshop/seminar by Doug Macleod. He brought it all together for me. If you can catch one of his seminars then I would encourage it, but I know he also has a DVD out that covers the same material. He's more of an acoustic guy but the techniques work for both acoustic and electric.

Use heavier strings !
Raise the action ! (piece of cake on a Les Paul, luckily ! )

Good "slide soundcheck" songs/licks :
Black Crowes, twice as hard (http://www.guitaretab.com/b/black-crowes/1700.html)

Led Zep. In my time of dying (http://www.guitaretab.com/l/led-zeppelin/10223.html)

Some info :
http://www.acousticfingerstyle.com/slideguitar.htm


--> Practice :-) And if everything else fails, You can do what I usually do : use loads of flanger & delay to "cover/clean up" :-) he he ....

Good luck !

/J

I struggled with slide for a long time, until I went to a workshop/seminar by Doug Macleod.

I love that guy. He's a classy dude.


Use heavier strings !
Raise the action !

+1000

I use slide for nearly HALF of everything I play.

I play in both Open E (Les Paul Junior) and Open G (Telecaster).

STRING GAUGE
For slide I play mostly with at least .011 gauge strings, but .012's and .013's are best. With slide - the bigger the better.

ACTION
Raise you action a bit. With heavier strings you'll have to raise your action less. Whenever you drastically change your action height, you'll usually have to readjust intonation a bit.

You may have to raise your pickup as well.

For these reasons (gauge and action) I generally set aside at least a guitar per tuning for slide.

SLIDE FINGER
I almost always use slide on my pinky. This allows me three fingers for when I need to fret.

If you're doing more Duanne style stuff where you fret rarely at all and like 95% of the notes/chords will be done with the slide, you may prefer the middle finger approach.

MUTING
I don't pay much mind to muting behind the slide, I play a lot of sloppy slide blues like Elmore James.

Once you're used to playing for a while, muting behind the slide is easy and natural. It will become second nature.

It just takes a little bit of time for it to feel more natural. Don't let it get you down. Remember heaviest strings possible and raise the action a little bit at a time until it's most comfortable without "fretting out".

Lowell George used a 11/16 deep set socket for a slide,I tried it and
it works great.I have about 30 different glass slides and none of them
works as good as that socket.It's all I use.

Lowell George used a 11/16 deep set socket for a slide,I tried it and
it works great.I have about 30 different glass slides and none of them
works as good as that socket.It's all I use.
I tried using a socket and a piece of brass I machined out myself but I found both a little to heavy to begin with . I like a glass slide or one of those little glass medicine bottles . I definately would dedicate 1 guitar just for slide.

Get rid of your pick and play with your thumb and fingers. It's much easier to get to different strings and mute when you want to. If you're a flat picker it takes a little practice, but it's worth it. I think it sounds better too.

i play with 13-56 strings and an action about 4 mms. that works for me best. i play open d most of the time.

It's hard to tell your exact problem from your description. Most people I think have the opposite problem--strings ringing too much, adjacent strings sounding or sustaining when they don't want them too, ghost notes. I know I did. That's where all the muting techniques come in.

I guess the guys that advise heavier strings and higher action (or a lighter touch) are on the right track in your case.

Right away I'd probably say you're tryin to hard. I learned most of my slide playing from Little feat/Black Crowes. Just try to play a few melodies on 1 or 2 strings. Get that vibrato happening too.

I use open G tuning now. EGDGBD

I found about 30 chords I can play with that tuning.

I also use a big brass slide. (better low end - harsher hi-end). on 3rd finger

Pickin' with your fingers is a plus, but takes time. I do both


The thing that no-one ever seems to mention is that to play slide really well, you have to be loud. Your notes sustain better. Finger pickin is easier. I can barely play slide if my amp is too quiet. I find the louder I can get,the less Overdrive I need for sustain. (Ry Cooder has a great slide sound)

It's hard to tell your exact problem from your description. Most people I think have the opposite problem--strings ringing too much, adjacent strings sounding or sustaining when they don't want them too, ghost notes. I know I did. That's where all the muting techniques come in.
.
For me, muting behind the slide and finger muting are vital. For me, palm muting isn't needed if I finger pick, fingers (and thumb) that aren't plucking in any given moment, are muting. I use a Dunlop 213 glass slide (biggest one they make) on my ring finger.

I highly recommend "The Art of Slide Guitar" by Lee Roy Parnell. Will give you lots and losts of good information to start off and showcases his playing as well. Arlen Roth, the vid's producer, is also a slide whiz and I learned some stuff from him, too. It's been re-released and you can get it by clicking the link below.

The Art of Slide Guitar (http://www.totalvid.com/Guitar-Videos/Lee-Roy-Parnell-Art-Slide-Guitar-Pt2/).

Since you say you are inspired by Duane Allman, I would advise getting Warren Haynes' Hot Licks DVD, "Electric Blues & Slide Guitar". It has a lot of tips on playing that I'm sure you will find helpful, especially since a lot of the licks may be familiar.

hey man,
have you tried using "guitarplayertv.com"? it's free-well some of it is-anyway,
in the lessons area there is a short set of "techniques" by david hamburger
that might help you. if you can master some of his stuff, i would think that
you could be well on your way to playing some allman bros.it's a shot in the
dark but you never know till you try..........................schwartz

Hey schwartz, I'm a new member too although I have been lurking around here for sometime. In the Shop Talk section of the Allman Brothers Website there is a topic called "Open E Chord Shapes." Ramblin Jam and others may find some of this info useful. Here is the link:

http://www.allmanbrothersband.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=XForum&file=viewthread&tid=49107

Hope this helps.

A good listen to any great electric slide player will tell you that one note goes a long way.
Practice sliding up to a note and holding it with a little vibrato.
Listen to see if you've got a bunch of other noise and/or if it doesn't sound clear and tasty.
You'll never get the fancy stuff if you can't play one note.

I'm far from expert, but you got good suggestions so far. Definitely go with the heaviest strings you can and raise that action a bit. Try the neck pick-up, maybe roll the tone back a bit and add some overdrive. I like a lot of vibrato, so really try to move that slide back and forth when you're holding a note (it's in the wrist action). The big things for most folks (it seems to me) is the damping. For that reason, I suggest using your middle finger on the slide,till you get a feel for it. Then you can damp with your fingers and your picking hand palm. Using all fingers or hybrid picking is a good idea if you're comfortable with it. Make sure the slide is a good fit for the finger you're using. It took me a while to make any real progress. A good exercise is to just try to play each note up the neck (each fret) till you can get a good sound doing that. That way you can focus on the technique without worrying about what notes to play. Good luck!

For me, muting behind the slide and finger muting are vital. For me, palm muting isn't needed if I finger pick, fingers (and thumb) that aren't plucking in any given moment, are muting. I use a Dunlop 213 glass slide (biggest one they make) on my ring finger.

I highly recommend "The Art of Slide Guitar" by Lee Roy Parnell. Will give you lots and losts of good information to start off and showcases his playing as well. Arlen Roth, the vid's producer, is also a slide whiz and I learned some stuff from him, too. It's been re-released and you can get it by clicking the link below.

The Art of Slide Guitar (http://www.totalvid.com/Guitar-Videos/Lee-Roy-Parnell-Art-Slide-Guitar-Pt2/).


I've been trying to convince myself to learn to play slide for a couple of years. I finally made the commitment. Heavier guage strings, raised the action some, have a glass and brass slide to try...AND bought the Lee Roy Parnell DVD. Bear in mind that I just set the guitar up last night and have glanced through the video...from just the little I've seen, I can't recommend it enough. IMHO, it is essential for someone (like me) who has never attempted slide playing. My initial feeling on the whole subject of slide is that it's similar to when we all first picked up a guitar..getting the notes to sound without fret buzz, finding your way around scales, cords...it is a different animal and, like any "new" instrument", you have to struggle through the beginning part of learning. My parents hated listening to me making noise with the guitar...until one day it transformed into music ;-)

I'm so commited that my other guitars are in their cases and in the closet...I want to do this so badly that I'm giving up "standard" playing until I can knock out a 12 bar blues and have it sound as good as if I were fingering the notes...yeah...I'm in for a long haul..lol :roll:

here is a neat trick that i use all the time. not really a trick, more of a sound-map, it works in open d or e. slide on 12th fret: fresh optimistic jubilation. slide on 5th and 7th fret with doublestops: sweet stuff. slide on 3dr fret: mean. slide on first string, all the way thru the major scale: melodies. wish i could show you this in person, but maybe it helps a little. eddie

Warren Haynes' Hot Licks DVD, "Electric Blues & Slide Guitar".

This was the catalyst for me as well. I'm not sure if his instruction was just incredibly lucid, or if it was a "right place, right time" sort of thing. In any event, it did the trick. I'm not a great slide player, but slide has been a part of my live and studio tool box for about the last five years. Finally.

I started screwing around with slide guitar in the 70's, sucked eggs at it for decades. I'm convinced that it's nearly as difficult to teach proper right and left hand damping as it is to learn it. It's a bit like riding a bike or swimming. We fall off the bike and bust our butts, or we nearly drown because we don't naturally swim well. We really want to do it, so we keep screwing with it. That's the natural order.


Here's the deal, as applies to me:


* I use standard 10-46 gauge strings on electric guitars with standard/medium action. I knew that if I had to pick up a specific guitar at a job in order to play slide, it simply wouldn't happen. Thus, I developed a light touch. I should say that the only thing that really works for me is a glass Dunlop 212 worn on the pinky (they're cheap). Glass is warmer (more forgiving) than brass, various metals, and even ceramics. I'm pretty careful with the low and high E strings (not atypical to that of applying an Ebow). Utilizing the slide on the pinky allows me the largest amount of 'standard' fingering options.

* Fourth interval double stops are key to sounding large with a slide.

* Not necessarily/strictly applicable to me, but for true intonation, the slide must rest directly above the fret wire.

* I'm not an alternate tunings junky, at least for live. Like I said, I mostly need to pick up the guitar and have at it, else it won't get picked up. I play mostly standard, drop D, and double drop D, and these are fairly quick moves.

* If I'm playing strictly slide, I'll slightly detune the B string. In a 'G' triad, the B string (3rd) always sounds a bit sharp within the imperfect intonation of a guitar, unless you detune it by ear. It's a trick of the trade that many dobro players call upon. This triad is sort of a big deal for playing slide. However, don't do this and expect to play a cowboy C chord and have it sound in tune - it won't.

* For electric slide guitar, I like having loads of gain and compression available. Most of the time, I keep the guitar's tone and volume knob settings toward the conservative side. Having that "extra" in reserve, that's the trick.

Dedicate a guitar to slide if you can. That way you can set the action up to whatever works for you. Mess with string gauges and action as needed. You may need to try a few different guitars for it.

Get a BUNCH of slides of different materials (glass, ceramic, brass, steel), try 'em on different fingers, see what works for YOU. Don't try to use a particular slide or material just because someone else did. Don't be afraid to try something "weird"... Duane Allman used a medicine bottle, Lowell George used a socket wrench, Bonnie Raitt puts the slide on her "flippin' finger"... they all just experimented until they found THEIR technique.

As for me, my slide technique breakthrough was to put the slide away and take up lap steel! I'm a pretty decent steel player now, but what little slide technique I once had has probably rotted away.

Personally, I like to use a LITTLE bit of overdrive to compress the tone a bit and make it sing. Too much actual distortion amplifies all those little squeaks and imperfections, too clean and it sounds dry and uneven. Some folks like compressors; try it! And I always, always use a bit of delay, mixed really low, just to fatten the tone and help notes trail away less abruptly. That's what works for me, anyway. You're a different person with different hands and ears and taste.

Alright guys, this is the scoop. I have been trying to get ahold of slide for a long time. I would say that Duane Allman is one of the biggest reasons that I play day to day, I just wish I could handle slide.

For the slide setup I use a Gibson Les Paul in open E, with a pyrex glass slide, straight through to a 212 Hot Rod Deville. I understand blocking strings, but I just can't seem to play anything natural. It all sounds "cartoonish" and flat out crappy.

I guess I just don't understand any of the technique with it. I can't do string changes, or combinations, and I have trouble getting strings to ring through without killing themselves.

Does anyone have some tipes or technique that I am missing? Or perhaps some good resources. Thanks

I've not played for nearly as long as others here, but I play about 2/3 of the time in open E tuning on slide and I get a lot of positive comments from more experienced players on my slide work, so maybe I'm not completely screwing it up. Take all my comments with a grain of salt though - I could be full of it as I'm self taught from records on slide.

My recommendation is to go back and listen to the early masters of the electric slide guitar - Muddy Waters and Elmore James. The great thing about those two are that you can hear the transition from the "Country Blues" sound all the way to rock and roll in two players. If you want a really gritty, mean Mississippi sound, just listen to how Mud would do a full step vibrato out of the five chord, sliding out of key on the way back to the one chord. Elmore is just flat-out rocking, and he uses a lot of simple techniques (spends a lot of time around the 12 fret, but does some really cool stuff with his right hand). They are the pith of slide blues to me.

+100 on high action and heavy strings.

There are a lot of useful slide techniques that seem to require having high action to do well. I like to have a good .8+cm at the 12. It can sound good for example to slide up on the high E and B while pressing down on the E more, so it goes a quarter tone sharper. Nothing stops one of those un-damped, wicked fast vibratos like clacking on frets... Also, you don't need as much in the way of effects (I use none at all) if you have more options on tone from your fingers that high action gives. If you listen to the early players who had a slide, they didn't do a lot of fretting above the 7 because the action was too high to stay in tune and too hard to fret.

I tried for years to learn slide with a pick, and I could never understand why I sounded like crap compared to Mud and Elmore. The secret (I think) is playing with your fingers so you can right hand damp, and also to use different attacks on the strings. You'll get a completely different sound by lifting up from under the strings and snapping than from a heavy thumb "thump" for example. I think this is one of the keys to getting expressive vocal-like sounds from slide.

Good luck with the slide.

Peace,
Josh

I play slide, that's why my tag is Sargeslide. Been sliding fer about 20 years now, and that's what people know me for. A few tips:

Practice moving the slide on and off of the high E, tip the slide a little bit away from you. After you kinda get that, practice the same thing with all the strings. Sliding onto and off of the neck is a difficult technique.

Try playing string against string- IE plucking the second and fouth when sliding into and out of chords, it gives different tones and feels to the song. Then try 1st and 3rd strings, 5th and 3rd- until you find some sweet tones you like. Do not slide up using all the strings- way overused, unless you are doing a Thruogood or Old blues tune, then people gotta hear it!

Finger damping is far more important if you finger pick. You have to place a fingertip on the unsed strings to kill them, this will give you a cleaner sound on the single string you are playing. If you fingerpick, it is not a long walk- rest your thumb across the lower 3 strings, rest your fingers on the upper three strings. Now, take the 3rd and fourth strings and pick them one at a time, while damping the other one, soon it get very easy- then go on to the other strings- Warren Haynes is a master of this technique

Never, ever play a chord dead on- slide into and out of chords.

Speed is not important- play slow, get feeling from your playing, put your soul into one note and let it ring- it will make everyone think your a tortured soul, and the chicks (Ladies) will love you! LOL, speed can come later

Everthing Crash said is right, when you are first starting out. After awhile you can slide on about any action, any string size, any slide and still get killer tone. I play Heavy Bottom/Light top strings, 10-52, and my action is low for a slider, because I use the same guitar for playing in standard. I still get killer tones! I have an advantage tho, I play slide all the time, so I can do that and get away with it.

Beleive it or not- if you know one tuning, you know all the popular ones used. The only thing that changes is what string you play your lick on. Example:
If I am in G tuning - and I play a lick on the second and third strings, In open E tuning, I would play the same lick on the 3rd and 4th strings, In Open C- the 1st and second strings. They are all related to one another.

Open D, capo 2nd fret= Open E
Open G, capo 2nd Fret= Open A
Open B, capo 1st fret= Open C

I know of a guy here that tunes all the strings to f, and slides like that, sounds great for chords!

Slide for me is easy, playing in standard is like brain surgery, I can do it, but I am not the best at it.

Have fun and play, eventually you will get it.

Anything else you wanna know-email me, I will try to keep it short
Sargeslide