Wiring is a butt...

Hopefully this will be the last issue I have with this guitar and can finally be at peace.

Just yesterday I received my Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro strat pup for the neck position in my CV Tele in the mail. My plan was to install it myself to save myself $50 and for the most part it went fine.

I followed this wiring diagram (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/7440801/Guitar%20Wiring/Tele%20Template%20Import2.jpg) which for the most part is exactly like my guitar aside from the fact that the neck pup ground wire
soldered to a little lug on the corner of the 3 way, and then another wire is connected from there to the back of the volume pot. I don't think this lug is connected to anything electronic. :confused:

I removed the old pickup and installed the new one just like it said to and it worked, the pickups is working and it sounds great, aside from two issues. (take into consideration I'm new to soldering)


1) Its buzzy as heck. I cannot get it grounded correctly it seems, the wire is touching a metal part from what I see but its still loud as hell.

Now I will say that my instrument cables are due for replacing so those could be playing a factor in the noise I'm getting, but, the new pickup buzzes much more than the bridge pickup and they're both single coils so I'm just lost.

2) The middle position is thin and weak, little sustain, ect...

Again, I installed everything as it says to, so I'm lost here too.


Please help. I'm determined to get this done myself, I'm tired of spending money, lol.

Thank you. :grin:

If your A2P is 4-wire, follow this diagram (http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=tele_1sing_1humneck).

If it is 2-wire, strip off a bit of the outer wire mesh from the center wire, but leave it connected.
Connect that to the back of the pot.
If you can't make it reach the back of the pot, twist that mesh together and solder another wire to it.
You might want to wrap that in electricians tape to keep it from grounding anywhere else.

Connect the other wire(the "black" one) to the first lug of the switch as shown.

Sounds like it might be out of phase with your bridge pickup. Try swapping the black and white wires

If your A2P is 4-wire, follow this diagram (http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=tele_1sing_1humneck).

If it is 2-wire, strip off a bit of the outer wire mesh from the center wire, but leave it connected.
Connect that to the back of the pot.
If you can't make it reach the back of the pot, twist that mesh together and solder another wire to it.
You might want to wrap that in electricians tape to keep it from grounding anywhere else.

Connect the other wire(the "black" one) to the first lug of the switch as shown.

Its 2-wire, but Im a little confused. The outer mesh of the ground wire looks like its just some sort of thick cloth material, solder THAT to the back of the pot?

Take a look at the underside of your neck pickup. One of the wires should be soldered to the cover (probably a little tab). That's the wire that has to go to the back of the pot. Make sure that's right, test it, then let us know if it's fixed.

The outer mesh of the ground wire looks like its just some sort of thick cloth material, solder THAT to the back of the pot?

No, you can't solder insulation. Only metal.

Take a look at the underside of your neck pickup. One of the wires should be soldered to the cover (probably a little tab). That's the wire that has to go to the back of the pot. Make sure that's right, test it, then let us know if it's fixed.

There is no cover, it's open, that's how it came.

OK, switch the two wires and see if that solves things.. That could be the answer... ;)

I'll try switching the wires but I don't see why that would work. I wired it the way everything said to, hot to the 3 way and ground to the volume pot.

Well, here's what it sounds like to me from what I've read.. The new pickup has no cover, so it will likely give you more hum-as the cover provides shielding. When you put both pickups on it sounds thin and wimpy, sounds like they are out of phase. You need to reverse the leads on one of the pickups to get them to play nicely together (reversing the polarity on one of 'em). Since the bridge pickup is original, it is probably wired correctly. The problem occurred when you replaced the neck pickup, and it is aftermarket- the easiest way for you to make it right is to swap the leads out and see if it gets better or worse when both pickups are activated.

When you put a Seymour Duncan pickup in a guitar alongside a Fender pickup, you have to switch the hot and ground connections from the SD pickup, or they'll be out of phase with each other. Hence your weak weedy tone in the middle position.

Its 2-wire, but Im a little confused. The outer mesh of the ground wire looks like its just some sort of thick cloth material, solder THAT to the back of the pot?
Ok, now I see.
I misread your first post and thought you had a humbucker pickup.
My bad.
Ok, forget what I said previously.

Your diagram is correct.
The white wire goes to the first lug of the switch.
The black goes to ground.

The CV Tele service manual is here (http://support.fender.com/service_diagrams/squier/Squier_ClassicVibe50s_Tele_SISD.pdf).

You're going to get more noise because that pickup is an uncovered Strat pup.
You'll need to put copper foil in the neck pickup cavity and on the underside of the pickguard around the neck pickup, if it isn't already there, to help shield it.

Before you do anything else, reflow the solder on your connections, being careful not to overheat the pot the black wire is connected to.

If it still sounds wimpy, then yes, reverse the wires so the white is going to the back of the pot and the black is going to the switch.

Sorry for the confusion.

^ Could you explain the shielding thing a bit more? I'm pretty much a noob with electronics.

^ Could you explain the shielding thing a bit more? I'm pretty much a noob with electronics.
There are two ways to get noise into guitar electronics. Improper grounding and outside interference.
Proper grounding, ie., bridge ground, backs of pots grounded to jack, etc. will take care of the noise you would get if touching the strings makes it go away.

Outside interference is caused by the strong electromagnetic energies in a typical home/studio. 60 cycle hum from TV's, monitors or lights is typical.
Your wah pedal/amp picking up the local radio station is another.

Moving around in a room will allow you to discover where the lowest amount of interference can be.

The easiest way to protect single coil pickups is to use either a Conductive Shielding Paint (http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Supplies:_Shielding/Conductive_Shielding_Paint.html?actn=100101&xst=2&xsr=i-3789) or copper foil (http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Supplies:_Shielding/Conductive_Copper_Tape.html?actn=100101&xst=2&xsr=i-3789). The liquid can be expensive and most good music stores will sell a copper foil kit (http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Electronics,_pickups/Supplies:_Shielding/Self-adhesive_Shielding_Kit.html?actn=100101&xst=2&xsr=i-3789) with instructions.
As Rich pointed out, the metal cover on a Tele neck pup provides both grounding and noise protection.

With single coils, however, you *will* get noise from outside interference.
Lollar talks about it here (http://www.lollarguitars.com/blog/tag/how-to-reduce-guitar-noise/).

The Guitarnuts "how to" page (http://www.guitarnuts.com/wiring/shielding/tele.php) for the Tele.

Stewmac on Guitar Shielding (http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Shielding/i-3789.html).

Youtube will have a bunch of videos demonstrating this as well.

I can't figure out wiring for guitars... I can solder the ground and input jack,but after that I am clueless to what goes where.

Great post, MojoMonster.

I would add that your first order of business would be to get your pickups working right. That way you can play your guitar and take your time digesting all the above referenced information. It can seem a little overwhelming at first, so it's better to read a bit, think it through, read it again.. you know, small bites.. In the meantime you can assess the performance of your instrument and make a good decision as to how far you need to take things. I would suggest the foil method over the grounding paint that Stew Mac carries. I've used both, and the copper is quick, neat, and quite effective. Their grounding paint works, but requires multiple coats, drying time- it's messy to deal with and expensive. There are better grounding paints out there, but those go up in price very quickly and you only would need a small amount.

IMHO swapping the two pickup leads is the first thing that needs to be done.

Yep. ;)

Its 2-wire, but Im a little confused. The outer mesh of the ground wire looks like its just some sort of thick cloth material, solder THAT to the back of the pot?

More times than not we overlook things, so a sound routine seems to do the trick even if we don't catch the cause...start again from the git..
1) desolder the pickup from the point that you would have uninstalled the original...
2) Solder all the solder points that exist in the path of the pickup...lugs,ground points, wires,etc...
3) join all the wires,twist up the leads so no frayeds touch outside its insulation to other contacts and solder the leads(tin them as its called)so to make a solid contact solder...pull a lil just make sure its solid..
4) follow diagrams to assure you're confident you didn't miss anything and then proceed on..color code your connections
Sounds like you have a lose solder contact and possibly a frayed wire contact...also you have prevented the out-of-phase problem... but that doesn't make the noise you described,usually a loose ground is the culprit or a stray wire or the wrong solder point...good luck!
BTW just a cable to the amp and tap the tip of the cable and see if theres any interference in the cable as well plugging the guitar in will intensify by a
degree of the total amps input divided by the pickups resistance usually 68k/5.6k-8k...thats alot of noise...
:cool:

...

Okay, I switched the wires and solved my middle position issue completely. And I must say, it sounds lovely. ;)

I'm still getting much more buzz from the neck than I normally do from the bridge, so that issue is still present.

The copper shielding thing has interested me, but would I really have to go to the trouble of shielding the entire control cavity as well? I really don't feel comfortable talking everything out of my guitar.

Just try to line the inside of your neck pickup cavity, and be sure to attach a small wire to the foil (you can use a tiny screw or solder- either way works). Run the new wire to the back of a pot, and that's it. The cavity didn't change, just the neck pickup. It's fast and easy. Glad you are on the right track. Good job. ;)

So the copper shielding wouldnt actually come into contact with the pickup, but still help eliminate noise?

I guess I just dont understand electronics...

Yes, that is correct. It acts as a shield. There's noise in the air, and you can't hear it- but your pickup can. Think of it like invisible rain, and you are building an invisible umbrella to keep your pickup as dry as you can..

Electrically your pickup does come into contact with it, via the ground- but don't sweat it. It's right, and it will help quiet it to a point.

The cover on a standard neck pickup is more effective, as it covers the top of your pickup. That's where the noise is strongest, and the cover would usually be grounded. Since you have no cover, you are still able to shield the pickup from the sides and bottom- but it is going to be a little buzzier. The trade-off is without a cover, your strings are "heard" more clearly by the pickup. It will amplify everything, both good and bad...

Makes sense, but why isnt the bridge pickup as noisy? It doesnt look covered to me, but maybe I dont really understand the anatomy of pickups either, lol.

It's sitting on a grounded plate, surrounded by a grounded bridge plate. Now you want to do something along those lines to the neck pickup. It WILL help.

I'm not doubting you, I just want to be sure I understand everything, lol.

So, line the neck cavity and the pickguard with the foil, then attach a wire from the copper to the back of a pot? Simple as that?

Yep. Run the foil up over the edge of the cavity if you want, so it contacts the foil on the backside of the pickguard. That way you only need one wire. A second option is to just run a short, thin wire from under the pickguard back under the end of the control plate. Make sure the foil on the pickguard is in good contact with the foil in the cavity. The control plate is grounded, so everything that touches it will be grounded, too. In this case, you don't need to run a wire to a pot, as it will make a mechanical connection to ground via the control plate. Same thing, just a different way to do it.. ;)

Is there a specific kind of wire I'd want to get?

Not really- a little scrap of the lead wire from a pickup will do the trick. Just be sure to strip the insulation at the contact points. I will often use a bare wire, as long as it is not presenting a danger of shorting anything out. A 20 or 22 gauge works well, but it isn't critical.

Got my copper tape in the mail this morning from StewMac and...


...IT WORKED!

Amazingly actually, this guitar is now fully functional, buzz free and sounding freaking fantastic!

Thank you all so much for the help. :D

Good news. Glad it worked out for you.