An Open Letter To All Pedal Builders/Manufacturers......

Please have a meeting, everyone included, and come to a consensus on where the 9v/18v input should be on "ALL" pedals made on Earth You did it with the input and output (except the damn FuzzFace). My daisy chained "One Spot" looks like spaghetti when I'm done hooking up.:mrgreen::mrgreen:

Good one!

I prefer input and output jacks on the SIDES of my pedals. But most of my favorite pedals have 'em on the back.

They do it just to mess with me, I know it.

I think Boss got it right... ergonomic,functional,indestructable

And some sort of universal mounting system too. Velcro is so 1900s.

Standard power inputs, place all audio input/output at the sides and at the same height, and maybe decide about an standard size and dimensions. Something like the planned standardization on cell phone chargers.

That would be great and would only require minor changes on non standard pedals. There could be some sign to let buyers know, like a "Standard equipment" sticker.

PS. I know this may not be the place for this, but a "no blue led is allowed here" could be also a great standard.

Input and output on sides.

Power on the back.

Makes it tidy and simple.

I love blue LED's..........freaky cool. :shock

In defense of manufacturers, some of these things are not so easy (if not physically impossible) to do.

...If it is a really small MXR-sized enclosure, putting the D.C. jack on the back is a tough one. Folks don't realize that the jack is about .5" long in most cases, and would "collide" with the pot bodies, unless you don't mind those being relocated to a "non-standard" position.

For the above reason, MXR still has the D.C. jack on the side, even on something like the Carbon Copy.

With the small pedals that do have the D.C. jack on the back, it is because they use mini-pots with "standoffs" that clear the jack. And - they typically use a board mounted jack, which can sometimes fail at the solder joints. So do you want layout or durability?

The "interior space game" goes on and on. With the enclosure size that is "one larger" from the MXR-sized boxes, the D.C. jack can usually easily be located on the back, and full sized pots can even be used!

...But the issue of footswitch location, battery location, and in/out jacks is always one of interior space. It all has to fit w/o colliding. With mass produced pedals, there is obviously a desired layout that works with the machines that do the assembling, or the machines that do the sub-assemblies (jacks/pots/switch/etc. mounted directly on circuitboard).

So if someone wanted standards/compliancy, it would drive up the price significantly. In the case of massive companies, they would have to re-tool. In the case of the hand builder, they may be forced to find different components, like the board mounted D.C. jack that can tear the solder joints. And - the box would have to be "notched" for a rectangular cutout instead of a round hole for the round style "standard" D.C. jack on the hand built stuff.

Check out the latest Timmy pedals. Paul C. moved the jack to the backside, but it looks like the footswitch has been moved "way down" to allow the battery to go in between the footswitch and in/out jacks. Paul also used to use open frame Switchcraft/Neutrik jacks, and may have to use those enclosed plastic body style ones like in Boss pedals.

So there are always concessions to be made from a manufacturing point of view, unless you don't mind a big box with lots of interior clearance. So that can cause another issue in itself.

But I do wholeheartedly agree about losing those daggone blue LED's! Some other superbrite color can be used, but not that one, IMO. Too blinding, and a bit "past the fad stage" IMO. But that is obviously super subjective, and has nothing to do with manufacturing.

Pop the backs off some of your pedals sometime, and look at how some of them are almost packed in like sardines. Part of the reason that Boss can lay things out like they do is because:

- they have a "unique" enclosure

- the buffered bypass switch takes up much less space

- the circuitboard "sits on the bottom"

Something that is a little more important to me is getting the status LED up as close to the "top" of the box as possible, especially since a lot of pedals don't use a bezel or anything - much easier to spill something into that slot. At the very least, if the LED is mounted anywhere near the switch, it should have a bezel. But again, that means the pedal can't just "slide together" quickly on assembly, and time is money. The pedal company would probably charge you more, both for the bezel and the extra labor.

I prefer input and output jacks on the SIDES of my pedals. But most of my favorite pedals have 'em on the back.

They do it just to mess with me, I know it.

I prefer all voltage input on top .keeps board clean..especially for daisy chain.
no messy 1/4 and volttage wires mixed on side of stomps..!

Yea voltage on top, in/out 1/4 on sides.....

Since we are dreaming...

I'd like to see the criminalization of ALL surface mount control and IO jacks. I'd also like the option to buy them at a reduced cost and put them in my own enclosures, with connections made on mini Molex screw down type connections mounted on the board...a quasi-Cornish approach.

While we are still dreaming, every effect sold from hence forward should be mandated true bypass, much like RoHS...(except it would work)

Please have a meeting, everyone included, and come to a consensus on where the 9v/18v input should be on "ALL" pedals made on Earth You did it with the input and output (except the damn FuzzFace). My daisy chained "One Spot" looks like spaghetti when I'm done hooking up.:mrgreen::mrgreen:

It should be on the top (aka back), all the time. There is plenty of room to put in a full size jack even in the small boxes provided you plan ahead for it and either allow for a small notch in the PCB or use the externally mounted DC jacks with the nut on the outside. PCB mounted power jacks are an invitation to trouble and are very susceptible to fatigue and breakage. Power jacks end up on the sides most times simply because that's the easiest place to put it and that spot is a chunk of space in the pedal that you likely won't use for anything anyway. It also makes doing the PCB design easier as you have a bit more space to work with but if you plan ahead you can have the power jack on the top and easily fit you circuit on the PCB as well.

A couple other things that irk me are the draft angle on most enclosures that prevents me from using those really short 1/4" to 1/4" solid connectors. I suppose I could make up some sort of shim to even out the angle of it but that's too much of a hassle.

Battery power. It's time has come and gone. Some relics of the past belong in the past, this is one of them. Having no battery frees up a ton of real estate in the pedal for better layouts and more elaborate circuits.

Putting the footswitch very close to the knobs. They're stompboxes, not "look down and carefully press the switch with my shoe so I don't mess up my settings" boxes. Also PCB mounted LED's to the left or right of the footswitch as sooner or later your foot will slip and land on it.

They also should say in their publicity and package: "this pedal is a ts-9 with the added cxxx", or "this is just the better version of that other pedal from our line, we just don't want to stop selling them", "this is not a jtm-45!", "if this were transparent, you wouldn't be able to step on it"…

Seriously, it's so nice to read from a pedal builder "this is our take on the fuzz face". Openly.

And it would be even nicer to read "we created this from scratch, it may sound like crap but at least we tried something different".

WOW! I'm having a hard time distinguishing between wishing and griping here. Maybe we should also have a uniform paint scheme - green for overdrive, etc. and formal specs for logo placement and size/font of other prinitng.

OP - just tape/velcro the loose wires to your board. I have all my excess 1-Spot leads taped under mine.

Or...

Buy all your pedals from one manufacturer.

Or...

DIY.

My vote is to allow the manufacturers to make whatever kind of pedal they want and then let us pedal buyers choose. Hopefully, where the 9v input is or how bright the LED is shouldn't be as important as what the frackin' pedal actually sounds like.

+ yea, we need to have a pedal revolution...get our needs finally met.....LOL

example1
have different color led come on by a switch, one for sunny outside stages, one for small dark coffee shops...

I like everything on top all of the time. That being said, i dont really care and most of my pedals have em on the sides. Whatever.

And some sort of universal mounting system too. Velcro is so 1900s.

good one :idea:

perhaps some sort of bayonet mount.

I love the sound of my Dano (Cool Cat) TOD, but any other design is better than that! Too much stuff (knobs, jacks, adapter) going on in the 'back'.

I do like IN/OUT jacks on the sides and 9V on the back, a la Boss, or small Biyangs, but since I keep a low pedal count on the board, it's not a huge deal with me.

There is plenty of room to put in a full size jack even in the small boxes provided you plan ahead for it...

Hmm...plan ahead...

Now there is a concept!

For the big companies, this might just be Step One, unless their tooling doesn't allow for it. Or they may have purchase a few thousand of the "wrong" type of D.C. jacks that don't allow for that fit.

But the little guys are probably focusing more on getting a certain sound first, and D.C. jack location second. The circuitboards or other construction that they commit to might have their hands tied for any sort of reasons.

You mentioned keeping stuff away from the stomp mechanism. Part of the way to help ensure that is by keeping the knobs/pots as far from the switch as possible, which means as close to the top as possible.

I've seen more than a few mishaps with that jack with the nut on the outside, even with it mounted at the top of the box. It will usually happen during the load/unload, but there's just no telling. To get max interior space means having that thing protrude outside the box as much as possible - something lands on the male D.C. jack tip, and the interior jack mechanisms get messed up. IMO, the D.C. jack should be as flush with the box as possible.

And the truth be told, if the D.C. jack is close enough to the input or output jack, a 90° connector that will allow you to run the plug under the in or out jack could actually save it from harm, provided the input/ouput jacks are stout enough to take the brunt. And that is a good case for the bulky Switchcraft/Neutrik type jacks with the open bodies, and they are space hogs. But - they are tough as nails.

The bottom line is that it's all a tradeoff, and it assumes a lot about any manufacturer as to why something wasn't done in a completely standard way. I know there are parts of the world where getting certain components is really prohibitive for whatever reason.

We could actually keep tearing this apart for a loooong time. Some folks will start getting into washer type, or even knob size/fastening method. Some is manufacturer preference, and some is due to constraints that may not be relevant to anyone.

How about an annual half off sale?

I don't have a huge problem with the different locations of the jacks. Builders have to do what they have to do.

The thing that does bug me is internal trim pots and dim switches. I know the goal is to fit as much as possible in a small box and appease all customers. I just hate having to unvelcro my pedal, unscrew the bottom plate, move a lever, and put it back together. Make the box bigger so I can tweak from the top.

Input and output on sides.

Power on the back.

Makes it tidy and simple.

I love blue LED's..........freaky cool. :shock

Exactly what I would say.

I never really liked red LED's so I swapped out every one on my board for blue ones!!

I didn't know anybody liked the blue LED's!





I'd take red any day of the week over blue!

BLUE!!!!!!

all connectors on top, so you can shove 'em all together like on the top row of my board:

http://s2.i1.picplzthumbs.com/upload/img/de/60/96/de60963f1e086754393e299afc40ecaa7cdb5aa3_wmlg_0000 1.jpg

all connectors on top, so you can shove 'em all together like on the top row of my board:

http://s2.i1.picplzthumbs.com/upload/img/de/60/96/de60963f1e086754393e299afc40ecaa7cdb5aa3_wmlg_0000 1.jpg

HEY?! Where did you get the Super Comp with top mounted input and DC jacks?

HEY?! Where did you get the Super Comp with top mounted input and DC jacks?

He turned the pedal on its side... :shock:

HEY?! Where did you get the Super Comp with top mounted input and DC jacks?

it's sideways.

When you think about it, it's pretty amazing that things are as standardized as they are. I mean, isn't it kind of incredible that you can use the same cable to plug into a 1955 Fender Deluxe as you would to plug into a brand new Line 6?

It seems like every time I buy a new external hard drive, it requires a different cord to connect to my computer, and forget about standardization on power supplies on those things!

it's sideways.

OK good, because I was going to ask who did the custom paint. :roll:

To the op...you could always go with all BOSS pedals. They are all the exact same size and layout (except for the few double pedals they make) and there are tons to choose from. Yes, BOSS has some crappy pedals, but they have at least ONE really good pedal of each type. Mind you, I don't use any BOSS but it's just personal preference.

And for the record, I hate the DC jack on the side that most of the boutique guys like to do. Yes, it has actually caused me to take a pass on a few pedals.

Having said all that, my biggest gripe from a functionality point is stomping on the pedal and messing up the knob settings in the middle of a song. I'm a singer and often don't have time to look down so I stomp blindly. This can happen if the switch is too close to the knobs or if the knobs are too loose. But it's mostly a result of those annoying little switches that everybody uses these days. BOSS does it right, as does Digitech and even Ibanez with their Tone-Lok series...they use a big fat chunk of steel to cover the switch so you can stomp it without having to take aim first.

After all...they are STOMP boxes aren't they?

Gripe over. :mrgreen:

JMHO

This is why I like side jacks:

http://www.audiogear.com/Resources/AdptQmQmoff.jpg

Shortest possible "cable" run.