CAGED System

hello there !

can some one explain to me what is the CAGED system?

In its basic form, it is just a scale system, which associates the different major scales with chord shapes. The chord shapes are C, A, G, E, and D, hence the name. All systems of learning scales are about the same; there are only so many ways of playing the major scale, say, on the guitar. There are some variations about stuff like how many forms do you break it down into, and do you play this note reaching down a fret on the high E, or up a fret on the B string. Stuff like that.

A google search of CAGED system will give plenty of links to explain the system. Many of them will also advertise books that cover the subject, but you can glean a lot of very useful free information from the links.

There are lots of books and on-line material. They all basically break the Pentatonics down to chord forms, or just forms in general for the Pents. on the Fretboard. The most user friendly book for me was "Fretboard Logic", however, there are plenty to choose from. For me "CAGED" helped me grasp the minor/major Pentatonics and got my foot in the door for beginning to play leads. I think it's a good thing.....but it's just a start.

To add to what the others have said, using the CAGED forms are easier to understand than the old method which was the term "Form" (ie: Form 1, Form 2, etc.). The CAGED method outlines the open chords and it can be moved up the fretboard by a barre where the nut would be. You can use the CAGED method also to outline the location of a your octaves, build scales, use it to familiarize yourself with arps as well as other applications.

Somebody correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Joe Pass used the CAGED system extensively. If so, it seemed to work pretty well for him.

Somebody correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Joe Pass used the CAGED system extensively. If so, it seemed to work pretty well for him.

They all did. They just used the term "Form" instead of the word CAGED.

They all did. They just used the term "Form" instead of the word CAGED.

Exactly, 'caged' as a term wasn't popularly coined until the 80's - maybe the late 70's? By the time I'd even heard about it I already knew all those chord and scale forms and how they related.
*It's funny, I actually wouldn't be able to describe caged to you in systematic way - I don't really know it's complete ins and outs.

When we discussed this a while back I did a video of it.

I1WmKr4dDXg&

Here's my way of describing it. This is a compilation of posts I've made in the past on CAGED. Maybe you can find something in here that will be of use to you.

------------------------

CAGED describes the naturally occurring pattern that exists on the fretboard in standard tuning. Whether you are aware of the CAGED pattern or not you are using it while playing because it's how the guitar is designed. You cannot not use it. You can be unaware that you are using it though.

THe letters "C,A,G,E,D" refer to the open position chords that we all know down around the first few frets of the guitar. The CAGED system shows how those same chord shapes can be moved up and down the guitar neck.

Personally I think it's much more useful to think of CAGED as octave shapes but usually it's taught as chord shapes which I think does it a great disservice. If you begin by learning CAGED as octave shapes then you can see quickly that it applies not only to chords but also scales and arppeggios and licks and phrases etc. Because CAGED describes the 'architecture' of the fretboard it is applicable to any aspect of music.

Once you begin to see this pattern in numerous keys, all over the neck it really quickly opens up your playing and understanding of the guitar. It's like having a roadmap that allows you to see exactly where you are and where you are going so it drastically reduces the probability of getting lost on the fretboard and dramatically increases the probablity that you can play what you are hearing in your head.

Some people will argue that CAGED is simply one way of organizing the fretboard and they will talk about using arppeggios and intervals etc. as a method of navigating the fretboard but what they arent' understanding is that those are simply smaller sub-patterns of CAGED. CAGED is the master pattern that determines the shape and location of intervals, arppeggios, scales and chords.


CAGED is more than just one way to see the guitar out of many other ways. It is the map of how the architecture of the fretboard is laid out in standard tuning.

Let's be clear. CAGED is not a musical concept or music theory. It is a very clear and concise map of the guitar fretboard.

So comparing it to learning scales for instance as a way of learning the fretboard is not an appropriate comparison. Scales are a musical concept. CAGED is not.

CAGED is simply a physical mapping of the fretboard. It's not interpretive, it's literal. In fact I think of CAGED as a meta-map. It's the master map that all other maps, such as major scales, are simply sub-catagories or sub-divisions of.

I think the most useful way to begin seeing CAGED is with octave shapes. That's the most basic map of CAGED and in my opinion by far the most useful.

Many people seem to have the limited notion that CAGED is strictly about moving open chord shapes up and down the neck. I think this is the most limiting and the least useful notion of what CAGED is.

Learn the 5 CAGED octave shapes first and it will set you free!!

After that you can begin moving chords and scales around the fretboard using CAGED and it will all look very logical, connected and systematic.


Here's a view of the octave shapes in the cowboy chord area of the fretboard


http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt71/boneyguy2/FIVECAGEDSHAPES.jpg

Here's a G major scale. Using the 5 octave shapes I've shown above you should be able to see all 5 octave shapes within this G major scale. (You could think of these shapes as outlining the modes of the G major scale if your inclined to think that way.) Two shapes will be repeated of course because a major scale has 7 notes.

http://www.guitarlessons.com/media/guitar-lessons/chord-charts/g-major-scale-second-finger.jpg

[nice description deleted ]

Here's a G major scale. Using the 5 octave shapes I've shown above you should be able to see all 5 octave shapes within this G major scale. (You could think of these shapes as outlining the modes of the G major scale if your inclined to think that way.) Two shapes will be repeated of course because a major scale has 7 notes.


Hmm...I just see 3 shapes in that picture. The "G" shape of course, with the root on the E strings, the "E" shape with the root on the D string, and the "A" shape, with the 3 open strings.

I should probably go back and look at the CAGED system, because I never thought about it in terms of the major scale, so much - just chords. And once I learned the shapes of triads on the different string sets, I forgot about CAGED as a reference; it didn't seem necessary.

Hmm...I just see 3 shapes in that picture. The "G" shape of course, with the root on the E strings, the "E" shape with the root on the D string, and the "A" shape, with the 3 open strings.

I should probably go back and look at the CAGED system, because I never thought about it in terms of the major scale, so much - just chords. And once I learned the shapes of triads on the different string sets, I forgot about CAGED as a reference; it didn't seem necessary.

Have a closer look. Each note in that G scale will be a part of one of the 5 CAGED shapes. The 'trick' is to see octave shapes as I've described above and then you will easily see the CAGED shapes everywhere.

Gosh. This is like the blind men and the elephant, each having a different description according to his perspective.

For me, like for boneguy, CAGED is a fretboard map. There are five distinct major-scale fingering patterns, each with distinct major-scale octave shapes. I know there are distinct chord patterns in each one, but I don't know what they are--aside from the one chord that names each pattern--and that each pattern will produce a chord in the same relationship to the tonic chord, no matter what key's being played.

MY blind-man's perspective on the system is different: the sequence of the letters--CAGED--describes the sequence in which the patterns chain-link together and repeat indefinitely, and each individual letter--C, A, G, E, D--names the scale pattern that plays in its key, closest to the nut. Shift down a fret and play B, Ab, F#, Eb, C# scale (and chord) patterns; shift up a fret and play C#, Bb, Ab, F, and Eb patterns. Lucky for us the acronym CAGED is so easy to remember. Anyway, for me, remembering the sequence is the thing that allows me to play in any given key up and down the fretboard, something I could not do before someone showed me the patterns.

There are lots of books and on-line material. They all basically break the Pentatonics down to chord forms, or just forms in general for the Pents. on the Fretboard. The most user friendly book for me was "Fretboard Logic", however, there are plenty to choose from. For me "CAGED" helped me grasp the minor/major Pentatonics and got my foot in the door for beginning to play leads. I think it's a good thing.....but it's just a start.
So what would your next step be? i know the first pattern of the major scale and caged. where would you recommend going after that

It is just an easy way to visualize the major scale patterns on the neck when soloing.

Kinda like the minor pentatonic box is used in blues soloing.

You could also used the CAGED system for blues/minor soloing, but you need to remember to play in the relative major key...whick kinda gets dicey for me.

FWIW, I never play in a different key from the one the song is in. If a song is in Am, I solo in Am, not C.

It is just an easy way to visualize the major scale patterns on the neck when soloing.

.

That is simply one application of the pattern that CAGED is. That's certainly not all it is.

To make it sound classier, I pronounce it "cah-JHAY".

To make it sound classier, I pronounce it "cah-JHAY".

Poseur!!!:mrgreen:

Boney - I've looked again, and I still don't understand how all your octave shapes are in that one pattern. As I understand the system (and could be wrong), let me expand the CAGED system starting at the nut for G major:

------
xxgGgx open A shape
xxxxxx
xgxxxx
GxxxxG 3 G shape
xxxgxx
xgGxxx 5 E shape
xxxgxg
xxxxGx 7 D shape
xxgxxx
xGxxxx 9 C shape

If my ascii survives, you can see I've got to go clear to the 9th fret to show all the chords, or 'octave shapes' (I've capitalized each "G" note in the major triad that makes up the CAGED system). Yet your pattern only shows notes on 4 frets.

I'm not trying to be pedantic - either I'm not understanding your point, or I'm missing something.

boo, the octave shapes boney's talking about are, in terms of strings:

C shape = 5th to 2nd
A shape = 5th to 3rd
G shape = 6th to 3rd to 1st
E shape = 6th to 4th to 1st
D shape = 4th to 2nd

All those octaves are represented in the represented G major scale thusly:
C shape ~ D to D
A shape ~ B to B, C to C
G shape ~ A to A to A
E shape ~ G to G to G, plus a partial of F# to F#, because he started the scale at the 3rd fret of the 6th string
D shape ~ E to E

All seven notes of the scale are represented in the octave shapes.

Is this any more clear?

Boney - I've looked again, and I still don't understand how all your octave shapes are in that one pattern. As I understand the system (and could be wrong), let me expand the CAGED system starting at the nut for G major:


The problem you're having seeing it is the result of how CAGED is typically taught. It's not your fault! It's.. not... your.... fault.:mrgreen:

It's almost always taught as chord shapes that encompass 6 or 5 strings or as scale positions. I'm trying to point out to folks that it's so much more useful and applicable than that when you begin to see the octaves that actually define each shape.


The diagram shows the ocave shapes (CAGED shapes) within one scale form .

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/4930/cagedwithinmajscaleposi.jpg (http://img834.imageshack.us/i/cagedwithinmajscaleposi.jpg/)

Note - - CAGED shape
F#/ G - - E shape -
A - - - - G shape
B/C - - - A shape
D - - - - C shape
E - - - - D shape

Do you see it now?

It should also become apparent now that CAGED also applies to modes, right? Not just major scales that are visually referenced from the low E string.

The CAGED octaves are everywhere and are equally applicable to any arpeggio, any scale or any mode.

EDIT: Thanks JB. Good explanation. You beat me to it while I was busy making the above diagram.

I never knew what the caged thing was until I started participating here (I may have heard about it prior - ?). I don't use it because as I mentioned in a prior post I already know where all my $h1t is on my geetar neck. But having said that and after reading several of Boneyguy's excellent posts on the subject I'd recommend listening to what he says about the octave shapes. That is how I learned to get around the fretboard and still kinda how I relate 'some' things to each other.
*I use other intervals though too. After you get that octave junk nailed down then you wanna be able to see all your 5ths/4ths ... then minor 3rd's, etc.

Whoa. Thanks Boney and JB.

This is totally not how I understood the CAGED system, you're right. I'd just been seeing CAGED as a way to form that *same* chord up and down the neck.

Must...digest. I do now see how all those octave shapes for the notes in the scale can be found in the scale pattern(s); now I have to understand this in context.

Whoa. Thanks Boney and JB.

This is totally not how I understood the CAGED system, you're right. I'd just been seeing CAGED as a way to form that *same* chord up and down the neck.

Must...digest. I do now see how all those octave shapes for the notes in the scale can be found in the scale pattern(s); now I have to understand this in context.

Cool. I'm glad we were able to help a bit. Have fun with it!!

And thanks for your kind words Ken.

I like the octave explanation for visualising the fretboard. The best book out there for this is "FretBoard Workbook" by Barrett Tagliarino.
The very first lesson in the book is the octave pattern, he calls it the root note matrix. Everything else will be easier seen by recognising these patterns.

Great chart, boneyguy. Once I drew out the five scale patterns, staying in the same key, I guess, in sequence up the neck, and numbered the major scales within them--T, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7--giving each numbered position a different symbol (square, octagon, triangle, etc.) as you did. The shapes jumped out at me, and I know the chords would, too, if I studied them a bit. I still haven't internalized them all, I admit, but the symbols help me see them. I wish I had a computer program to draw them as you've drawn yours.

What else is fun, is that if you drop the 4s and 7s notes from each of these patterns, you see some familiar-looking pentatonic patterns, so you don't have to learn those scales quite so separately.

Just to check: following your G diagram to the next pattern (E) past it, won't the A octave pattern be shaped exactly like the F# pattern in your diagram, and the Bb one just like the G in yours?

I spin my own head sometimes with all this, but I'm beginning to be able to "sing" tunes up and down the neck, and "see" individual strings vertically without counting C, A, G. . . . Someday I'll be a real guitar player.

So what would your next step be? i know the first pattern of the major scale and caged. where would you recommend going after that
I'm officially a beginner/intermediate and am just now getting down the "CAGED", but am working on knowing which forms for which Pent. in what Key, for instance for the Key of "A" and starting at the 5th fret, I know what I call "G form" will work for the A minor Pent.,(1,3b,4,5,7b,back to 1...x2 and with a 3b tossed in at the end), if I'm using the A Maj, scale and that will be ACDEGA,again x2 ending with a C. Since the major is 1 1/2 steps down, I know the "E form" will work for major Pent,(1,2,3,5,6 back to 1), again x2 and ending with B and will be (A,B,C#,E,F#,A). Now I know that "G form is the point of Ref. for the Minor Pent. and "E form" the major Pent. for the 5th& 6th Fret. I confirm by playing a A5 power chord on the 5th fret for the 6th string and also play the A5 power chord on the 12th fret 5th string to get my bearings for the "C form" for minor Pent.. Anywho, now I can work my "CAGED" forms up and down the Frets depending on what Key I'm in. Works pretty slick.
For my next act though....and in answer to your question.....I want to learn and add in th "5th Flat" to learn the Blues scales and just work on scales in general, (Dorian's, Myxylodian's) as I'm stuck with Pents at this point and have no idea what those terms even mean.
Good luck! this was kind of a fun break through for me to begin to grasp the Fretboard and it's definitely just the beginning.

Exactly, 'caged' as a term wasn't popularly coined until the 80's - maybe the late 70's? By the time I'd even heard about it I already knew all those chord and scale forms and how they related.
*It's funny, I actually wouldn't be able to describe caged to you in systematic way - I don't really know it's complete ins and outs.

I heard of it in the 90's. For me it was the term "Form" in the 70's and 80's. In fact the GP articles all used the term "Form" as well. When I taught guitar in the mid to late 80's, I used that term as well when explaining. However teaching in 2000's (I don't teach much now) made it easier for me to convey the concept to younger beginners as they could spell to word and retain the information better.

As for a systematic way of looking at the fretboard, just the word "CAGED" to find all of the octave locations starting at open C. The rest are just fretboard block learning after that.

http://www.guitar-chords.org.uk/scales-images/cmajorscalepatterns.gif

The problem you're having seeing it is the result of how CAGED is typically taught. It's not your fault! It's.. not... your.... fault.:mrgreen:

It's almost always taught as chord shapes that encompass 6 or 5 strings or as scale positions. I'm trying to point out to folks that it's so much more useful and applicable than that when you begin to see the octaves that actually define each shape.


The diagram shows the ocave shapes (CAGED shapes) within one scale form .

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/4930/cagedwithinmajscaleposi.jpg (http://img834.imageshack.us/i/cagedwithinmajscaleposi.jpg/)

Note - - CAGED shape
F#/ G - - E shape -
A - - - - G shape
B/C - - - A shape
D - - - - C shape
E - - - - D shape

Do you see it now?

It should also become apparent now that CAGED also applies to modes, right? Not just major scales that are visually referenced from the low E string.

The CAGED octaves are everywhere and are equally applicable to any arpeggio, any scale or any mode.

EDIT: Thanks JB. Good explanation. You beat me to it while I was busy making the above diagram.

i dont undertand the diagram where are the chapes ? i dont see it
i feel like i am reading japanese , suddenly rocket science seem very easy compare to this

I heard of it in the 90's. For me it was the term "Form" in the 70's and 80's. In fact the GP articles all used the term "Form" as well. When I taught guitar in the mid to late 80's, I used that term as well when explaining. However teaching in 2000's (I don't teach much now) made it easier for me to convey the concept to younger beginners as they could spell to word and retain the information better.

As for a systematic way of looking at the fretboard, just the word "CAGED" to find all of the octave locations starting at open C. The rest are just fretboard block learning after that.

http://www.guitar-chords.org.uk/scales-images/cmajorscalepatterns.gif

what are the black dots?

^ Those black dots are the root note of the scale. In this case, every black dot is a C.

i confused has hell, this frustrated me alot bc i cannot understand this.

^ Those black dots are the root note of the scale. In this case, every black dot is a C.

Which are also the 'octave' shapes/positions.

what is the relation ? what scales , root of the scales have to do with CAGED?

I AM FRUSTRATED ALOT !!!! i about to turn green and smash my guitar

what is the relation ? what scales , root of the scales have to do with CAGED?

what scales -- major scales. The last image was an illustration of scales in C major.

root of the scales have to do with CAGED -- it helps to illustrate most any fingering to identify where the roots are. That's all.

I AM FRUSTRATED ALOT !!!! i about to turn green and smash my guitar

Whoa! If you can play scales up the neck, you know there is more than one way to skin that cat. CAGED is just one of the methods to systematize that. Nothing more.

Take a look at that image again:

http://www.guitar-chords.org.uk/scales-images/cmajorscalepatterns.gif

Play what's written there. Again the black dots are the roots. There are there for the same reason "you are here" is indicated on the map at the mall.

All you have in that image is five different ways to play the C major scale, working your way up the neck. If you do any pentatonic playing, you're aware of boxes. These are boxes for a seven note scale instead of a five note scale.

if i learn all the notes of the fret board it will be better then the CAGED thing?

if i learn all the notes of the fret board it will be better then the CAGED thing?

Apples and oranges.

One should know the fretboard no matter what you do on that fretboard -- you should know the fretboard even if all you do is play slide.

The CAGED system is one system among others, but it is popular. It shows you where the notes for a scale are, around different positions on the neck. For example, if you where playing the D major chord xx7775, the CAGED system shows you the notes of the D major scale around that position so you could play in D there and not shift elsewhere on the neck, say, if you were only comfortable with fewer fingerings.

if i learn all the notes of the fret board it will be better then the CAGED thing?

The system CAGED or any other system of putting theory or methods together into an organized manner are always just personal to the player. The bottom line is to just make music. If you have the desire to learn theory, it will help you understand what you are doing and can be used to develop new challenges. However it will not help you to improve the way you play unless you practice. You gotta put the theory under the fingers and try it. It is best to grasp small pieces at a time rather than be thrown into the bucket of information when you can't sort it out.

The CAGED system is one system among others, but it is popular.

Well, not really. I've tried to address this notion a few times but the thing I'm trying to point out keeps getting lost I think.

CAGED is not a system per se and is not the equivalent of other organizational views.

CAGED is the map that shows how to apply musical information on the fretboard in a patterned and predictable manner.

CAGED is not a musical idea. It is a direct mapping of the fretboard. It has no other application musically like scales do. It is a model of how the actual architecture of the fretboard is designed. It is guitarcentric and not applicable to other instruments in the way scales are because it is not an organizing principle of music like scales are.


So CAGED is the meta pattern that dictates how everything works on the fretboard including scales, intervals, chords, arppegios.

In actuality the true master pattern of the fretboard is the open string tuning and that's what sets the pattern for CAGED.

CAGED is the equavlent of a map of a city. It simply shows the design of the place but makes no attempt to show the activities that take place within that design. Of course those activities (scales, chords etc) conform to the 'shape' of the place (CAGED) but they are not the equivalent of the place itself.

So when a person believes they are using scales or intervals or diminished triad shapes to organize and navigate the fretboard they are only sort of right because in fact it's the CAGED pattern that's creating the patterns that they're seeing in those scales etc.

Using particular scales, chords, arpeggios etc is a choice. Using the pattern that CAGED describes is not. Being aware that we're all using it all the time is another matter.

..... I wish I had a computer program to draw them as you've drawn yours.



This is what I'm using.

http://www.neckdiagrams.com/

Oteul -- be careful, because there are two kinds of diagrams on this page using CAGED.

Boney is showing a different way to use CAGED -- to show the octave relationships between all the notes IN the G Major scale. G to G, A to A, etc. This confused the hell out of me, too.

The way most of us ( I think ) learned the CAGED system is in the diagram Modern Saint posted. Do you see how each pattern contains at least one C-major chord? ie, the first pattern has the 'C' as you'd finger it in the open position, the next pattern has the "A" shape ( 5th fret -> xxcccx ) the next pattern has the 'G' shape, as you'd finger it in open position, etc.

Ignoring the major scale aspect, this makes it very easy -- if you're not that familiar with the neck -- to be able to play chords up and down. Start with an "E" in open position.
_____
|||x||
|xx|||
||||||

So that's E in "E"

Move up the neck...Now the E chord will look like a "D"

||||||
||||||
||||||
|||x|x
||||x|
||||||

Move up, now E will look like a "C" (it's going to share the same root note as the "D" pattern)

||||||
||||||
||||||
||||||
||||x|
||x|||
|x||||
||||||

And so on - the next will look like an "A" shape, then "G", then we repeat the whole pattern.

I heard of it in the 90's. For me it was the term "Form" in the 70's and 80's. In fact the GP articles all used the term "Form" as well. When I taught guitar in the mid to late 80's, I used that term as well when explaining. However teaching in 2000's (I don't teach much now) made it easier for me to convey the concept to younger beginners as they could spell to word and retain the information better.

As for a systematic way of looking at the fretboard, just the word "CAGED" to find all of the octave locations starting at open C. The rest are just fretboard block learning after that.



The only objection I have to the word 'form' is that it is not a word that has anything to do with the guitar specifically or music in general. CAGED however points to shapes (the cowboy chords) that actually live on the fretboard so to me it makes the whole thing more instantly relateable and visualizable.

If I ask someone to see a 'C' chord on the fretboard they will immediatly grab some sort of 'C' grip in their mind's eye. If I ask them to see a 'form' it's more than a bit nebulous and probably confusing.

they way bone guys is describing it sound very powerfull knowledge. any book that teach that way ?

if i learn all the notes of the fret board it will be better then the CAGED thing?

You need to be able to see both those things. You need to know the notes on each fret and you need to understand the pattern that CAGED describes so the notes are organized in your mind in a way that makes sense and is useful.


they way bone guys is describing it sound very powerfull knowledge. any book that teach that way ?

Someone in this thread mentioned a book by Barret Tagliarino. I don't know the book myself.

I think I saw a product on TrueFire.com once as well that explained the CAGED octave patterns.

I'll see what I can find for you.

And you're right, it is powerful knowledge. When I began learning the CAGED shapes as taught in the Fretboard Logic book it didn't take me long to recongnize that the octave shapes are the fundamental thing that makes CAGED truly useful. It's too bad the octave thing is not normally taught in most CAGED products. It should be fundamental in my opinion.

The only objection I have to the word 'form' is that it is not a word that has anything to do with the guitar specifically or music in general. CAGED however points to shapes (the cowboy chords) that actually live on the fretboard so to me it makes the whole thing more instantly relateable and visualizable.

If I ask someone to see a 'C' chord on the fretboard they will immediatly grab some sort of 'C' grip in their mind's eye. If I ask them to see a 'form' it's more than a bit nebulous and probably confusing.

I am with you dude. I had a difficult time putting it together as well when I first started and everything was using the term "Form" followed by the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5. How they appeared on the fretboard was an issue, how it interconnected was an issue. Because of that, I had 3-4 ways of playing the same major scale starting on the same fret note. It didn't matter whether if it was box form, 3 notes on a string or linear. What did happen though was that when I figured out how the blocks fell together using octaves and the scale forms (as I said previously, "CAGED" is easier to understand), life became much easier as everything fell into place and you can visually see it all when looking at the fretboard.

I am with you dude. I had a difficult time putting it together as well when I first started and everything was using the term "Form" followed by the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5. How they appeared on the fretboard was an issue, how it interconnected was an issue. Because of that, I had 3-4 ways of playing the same major scale starting on the same fret note. It didn't matter whether if it was box form, 3 notes on a string or linear. What did happen though was that when I figured out how the blocks fell together using octaves and the scale forms (as I said previously, "CAGED" is easier to understand), life became much easier as everything fell into place and you can visually see it all when looking at the fretboard.

My experience with it sounds pretty similar to yours. I started out with the 'forms' method as well a million years ago and I was making connections of course but the big pattern didn't really become totally cohesive until the octaves revealed themselves to me when I was looking at the whole CAGED thing in a book. Aha!!.

As you have noted calling it 'forms' or calling it CAGED doesn't alter the pattern of course but CAGED makes the pattern much more explicit and obvious.

As you have noted calling it 'forms' or calling it CAGED doesn't alter the pattern of course but CAGED makes the pattern much more explicit and obvious.

If you get into teaching, it makes it so much easier when giving instruction to beginners as they then see the patterns. Even barre chords are easier to teach by calling it "E" formation instead of "Form 4" or "A" formation instead of "Form 2". Students recognize the cowboy chords quicker and now would only need to learn the note names on the root strings.

they way bone guys is describing it sound very powerfull knowledge. any book that teach that way ?

Google "Fretboard Logic" and you will see a ton of stuff on CAGED.

G

Google "Fretboard Logic" and you will see a ton of stuff on CAGED.

G

The shortcoming of Fretboard Logic, in my opinion, is that it does not make explicit the octave shapes and their importance. FL is the book that gives people the impression that CAGED is only about moving chord and/or scale shapes up and down the neck in big six string blocks. That's not a bad thing to be able to see but I believe there's a better way to to teach CAGED that allows people to really see the universal application of it to everything we do on the guitar and that it's not simply another way of seeing the fretboard.

The shortcoming of Fretboard Logic, in my opinion, is that it does not make explicit the octave shapes and their importance. FL is the book that gives people the impression that CAGED is only about moving chord and/or scale shapes up and down the neck in big six string blocks. That's not a bad thing to be able to see but I believe there's a better way to to teach CAGED that allows people to really see the universal application of it to everything we do on the guitar and that it's not simply another way of seeing the fretboard.

You hit it on the nose BG! The CAGED method goes beyond what many have used it for as it has been a great way for me to organize my playing. Imagine being able to play the same chord in 5 different positions. One of the really cool things is being able to play chord progressions, scales, and arpeggio's within one box position. Makes life easy when trying to connect lines as you play through chord changes.

Imagine being able to play the same chord in 5 different positions. One of the really cool things is being able to play chord progressions, scales, and arpeggio's within one box position. Makes life easy when trying to connect lines as you play through chord changes.

Exactly. All twelve chromatic notes can be found within a five fret reach.

I read this post a month ago or so and since I was avoiding any kind of bar chords since I really only knew the e form I was all over the neck and it was just silly.
So after reading this, I did a search on "caged Chords. I printed up all the relevant information I could find (50 pages or so) and placed it in a place where I would read parts of it daily. There is a lot of opinions out there and really non of them are wrong as near as I can tell but people do not explain it all that well.
SO anyway. It took a few reads to understand it all. My goal was to play a progression/s using barre chords without travelling all over the neck during a progression.
Being totally trying to learn guitar I have to share this since it really set me free and forced me to dig deeper and actually learn something.
The first thing I did was start figuring out some of the major "caged" chords and then the minors. Not all but just the 5 that was included or so I thought. C A G E D.
I find that really E is considered by most the first position Barre Chord of Caged and so EDCAG is more accurate and CAGED is just an easy way to remember the order.
I figured out every Chord note by note (great learning experience regarding triads and such)
Then I find you can doi it with the other notes as well and the minors and the 7ths.
Ok. I was looking for alternative chords for playing 12 Bar Blues chord progressions in the simplest form somewhere up the neck from the open chords so I could arpeggio and use some of the notes in the chord during lead and noodling.
SO I started and got to here anyway which is only scratching the surface.
I figured out these chords and a bunch of others but it serves no purpose to just use these 25 chords (I formerly knew maybe 10 open chords and the E form Barre chords up and down the neck.
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd18/DeepDrummer/Cagedexample1_zpsc2577834.jpg
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd18/DeepDrummer/Cagedexample2_zps38affa35.jpg
SO after some figuring, I had found a way to do just that due to peoples explanations of caged both here on TDPRI and elsewhere.
SO suddenly (since I was working on a song in A, I had a way to dothat thanks to "CAGED"
Then I noticed that the I of the progression was generally using one form and often the IV is barred at the same fret and simply slide that form up or down from the V to the IV.
So I now have figured out 75 chords so far and no doubt there are quite a few to go.
The beauty of my digging into CAGED is that it forced me to look closer at each note within the chord. I would write them in note for note tab for tab into a music writing software I use and then double check it after (often finding a mistake.
The turning point came after about a month when I was out on the back swing in the yard messing with some Blues in A and when it came time to play the "A" I automatically went to the Barre the fifth fret and play the E form Barre chord instead of my usual open A chord.
I stopped immediately and basked in my sudden entrance into the Barre Chord world.
Of course now I am starting to pick out the roots all over the place and lead noodling along.
It's nice to move the chord structure up and down the fretboard as you can see from the two different progression above which are both A D E. Very very cool. It just sounds good to solo or noodle on the neck in the same locations and then move the whole progression up or down using different CAGED forms.
For a relative beginner like me this is huge.
Certainly all of the above posts have merit and all are valid as near as I can figure. Caged just seemed to fast track me in the learning process big time.
Considering I have had various guitars sitting in the corner for 30 or 40 years.
I wondered if I should post some of the caged chords here. First I thought "but then people will just try to memorize them and not really learn the fretboard or really get the whole iea of it as I understand it.
Then I though "It was so hard to wrap my head around it initially that in order to show some of the true beauty of looking at it this way, I have to show examples so here are the 5 basic Major chords using the most basic properties explained by some as "CAGED"
Example:
http://i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd18/DeepDrummer/Caged.jpg
This is just the very tip of the iceberg.
Now look at that last pic of some of the Major caged chords. Pick a progression and a key. Now look up and down the list to find the chords in the progression all Barred near the same fret. Try finding the same chords higher or lower on the neck.
Now if you figure out all the notes within each chord (triads?) and lead over those in similar locations keeping an eye out for the roots and try using that. Or try noodling over some caged chord progressions in different places up and down the neck arpeggioing the chords or even just pausing a bit starting and landing on a root.
Caged is incentive, revelation, a built in pattern of the design of the guitar, motivation, happiness, joy and just a very cool way of looking at it and categorizing it that fast tracks learning and forces more learning and the desire to learn more.
And Caged is so much more and opens up so much more.
Simply another way to understand the guitar and one that has real merit in my opinion.
I'll be writing out and learning a lot of Barre Chords this winter but more importantly how they are made up and even if I am not playing the chords they are helping me find my way around while noodling. Very cool. TDPRI Rocks!! Heck noone else was ever able to teach me guitar anything but a few open chords. lol.

I think that in order to master the fretboard it is helpful to analyze in many different ways.

As far as octave patterns go I think the chromatic octave Segovia exercise might be the king. It will get the octave patterns across and into your head in a hurry, plus it's great for your finger dexterity and hand muscles.

I found this video of it. (I have nothing to do with the instructional method she's hawking)

Saw0smyTYJ4

the idea is to play a chromatic scale withe hand in the first position in octaves using all 4 fingers of the left hand, never moving from the first position. You start with the open e on the sixth string and end up on the G# on the g string. and then descend playing and octave above at the same time.

It will by no means show you how the octaves travel up the neck but, the patterns will be imprinted in your muscular memory. If you name the notes in flats and then in sharps as you play them it will even be better. It really is a monster exercise for the hands and the mind.

You could write it out in musical notation, chord diagrams and tab too, which would be good practice in itself. If you've never tried it spend a little time on it and you're sure to improve some aspect of you playing as a result.

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/search.php?searchid=7181267

(and +1 to anything BoneyGuy says! :cool: )