2 tracks

I am mixing these two tracks for a demo so we can get some gigs. It has been a while but I think I am getting there.

The tracks were recorded by a pro at a local studio. I'm doing the mixing.
Let me know what you think.

http://soundcloud.com/conshohocken-curve

First, I like the songs.

Second, I've only been able to give them a cursory listen. But, I do think the low end could be beefed up considerably. I'm not hearing much kick and while the bass is audible, my first impression is it needs a fair amount of boosting in its lower range.

Getting that low stuff right is hard though. Really hard. I spend a LOT of time on that when I'm mixing now. I used to kinda sort of get in the ballpark and go. Call it the guitar player's mix method, or whatever. It's the foundation though and it needs to be right. Also difficult to hear in suboptimal rooms with suboptimal subs (or monitors that aren't that accurate all that far down).

How are you hearing that bottom two or three octaves on your monitors? I find a really good test is to half close the door, go down the hall etc. That will often give you a hint as to the overall low/mid/high balance.

Anyhow, my first impression is that it is a bit bass shy overall. Let's see if others agree or not.
Cheers,
Geoff

If it's been a while, it doesn't sound bad at all. I would agree that the low end needs some attention. The tom's sound a bit thin too.

It's all about personal taste when mixing, but my other critiques would be:

- the solos sound like they need to sit in the mix a bit more (especially in "on the way home")
- the pedal hi-hat is pretty loud in respect to the rest of the kit
- way too much bottom snare mic/snare wires for me, or maybe that's just how the snare sounds acoustically. This is just my taste really, I've probably mixed too many heavy metal recordings!
- There's some odd things happening with the snare in "california stars": out of phase in places (e.g 2.14, 2.58). It also sounds like there's a double hit at various points (e.g. 2.48-2.50).
- I'd personally have the guitars more audible. Boost higher frequencies and cut around where the vocals are sitting so it doesn't bury them.

That's not supposed to come across as negative by the way! Just trying to be constructive!

Cheers,

Rob

Just listened to the first one:

Yeah, I'm hearing the kik and lower freq. snare in a pretty narrow range around 150Hz fighting with the bass guitar. Maybe notch the bass guitar there.

Then, you could boost the bass guitar a bit.

Maybe a little more hard panning on the guitar/keyboard: -40 guitar +40 keys.
Guitar solo(s): way too loud. Needs to be out front, yes, but not louder than the vocals.

These are all good and welcome critiques. It has been a while since I mixed something so I obviously forgot certain things.

The mixes you are hearing are early mixes so thanks to you I can progress with a clearer goal.

If it's been a while, it doesn't sound bad at all. I would agree that the low end needs some attention. The tom's sound a bit thin too.

It's all about personal taste when mixing, but my other critiques would be:

- the solos sound like they need to sit in the mix a bit more (especially in "on the way home")
- the pedal hi-hat is pretty loud in respect to the rest of the kit
- way too much bottom snare mic/snare wires for me, or maybe that's just how the snare sounds acoustically. This is just my taste really, I've probably mixed too many heavy metal recordings!
- There's some odd things happening with the snare in "california stars": out of phase in places (e.g 2.14, 2.58). It also sounds like there's a double hit at various points (e.g. 2.48-2.50).
- I'd personally have the guitars more audible. Boost higher frequencies and cut around where the vocals are sitting so it doesn't bury them.

That's not supposed to come across as negative by the way! Just trying to be constructive!

Cheers,

Rob

The drums were individually miced as well as two overheads. I panned the overheads hard left and hard right on "California Stars" to get a more space in the mix. All amps were in the room with the drums so I have to be careful in mixing because of the bleed. It took me awhile to tame the snare bed sound during the opening to "California Stars"

I didn't want the drums to be too overpowering since we were going for a more ambient sound while retaining the live feel.

At least that was my plan.

I will solo the snare and check for the phase problem

Just listened to the first one:

Yeah, I'm hearing the kik and lower freq. snare in a pretty narrow range around 150Hz fighting with the bass guitar. Maybe notch the bass guitar there.

Then, you could boost the bass guitar a bit.

Maybe a little more hard panning on the guitar/keyboard: -40 guitar +40 keys.
Guitar solo(s): way too loud. Needs to be out front, yes, but not louder than the vocals.

"California Stars"

There are no keys on the track. The sound you are hearing is my guitar going through a patch on my M9. I wanted a lysergic steel guitar sound so I just played that live with the rest of the band. In the mix I panned that more to the left and some reverb with a very slight touch of phaser to the right.

Your right about the guitar solos. I have to go back to that and bring them down another notch (or two):shock:

- way too much bottom snare mic/snare wires for me, or maybe that's just how the snare sounds acoustically.

That was the first thing that jumped out at me, kind of a loose, diffused sound ... maybe a little compression could give you a more compact, punchier sound on the main snare channel, then adjust volume to taste. I suspect you'd still get enough of the snare wires through the overheads.

That was the first thing that jumped out at me, kind of a loose, diffused sound ... maybe a little compression could give you a more compact, punchier sound on the main snare channel, then adjust volume to taste. I suspect you'd still get enough of the snare wires through the overheads.

I think some of the snare wires is from vibration from the bass and guitar amps. The drums were not baffled or isolated.

I almost forgot how hard mixing was. Especially when trying to get instruments to sit in the mix.

Another bummer is my Focusrite VRM apparently likes to work when it feels like it. I have it hooked into the SPDIF out on my Pro 40 and the MixControl has the SPIDF channels set for DAW 1 and DAW 2. Obviously its operator error but I would like the darn thing to work when I need it.

I still have a third one to mix. Our version of the classic "Before You Cuse' Me". So I will post a link here and you can have at it.

I am basically devoting a night to each song just to get the ingredients together and I am going to spend the weekend tweaking and getting everything finished. I really don't want to go overboard but I do want a nice listening experience.

I almost forgot how hard mixing was.

[snip]

I really don't want to go overboard but I do want a nice listening experience.

Mixing is hard - really hard! But fun too. You can be struggling along going down a bunch of dead ends and all of a sudden you make a change that brings the track to life. Love it when that happens!

As for when to call it a day.? There's a quote - sometimes attributed to George Martin - that says mixes are never finished, just abandoned.

Good luck with it, you're on the right track.

Cheers,
Geoff

All amps were in the room with the drums so I have to be careful in mixing because of the bleed.

I will solo the snare and check for the phase problem

Ah right, sorry I didn't realise it was a live recording! Cool! In which case, the snare phasing could be coming from the sum of more than one mic that contain any snare sound. Odd that it only happens in a few places though. Just have to do what you can for things like that.

I almost forgot how hard mixing was.

Plenty of "ear breaks", plus constantly reference some good quality recordings of a similar genre. Definitely helped me with ear fatigue when I first started.

There's a quote - sometimes attributed to George Martin - that says mixes are never finished, just abandoned.

Ha! That's a great quote!