A 68 Tele for a Les Paul? Legit?

A day or two ago, this popped up on the local craiglist:
http://decatur.craigslist.org/msg/2972847481.html

ole boy says he has a 68 tele (with a refinished(? at least the headstock label removed) that he'll trade straight across for a Les Paul (including my Les Paul studio ?!).

Seems too good to be true, but he's a real person, apparently, and isn't really a guitar guy, so it could be legit.

So I'm trying to bone up on my Tele knowledge so I can tell if it's real when I get over there. I've done a bunch of googling, and all roads apparently point to the tdpri forums, so I thought I'd come ask the experts :D.

Obviously, the first thing I'll look for is the serial on the neck plate, but I hate to trade away my guitar just b/c somebody bought a vintage neck plate and put it on a relic'ed tele...

The humbucker gives me pause, for sure. But it's not a deal breaker, especially if it turns out to be something nice...

In any case, any advice on what to look for when I'm looking at it in person? I'm hopeful he's going to let me take the neck and pickguard off, but I don't really know what I'm looking for in the cavity/neck, or on the pickguard...

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

That's definitely not a 68. The body shape is wrong... Early 70's 72, 73 something like that. But to be honest there's no real way to tell what it is without more detailed pictures.

Can you get him to pop the neck off? Pictures of the neck heel, under the pickguard, electronics etc would help...

It's hard to say except it looks like it was sanded or stripped for sure which hurts value but this was not completely unheard of, especially on a Telecaster and many a player wanting to show the wood to make it a blonde. This was done to my 1968 Telecaster which was Olympic White and stripped to show wood by a previous owner.

But the tuners look OK and the finish checking on neck is a good sign for guitar of that age.

The shape of the upper and lower bout seems off but that could be due to body being sanded when finish was taken off. Maybe the owner refinished it in a matte oil finish. The inconsistency of the wood's colors on the body is actually consistent with some sketchy Fender CBS era quality control issues. That can actually be a good sign to showing it is at least a 1968 Fender CBS body.

Wait until quite a few people who have collected/sold this stuff chime in. If the body is real and the neck is real and the remaining electronics (sans humbucker) are original, I would trade it for a Les Paul.

I'm hoping I can convince him to let me do it. He's not a guitar guy, so he's a bit nervous to do it himself.

I, on the other hand, have operated more than a couple screwdrivers in my day. :D

That's definitely not a 68. The body shape is wrong... Early 70's 72, 73 something like that. But to be honest there's no real way to tell what it is without more detailed pictures.

Can you get him to pop the neck off? Pictures of the neck heel, under the pickguard, electronics etc would help...

I would still do the trade for an early '70s tele if the neck date and heel show real parts. I hope the electronics other than humbucker are the real thing and that would be far better.

If this were my tele, I would make it an Esquire, get a sticker, and get a black or white pickguard. I think a nice opaque finish would be a nice touch and if not that to cover inconsistent wood, maybe a solid color of the period. It's a project used guitar, but possibly still worthy of a LP studio in trade.

That's kind of what I was thinking. And if it's a player, that's even better :)

How are the neck and heel usually dated?

Ok, so I went and checked it out. He wasn't willing to let me take the neck off, so I wasn't able to check that out.

I've got some more (albeit crappy) pics too
https://plus.google.com/photos/115906303634268939105/albums/5735400617119231105

I did figure out a few more things (from looking--he's convinced it's all stock except maybe a refinish job and a new selector switch; but he's totally wrong):

1. The neck plate (and screws?) aren't original--no serial number there.
2. The mirror pickguard is obviously not stock
3. The humbucker in the bridge is STRANGE--it has flat-topped pole pieces that are sunk down below the pickup cover. And the screws holding it in don't match anything--it certainly doesn't look stock to me.

4. The bridge, however, DID look stock. It's a 3 saddle job, lots of corrosion, with the following markings (parallel w/ the edge of the bridge plate, not to the pickup):

DES 164227 (am I leaving out a "G"?)
2.573.254

5. If the neck isn't a genuine Fender, it's still awful old. Lots of checking in the finish, extremely rusty string trees, and some of that great wear along the treble side between the frets. Bizarrely, there was a knot(?) or some other mark on the headstock near the nut. Also, the truss rod seemed to adjust behind the nut, but the hole, where you'd access it, appeared to be filled with a wooden dowel, sanded to fit the contour of the headstock.

6. Unless the guy did a bang-up job, he didn't change the shape of the body whilst refinishing--it still looks pretty original. The finish is really thin--you can feel the wood grain. I don't hate it, in fact, I kind of like it a lot, but if the body shape is weird, it doesn't appear to be because of sanding.

7. It does play really nice. The action is even all the way down and the frets are really low--looks to me like its had a couple fret jobs in its lifetime, and the last one wasn't too long ago.

After playing it, I'm really digging it. But I'm still scared about trading away my $800~$1000 Les Paul for it. That's a lot of cash to let go of for something that may or may not be legit. And honestly, at this point, it's 100% a cash issue--I'd love to own this guitar...

Any thoughts?

If he won't let you take the neck off or do it himself, I would walk away from it. Sounds like he has something to hide and you've already pointed out enough things that aren't stock....

If he won't let you take the neck off or do it himself, I would walk away from it. Sounds like he has something to hide and you've already pointed out enough things that aren't stock....

I don't know that he THINKS he's got anything to hide...he just thinks he's got a treasure on his hands and is afraid he's gonna screw it up.

At least that's the vibe I got.

I did a bit more looking tonight. There's a lot that's not adding up here, including the fact that there's two string trees. The knot by the headstock and the weird wooden plug over the truss rod (by the nut!) also seriously concern me.

It kills me to pass something like this up. But I'd be kicking myself forever if I traded away a $900 guitar for a partscaster that I'd be lucky to get $400 out of.

That said, it really is a COOL guitar, whether or not it's legit.