Any experience with Triode Electronics Amp Kits ?

I just finished building a Triode 6G15 Reverb unit clone. It sounds great, and was a much better price than the Weber kit. I was thinking of buying a 5E3 kit from Triode aswell. I have a homebuilt 50 watt 5E3 clone, but I would like an original one to go along with it. Does anybody else have any experience with the Triode kits ? I will say that they have great customer service, and answer questions very fast. It was a very smooth process. I think I'll go for that 5E3 kit just because they were so easy to deal with. I highly recommend Triode for amp kits. Just wondering if anybody else has stummbled upon them.

how about a link?
I an thinking about getting an amp kit as it looks like fun
(and really, can you ever have too many amps?)

Great guys to do business with.

Hey, jebbo,

I just finished a Triode AA764 VC build, and it sounds great (now)! If you are planning on mounting this kit in an existing combo chassis that is NOT a Vibro Champ, you might want to be careful about layout perimeters. I just did that, and had a few problems. Not with the Triode build, per se, but with lead dressing... maybe.

I posted a step-by-step build, including some of my mistakes and fixes, on the Malikon site. (some of you may know him!) Hope this helps!

http://http://malikon.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=amps&action=display&thread=180

how about a link?
I an thinking about getting an amp kit as it looks like fun
(and really, can you ever have too many amps?)

Here's their homepage:

http://triodeelectronics.com/

And their 5E3 Kit:

http://http://triodeelectronics.com/5e3tubeampkit.html (http://triodeelectronics.com/5e3tubeampkit.html)

Again, I strongly recommend getting a 'standard' 5E3 chassis, or cutting out your own reasonably close to the original layout.

Have fun!

I just finished building a Triode 6G15 Reverb unit clone. It sounds great, and was a much better price than the Weber kit.

Umm... the only way Triode is less expensive than Weber is if you look at Triode's "leave out the chassis" deal. That's great if you want to spend a lot of time on an amp that only a mother could love...

Triode's so-called "tweed Deluxe" PT: 770 volts CT? You're kiddin', right? Who brought the Deluxe Reverb transformer?

Triode's so-called "tweed Deluxe" OT: Oh, kewl! 4, 8 and 16 ohm taps! While that may be useful for some applications what do you do with the extra wire? Hint: While parts left over may not be a good sign you don't need to use all the wire.


The Recipe:

Start with a Weber chassis kit and transformers. Might as well order your Carling switches from Weber while you're there. Or go Mojo if you like chrome. Order sockets from Mojo because their sockets fit their chassis.

Pick up the capacitors, carbon comps and pots from Watts Tube / Turretboards. Might as well get the wire there.

Switchcraft jacks come from Phone Kings. Or pay a little more from Watts and save on shipping.

Little stuff will hang you up. Make sure you get a strain relief for the power cord. Weber charges a buck. I get 'em for a nickel as surplus.

Grounded power cords come from your local computer supply. They're bein' tools if they charge you more than a buck.

...I use a ten dollar power tool replacement cord. They're nice.



The Alternative Recipe:

Dave from Boot Hill Amps posts here all the time. If you want the whole thing in one box for the lowest price anywhere... there you go. Keep a fellow TDPRI member in bisquits and gravy.

Dave tossed My Pet Peeve Plastic Pilot Light in with the kit he sent me because he knows stuff like that makes me crazy. :twisted:

I keep tellin' myself lowest price... lowest price... lowest price... over and over. That seems to quiet the voices in my head. :twisted:

(reaches into Ten Finger Ziploc Baggie o' Pilot Lights. "Problem" solved! :grin:)



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Did Triode ship fast?
Now, for me things like that matter more than a few bucks here and there.
Boothills shipped very quick, plus Dave is a gentleman :). His prices are great and if you decide on a few upgrades (pilot light etc.) it will be good to set up with mouser or whoever you like anyway, and just stash away Dave's parts for future stuff.

That's great if you want to spend a lot of time on an amp that only a mother could love...

Haha! You are so right! :oops: Even the builder (me!) is not so enamored with this combo, except that it does sound pretty sweet. I will have to get a proper chassis on my next build! But hey, I learned a lot! (mostly I learned that I don't want to use a manual nibbler to make a transformer cutout ever again!)

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/shock-brothers-diy-amps/320427-aa764-help.html

And yeah, after looking around with a more experienced eye (though just one build), I think I will give Dave a call for my next build. A 5E3 sounds fun...

Now, for me things like that matter more than a few bucks here and there. Boothills shipped very quick, plus Dave is a gentleman :). His prices are great and if you decide on a few upgrades (pilot light etc.) it will be good.

Quicky Boothill / Weber comparo:

I obsess over details like resistors and capacitors. Nickel and dime parts. Why spend a nickel for "good" when I can spend a dime for excellent?

Dave uses IRC 1% resistors for the little stuff. Some are odd values like 101k for the 100ks. No big deal. NOS Allen Bradleys were no better than 5% from the get-go and are often 20% over now. If you think about it a 101k that's 1% low is right on the published value from the schematic.

...then if you look at a GA-5 it's the same circuit with 220ks where I see the100ks in a Fender. So really, anything from 100k to over 220k (220k +20%) is fine.

The resistors in the dropping string and the bias resistor are much nicer than Weber. I think he sent a Dale 5w bias resistor. That's good stuff!

The Boothill bypass capacitors are bipolar. I feel a certain kinship with biploar stuff :rolleyes: and it's a clever choice. There's no way to screw up and put bipolars in backwards.

Thank You for the referrals.

Where do you get the best pilot lights?

IME, really good quality pilot lights are rare. Though, I find the plastic ones to be adequate. I have become intimate with their design and construction. They do offer good performance and function.

IMHO, they are better the metal ones I have used. On the metal bracketed ones, the insulative material between the solder tabs was thin. If it breaks or becomes damaged, a short is pending. Those solder tabs abut one another - separated by a thin pancake of insulative material.

Surely there must be better metal ones than I have experienced. I just haven't found them.

Where do you get the best pilot lights?

IME, really good quality pilot lights are rare. Though, I find the plastic ones to be adequate. I have become intimate with their design and construction. They do offer good performance and function.

The lowdown on pilot lights: Fender originally sourced them from Drake Manufacturing in Chicago. The visible parts are nickel plated with a nice ruby glass jewel. They're by no means perfect. The little cardboard ring that acts as a gasket shrinks over time so the jewel rattles. If it's been damp the gasket sprouts mold. All part of the Drake mystique I mean mojo.

Drakes (and repros) are a minor bitch to install. I use a beat up jewel to hold the bezel and there's a special wrench to give the nut the ol' reach around. It's a good idea to slather Loctite all over the threads. I know amp builders who don't and their stuff shakes loose. It's a good idea to let the Loctite go off before removing the beater jewel and installing a good one. I should do a tutorial...

The thing about a Drake is the connections can be oriented away from the chassis in '60s Fenders. That's important. I'll have to double check but I'm fairly certain the other style doesn't work in BF / SF amps.

Trivia: Dial Mfg. (I believe they were on Long Island) made pilot assemblies virtually identical to Drake. The knurling on the jewel is a tiny bit different and Dial didn't use the problematic cardboard gasket.

Good repros are available from Aeronautical Instrument Company. Well... that's who makes 'em. CE and Mojo sell 'em. They're around 3x more expensive than the plastic knockoffs. Near as I can tell Aeronautical makes 'em primarily for replacement use in vintage and experimental aircraft. We're fortunate to have parts this nice. Now let's see someone step up and make new Cinch sockets.

IMHO, they are better the metal ones I have used. On the metal bracketed ones, the insulative material between the solder tabs was thin. If it breaks or becomes damaged, a short is pending. Those solder tabs abut one another - separated by a thin pancake of insulative material.

There's an Asian knockoff of the Drake / Dial / Aeronautical pilot light. Drake and repro fit a 5/8" hole, the metric bootleg is a rattle fit. The annoying part about the bootleg is that the jewel is machined so it won't thread all the way into the bezel. Vintage or repro jewels won't fit the metric holder.

On mojo's site they offer metric for $4.00 retail or Aeronautical for $2.75 for the holder, $2.75 for the jewel. They now say "metric" in their description. They didn't specify when these first showed up. I don't think their pic shows the metric assembly. I can see the fit and finish issues on the metric part from across the room.



I should do a Parts Porn Pictorial.



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I looked at boothill amp kits the website has very little info on it and the kit's do not come with transformers???
now correct me if I am mistaken, but an amp without a transformer will not work very well, so that sort of makes the whole thing worthless to me, I can build a box and I have speakers, and even spare new 6L6 tubes, besides tubes and speakers are available at any music store but I have no spare amp transformers sitting around, and I have no idea where to find one, or what one will work for an amp, so an amp kit without the transformer is just a box of parts from radioshack?

Talk to the man, he supplies transformers or can recommend where to get them. Personally I like Classic Tone :wink:

I can see caferacers point, a kit should be a kit, complete in every thing it takes to have a working amp. Kits as described are almost essential for a beginner, and to an old pro it saves a lot of hassel. Tube Depot had PCB. boards which I don't care for, Triode leaves too much for the beginner to figure out and doesn't have cabinets and charges extra for tubes so they are mostly for pro's, Boothill doesn't have trannies. So where do you go to get it all, including trannies, tubes, Weber, where you have to deal with some of the cheap parts, and I too only use Classic tone trannies. Just my preference.
However no matter how you go, the price when all is said and done won't differ by that much.
Shipping cost gets pricey when you source everything.
I don't know all the answers but I deal with the frustrations and am still looking for that one stop shop with good kits with lots of options and for this I would gladly pay a few dollars more.

Good hi quality transformers are very important to great tone. Many amp builders are very picky and want a certian tansformer. Building hi quality transformers is a fine art. Most tube sniffers, myself included, want USA built trannies. Mercury Magnetics and Heyboer, just naming a few, seem to be in high demand. A smaller scale guy like Boothill Amps would have to stock many different traninies to try and please everyone. Also the major trannie builders seems to have a price point break in order to get a discount. A kit supplier has to make a profit, consumers are a tough crowd out there. Trying be priced competitively, have a good supply and high quality product would be a challenge I'm sure. I liked dealing with Boothill amps. He provided good parts, service and quality. I also liked sourcing my own trannies. I had lots of options. When I ordered an amp kit from Trinity, they only offered their own trannies.
For my current project, I ordered Heyboer trannies from Weber in early Feb. They just shipped today. Heyboer must be very busy. I hope they are worth the wait!

Umm... the only way Triode is less expensive than Weber is if you look at Triode's "leave out the chassis" deal. That's great if you want to spend a lot of time on an amp that only a mother could love...

Triode's so-called "tweed Deluxe" PT: 770 volts CT? You're kiddin', right? Who brought the Deluxe Reverb transformer?

Triode's so-called "tweed Deluxe" OT: Oh, kewl! 4, 8 and 16 ohm taps! While that may be useful for some applications what do you do with the extra wire? Hint: While parts left over may not be a good sign you don't need to use all the wire.



Triodes chassis' are $90 , Weber's $80-the cost will probably be the same after all the extra shipping from Weber and wherever you order the components you don't order from Weber.
Triode's Tweed Deluxe xformer is 710volts CT(355/355), not 770 v, and also offers a 330/330 tap for lower voltage. The Classic Tone Xformers are great and no need to upgrade the Triode kit's components. If you want a complete kit w/cab and speaker, Weber will be the cheapest way to go. I've built both kits, and while there's nothing wrong with the Weber(tho you'll want to upgrade a few of the small parts), the Triode definately gets my vote for better quality components. YMMV.

I will shop Boothill next time I'm looking just because he is a member, and I find his posts interesting and informative.

I looked at boothill amp kits the website has very little info on it and the kit's do not come with transformers???
now correct me if I am mistaken, but an amp without a transformer will not work very well, so that sort of makes the whole thing worthless to me, I can build a box and I have speakers, and even spare new 6L6 tubes, besides tubes and speakers are available at any music store but I have no spare amp transformers sitting around, and I have no idea where to find one, or what one will work for an amp, so an amp kit without the transformer is just a box of parts from radioshack?

Such ominous waves of negativity.

Haven't been able to buy tube amp parts at Radio Shack since I was a kid. That's a long time ago. I used to buy tube amp parts at Radio Shack when I was a kid...

I miss Lafayette. And Montgomery Wards... :roll:

The central theme of the kit thing is DIY. Do it yourself. I really don't like complete kits, I always end up with stuff I'm going to change. Triode in particular sells "kits" without the chassis. To me a kit without a chassis is just a pile of parts. If I'm starting with a big bag o' parts I shop around and buy pick of the litter from several vendors.

Good hi quality transformers are very important to great tone. Many amp builders are very picky and want a certain tansformer. Building hi quality transformers is a fine art. Most tube sniffers, myself included, want USA built trannies.

Urban legend: Winding transformers is an art. That's part of Mercury's very expensive ad campaign. Winding transformers is an industrial process. Period. A tiny bit of knowledge goes a long way here.

Our transformer guy retired but we have his hipot machine and our factory certified Roland (and every other non-tube brand I don't like messin' with) our Roland technician used to be his lead guy. The old timer literally laughs at some of the transformers I use. "That's much too large!" he says. "You're losing money using those oversized transformers."

The dude wound a lot of transformers for hi-fi so when he says it's overkill it's overkill.

Big part of the Urban Legend: "Tone is the primary criteria." Talk to musicians. Just scan posts in the amp forum. No, it ain't. Cost is the primary criteria closely followed by appearance. Try to build amps with premium parts that make great tone, you're gonna go hungry. You're gonna go hungry while everyone buys VJs, VHTs, Joyos, Excelsiors, Gretas or whatever the flavor of the week happens to be. Relatively few musicians will pony up $3500 once for "the last amp they'll ever buy". GAS really is addictive behavior and low buck amps are musician crack.

Truth be told (the Emperor is bare assed!) transformers in many if not most iconic vintage amps were only as good as they had to be. Almost nothing was "bifilar wound on M6 laminations." Most musicians have no idea what that is but bein' as it's 3x more expensive it must be good, right? Truth be told most of the "premium" transformers are simply copies of the originals that weren't that great to begin with.

A tiny bit of thought gets you an extra step beyond that with your wallet still intact. Use a Pro Reverb OT for a Deluxe or a Twin Reverb OT in a Vibroverb to get your big iron without havin' to pay a premium for someone's advertising. Know what you need instead of depending on hype or advertising copy to tell you what you need.



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Well said.

Such ominous waves of negativity...

Triode in particular sells "kits" without the chassis.

Ummm...

I'm agreeing that without a chassis (or the transformers, or the tubes, or the cabinet, or the speaker, for that matter), it's not a complete kit. But in their defense, Triode does sell several models with chassis as an option, as well as offering no transformer or optional upgrades, and even a few head cabs. To my great chagrin I opted to not get a chassis, and now consider that a big factor in future builds. But yeah, DIY is DIY, and very few folks actually have everything in stock, ready to ship. Being my first build, I made a few bad choices and probably wasted some $$ and time, but with help from you guys here and another forum, and even the Triode tech, I did OK.

I would not rule out Triode in the future, because the do have a pretty nice 'partial' kit with quality parts. That said, Boot Hill Amps intrigues me, too! My problem is living outside the US, I needed someone to tell me, "This transformer will work in Japan (100V-50Hz)." Weber and Mojo declined, Triode pulled through.

If (when?) I look at another build, I'm going to need someone to give me guidance about what transformer will do the job for such-and-such an amp. Hopefully I can source the transformers locally, because shipping a chunk of iron and copper is not cheap!! :eek:

a cab and a chassis I can make, tubes and speakers are common and easily obtained,
what I want from a kit is all the parts I am not able to get at a local shop
cap's, pots, tube sockets, transformers, and GOOD detailed schematic with well explained instructions, I do not think this is to much to ask, oh yea, and call the kit what it is I.E. champ, basseman, JCM 800, not just a bunch of numbers and letters, as I have no clue what a 5F1, 5F6A, 5E3, 6G15, are, and I am sure I am not alone in this,
the reason I have never bought or built an amp kit is simple I have no idea what they are trying to sell me, and incomplete kits with inadequate descriptions do nothing to alleviate this problem,

I built a Triode 5F1 about a month ago and am very happy with it. In cost comparisons I found it to be the cheapest (in price not part quality) as well.

a cab and a chassis I can make, tubes and speakers are common and easily obtained,
what I want from a kit is all the parts I am not able to get at a local shop
cap's, pots, tube sockets, transformers, and GOOD detailed schematic with well explained instructions, I do not think this is to much to ask, oh yea, and call the kit what it is I.E. champ, basseman, JCM 800, not just a bunch of numbers and letters, as I have no clue what a 5F1, 5F6A, 5E3, 6G15, are, and I am sure I am not alone in this,
the reason I have never bought or built an amp kit is simple I have no idea what they are trying to sell me, and incomplete kits with inadequate descriptions do nothing to alleviate this problem,

I too was in the dark about amps and kits earlier in my life. We all were. What the heck is a 5F1 vs a 5F2A or an AA763 vs an AB763? I bought books and studied 50's hi-fi (aka tube amps). I took a humble approach on forums like this one and by the generosity of others, they have taught me the little that I know so far. From hours of studying books, pouring through threads on here and asking lots of questions, I understood what I needed to tackle an amp kit. I found I had just scratched the surface in my knowledge, there was so much more to learn.

There a many reasons why when you order a tweed deluxe you need to know what a 5E3 is or a 5C3 or 5D3. They are all tweed deluxe amps and all sound different. If you wanted a Bandmaster kit there also several options of circuits. Pick almost any Fender model of amp and there are a few variations of the circuit for that one amp model. They are identified by all these weird numbers and letters.

There is a lot of help available on here for those who seek it. God knows I need it, as I only know enough to be dangerous to my self. We are shock brothers. Sometimes I think we need a "shock brothers H.M.H. amps" thread, form for guys like us. "Hold My Hand". Hang in there, take some time to do your research, you'll get it.

what I want from a kit is all the parts I am not able to get at a local shop cap's, pots, tube sockets, transformers, and GOOD detailed schematic with well explained instructions, I do not think this is to much to ask, oh yea, and call the kit what it is I.E. champ, basseman, JCM 800, not just a bunch of numbers and letters, as I have no clue what a 5F1, 5F6A, 5E3, 6G15, are, and I am sure I am not alone in this,

I'd expect someone from Philadelphia to understand the legal aspects more thoroughly.

Instructions: If I send you a pile of parts and you electrocute yourself it's on you. If I send you a pile of parts plus instructions and you electrocute yourself it's on me.

Schematics are downloadable from a number of sources. It's all Attack of the Clones. Start with the Fender shcematic or use the ones Weber graciously provides. Weber's are complete and in color. Some Fender drawings have had the same errors for over 50 years!


There are certain descriptive terms that will earn you a Cease and Desist Notice. "Bassman" and "JCM800" are two of them.

Urban legend: Winding transformers is an art. That's part of Mercury's very expensive ad campaign. Winding transformers is an industrial process. Period. A tiny bit of knowledge goes a long way here.



By and large I agree with everything you said, and agree with the quoted statement, but find it to tell only half the story. The winding is just an industrial process, but the designing is where you have to learn things they can not teach you in school. Our transformers are far to imperfect for Maxwell equations to describe, so it is more then plugging numbers in and getting a design out. Getting a working design is easy, betting a predictable design results is where the experience comes in. Yeah, I agree it is not really art but it is fuzzy logic.

OK, by me saying Triode is cheaper is a broad statement. I ordered a chassis for $38 from a guy on Ebay. That is the main reason whay it was cheaper. It isn't as good a chassis as Weber or even Triode would make, but for me it gets the job done. Here's some pics of the 6G15.

I ended up getting a chassis exactly the same as the original 6G15. I thought the filter caps would fit inside the way most people have it, but Fender's layout has them in the front with the OT and choke.

If you buy this same kit from Weber without tubes, a chassis, and a cab, it will cost almost twice as much as the Triode. That's why I chose the Triode. If you don't want the hassle of finding a chassis, and making a cab, I recommend the Weber. I actualy think I should have got the Weber Revibe so I could have tremolo too, but this will work fine.

a cab and a chassis I can make, tubes and speakers are common and easily obtained,
what I want from a kit is all the parts I am not able to get at a local shop
cap's, pots, tube sockets, transformers, and GOOD detailed schematic with well explained instructions, I do not think this is to much to ask, oh yea, and call the kit what it is I.E. champ, basseman, JCM 800, not just a bunch of numbers and letters, as I have no clue what a 5F1, 5F6A, 5E3, 6G15, are, and I am sure I am not alone in this,
the reason I have never bought or built an amp kit is simple I have no idea what they are trying to sell me, and incomplete kits with inadequate descriptions do nothing to alleviate this problem,

The numbers are the patented circuits. A 6G15 is a Fender Reverb unit, a 5E3 is a Fender Tweed Deluxe. That's just what they're called. I don't know why companies sell them by circuit number, they just do. Triode lists what the amp is, they call a Marshall JCM800 a Marshall JCM800. Weber just gives their kits crazy numbers, and they're not even the real circuit numbers. I don't realy understand that, but it is what it is.

Since the original poster asked, I have a Triode kit that is not assembled yet but is next in the project line. I ordered everything except the chassis and cabinet components from them as I want to build my own.

I choose Triode over others because the price value worked the best for me. I wanted USA built transformers and board which they offered. I believe their chassis is USA built as well. I also wanted parts in a box so that I would have to research and figure out how to put it together. They were great to deal with and I am satisfied. Lots of options out there for 5E3 builders. Triode worked for me. YMMV

I placed an order for a couple of items on Wednesday at about 1:00pm my time. I had the package in my hand by 1:00pm Friday. That was standard shipping, I think it was about 6 dollars.
With gas at $4.25 a gallon, I think it's the biggest bargin in town.
By punching less digits than it takes to type this message, I can have anyting I need from Triode in 48 hours, it doesn't get any better than that.