# Interesting take on 3-saddle bridge intonation

AnArmyOfJuan
February 6th, 2012, 04:45 PM
From someone who appears to be a physicist!

Boiled down to the essentials, his theory is that once you've adjusted the bass string from each pair for height and length, use saddle height (tension) to adjust the intonation on the treble string from each pair.

What say you guys? My initial impression is that it would cause everything to feel wonky, but maybe the amount of saddle height required isn't as much as I'd think?

Bud Veazey
February 6th, 2012, 06:00 PM
Saddle height contributes to the intonation equation, but the discernible effect of raising or lowering a saddle a mm or two is almost nil. Anyone who could hear the difference between scientifically exact intonation (if it exists) and the "close enough" that most of us use would probably be ready for the nut house if he played any stringed instrument for any length of time.

My favorite bridge is the Joe Barden compensated vintage. I have found that after intonating one string on a saddle, the other string is usually either intonated spot on or within a couple of cents. Some on this forum have suggested adjusting the saddle to split the difference between the two strings. Frankly, I've never found enough difference with a compensated three-saddle bridge to justify the effort.

tfsails
February 6th, 2012, 07:03 PM
Sounds like a testament for a six-saddle bridge to me!

DeepDrummer
February 6th, 2012, 07:58 PM
String heights isn't the way in my opinion. I went 6 saddles and forgot about it. I prefer my strings at a proper height rather than wrack my brain to try to intonate a 3 saddle bridge. I could care less about looks.

boris bubbanov
February 6th, 2012, 08:00 PM
Sounds like a testament for a six-saddle bridge to me!

Phooey.

dsutton24
February 6th, 2012, 08:07 PM
So, proper intonation means having every string at a different height? Doesn't seem rational.

boris bubbanov
February 6th, 2012, 08:07 PM
Saddle height contributes to the intonation equation, but the discernible effect of raising or lowering a saddle a mm or two is almost nil.

My favorite bridge is the Joe Barden compensated vintage.

On the first point I disagree; when intonating a guitar with a 7.25 inch board radius, that extra slant in the 2 outboard saddles is enough to sweeten those 2 up real nicely; whereas by contrast you have issues on such as a 16" board radius.

Speaking of the Joe Barden, I think it works decent on Hi-Lo string sets, and on the thinnest guages (not 10.5s, 11s, 12s) especially coupled to compound radius and modern or nearer to flat board radii. With 11-49s and a 7.25 board radius, the Joe Bardens are dreadfully over-compensated the way most guitars tend to be set up. Too much slant, requiring one to leave the outboard saddles abnormally flat for my tastes. (Wish I had figured this out before I bought 20 of them).

The slant of the outboard saddles WAS the original "compensation" tool, even before people started bending saddle screws. As I see it.

Steely_Ken
February 7th, 2012, 09:01 AM
Old School is just bend the screw.

bo
February 7th, 2012, 05:50 PM
Old School is just bend the screw.

This! You'll need a fine point grease pen (or other similar marker), tuner, large blade regular (i.e.

gtrguru
February 7th, 2012, 06:52 PM
Sounds like a testament for a six-saddle bridge to me!

Who let this guy in? Can't the moderators block the 6 saddle junkies? LOL

telex76
February 8th, 2012, 01:29 PM
Giving the saddle height adjustment screw an eighth, quarter or even half a turn isn't going to change your string height enough to notice. Thats usually all it takes to get the intonation pretty dang close.

boris bubbanov
February 8th, 2012, 02:19 PM
Giving the saddle height adjustment screw an eighth, quarter or even half a turn isn't going to change your string height enough to notice. Thats usually all it takes to get the intonation pretty dang close.

Yeah. You may have to fudge the string height a little, and accept less than dead perfect intonation but then again there never IS such a thing as a totally in tune board, all over the place and all 6 strings. We sometimes discover in our quest for better intonation that we can get the guitar MORE playable while fussing with it as well, and that's a double reward

I just want to encourage people to be the test pilot and keep on trying. Don't give so quickly; keep fighting, you have not crashed yet. I really don't like putting people down who just got discouraged and just appear to give up. Nick was just mentioning that the big Gotoh brass bridges are half a POUND of weight. That's, that's not acceptable on many guitars, all that added weight. And I like the Quote about that vintage 6 saddle bridge being a Rattlesnake. I might use that for my signature. :grin:

brians356
February 17th, 2012, 08:08 PM
For my Highway One I bought some compensated brass saddles. They got it close, but not close enough for me (I'm a fanatic about intonation.) I found I still needed to make fine adjustments, but not enough to require bending the adjustment screws. It occurred to me the screw is not an extremely tight fit through the saddle, and there is a little bit of wiggle available. In addition, one can gain a little bit of length change by moving the entire saddle sideways (closer or farther from it's neighbors) without messing up the string spacing enough to worry about. So here's how I do it:

Having done all this, and gotten the intonation to my liking, I have obtained a Fender 6-saddle bridge (from a Forum member) I intend to put on there some day, as I am more concerned with exact and easy intonation than any (highly questionable) difference in tone.

Brian

February 20th, 2012, 12:28 PM
The 3-barrel style bridge will never intonate properly and "close" is not good enough for me.

Steely_Ken
February 20th, 2012, 12:47 PM
OR...I like the Glendale saddles with cut sides

brians356
February 20th, 2012, 01:12 PM
As long as they intonate to your satisfaction, great.

As Arlo Guthrie once said, once you take LSD you realize there's no such thing as "in tune." (Or words to that effect, I wouldn't know.)

Brian

jefrs
February 20th, 2012, 02:46 PM
Yes, I discovered this myself, long before the interweb, but it is no big secret.
The saddle height adjustment does go some way towards compensating the intonation on a tele barrel saddle. Problem is it messes with the action.

But you'd be surprised how much a quarter turn of the height screw makes to the difference in intonation between the pair. Lowering the string means less pulling sharp, so you set one string spot-on and with the other a little sharp, then lower that one. With luck this can also be used to radius the strings correctly over the fretboard. You do have to use a Peterson strobe, on chromatic, not sweetened, and not just at 12th fret.

brians356
February 20th, 2012, 02:56 PM
I rely on my ears, but do cross check with a good old StroboConn.

Yeah, string height changes are a way to fine tune saddle intonation, but too much luck is involved if each string's height is also critical. The ideal situation is when the string's desired height change also produces the desired tuning change, but that's a crap shoot ain't it?