Lead singer blues.....

We recently lost our singer. We tried to carry on without for a while withoutt one. We're all pretty decent singers but finally we decided it was best to get a real front person. I've been coordinating the ads, interviews, auditions. I didn't know there were so many open collared, gold chain wearin, balding with pony tail dudes out there looking to take over an existing band and make it his own personal backup group for his "act". Oy vey.

Finally found a lady who's trying out next week. Good credentials. Seems very cool. Wish me luck.

Auditioning lead singers - I can't think of a worse nightmare for an existing band. Good luck with that! Hope you find one that doesn't have an insufferable ego and thinks the band should be renamed after them.

Keep us posted on the progress plz...

So sad, funny and unfortunately true!

Good luck!

You've got a tough situation. Unless you are Carlos Santana or Jeff Beck it's unlikely that the new singer wont drive the material played more than anyone else in the band. I think the trick is to find someone who is both a good singer and reasonably close in taste to the rest of the band.

I'm a mediocre singer but I front because it allows me to do the material I want to do. If I happened to find a good singer who was close to me in musical taste I'd be more than happy to be just the guitar player, but that hasn't happened.

If you really want someone to come in and sing what you tell them to sing and not stamp their own personality on the band...then just what DO you want in a frontperson?

If you are all decent singers then why are you even looking for a singer?

I do want someone to come in and bring something new. We're open to new material. Absolutely we are. We want something fresh. Want I don't want is some cheesy guy who wants to use this as an opportunity to make it "his'" band. We want someone who will want to be 1/5 of a 5 person band. Not someone who wants to turn us into the "and the"in a "Johnny and the........" situation.

Yes we're all good singers but we sort of felt that having a front person would allow us to focus on music more and engage a crowd more. We're sort of trying to get off a plateau that we have been stuck on so we can take it up a peg or two. It just seems that out of the bunch that have applied only about 2 (1 guy 1 girl) have not been goofball egomaniac Lounge singer types.

I'm very excited about the next one up though. I've had a few chats with her and heard her material. She definitely brings the rock. And seems like a cool person. So we'll see.

We're in the very same process, but we're looking for a female lead singer.
Many Celine Dion ripoffs (which imho does not imply they're worse that the real one :wink:).

Your experience with the pony tailed guys remind me of a joke I recently heard: What do lead singers use as anti conception?


Answer: their personality :lol:

Ah, lead singers! I think over the last 45 years or so, there were 2 or 3 that weren't, at best, a minor PITA. It's an almost unavoidable consequence of the lead singer standing in the main spotlight that the audience gets the impression that it's his or her band, and all too often so does the singer -- even if you're spoon-feeding them the arrangements and harmonies and covering up their bad sense of timing!

[Provocative part of this post: For the average non-musician fan, I think a majority of them think its Robert Plant and Led Zepelin, Mick and the Stones, What's-His-Name and Van Halen. :wink:]

Sorry to get off on a rant, but I'm in a 4-piece band now (2 guitars, bass drums) where everyone sings. The other three guys are legit lead singers, and I have really good pitch, just not a distinctive voice. We all take turns singing, and work hard to do a lot of 3 and 4-part harmonies. It gives it much more of a band feel. I haven't been as happy in a band in years, and the crowd seems to enjoy trying to figure out who will sing the next song. (I remember my older sister writing the names of the Beatle singing each song on the album cover for "Meet the Beatles!")

So, a constructive comment to wrap up: if the lady who seems nice doesn't work out, consider adding another musician (I'd look for a Hammond B3 player as long as we're daydreaming here) with a really good voice and challenge everyone else to step up their vocals too. Vocal chords are muscles that get better with effort. So are our ears. Which ever way you go, good luck!!

I agree and my ad specified that I really wanted a musician (specifically keys....although I'm the keys man). But only 2 people replied that play something. Btw, she is one of them. She plays guitar. We'll all still sing some. But I think the new person will do the lions share. Worse case scenerio we carry on as is.....which ain't so bad. We're doin a show as 4 this Saturday.

Ugh.

the single worst thing about any band I've ever been in, is a lead singer who cant play an instrument.

Ugh.

the single worst thing about any band I've ever been in, is a lead singer who cant play an instrument.

Agreed.

Ideally, what I'd like to find is a gorgeous female singer, who can belt out lead vocals, rock the keyboards, double on trumpet (we already have a sax), can write horn arrangements and be able to carry one of our PA cabs, by herself. Asking too much?

Lead singers quite often suffer from the Proximity Effect.
Anytime their head gets close to a microphone, their brain scrambles.

Agreed.

Ideally, what I'd like to find is a gorgeous female singer, who can belt out lead vocals, rock the keyboards, double on trumpet (we already have a sax), can write horn arrangements and be able to carry one of our PA cabs, by herself. Asking too much?


No... in Fantasyland.


Ever watch American Idol? See all those people auditioning? Why do they want that? "Because WOW i can be a star and not have to deal with the fact that I dont have any real musical skill and I dont really have any real music experience either"

THOSE are the kinds of people that audition for live bands too.

Altho many of them would secretly prefer karaoke night... because then they dont have to share the stage with anybody... its all about THE SINGER you know :lol:

Its kind of funny to me to be even going through all this...mainly because I consider myself a singer 1st... guitarist 2nd and a keyboard player 3rd. I love to sing more than anything. But...I'm not really a great crowd whipper upper. Nor are any of my 3 other compatriots. For a bar band thats trying to get a following...because we all know thats what gets gigs....its pretty important.

I've only worked with 2 non instrument playing singers in my music career. The first one, threw up in the men's room before my first bar gig ever...many many moons ago. He never went on, and I had to cover him, because I was the only one who knew the words. We had a great night and I've been singing since.

The other...was the woman that just left my current band. She was never a diva, but was more of a backup singer, and occaisionally took the lead. She never even spoke into the mic other than to sing. Her drama was related to other things.

Hmmm...someone who can front your band, sing all your tunes and not change the direction of the band with their own musical tastes. That's a tall order. You might want to check with Mr. Roarke on Fantasy Island for that one. :lol:

I've worked with a lot of front men and women. As for load ins and outs, there's plenty of lighter weight stuff that women can carry (and I've worked with a few that could probably beat me up!). The one gear loading exception I've been perfectly fine with is having a charismatic front person go out after the show and REALLY work the room with PR and fan base building stuff in a way that really matters; some of these opportunities are lost if the PR is supposed to happen after all is loaded up and stowed away. Doesn't excuse the load IN though.

I prefer the acoustic-electric guitar playing front person when I can get it. Sans that (I have, umm, issues with most digital keys... can't help it, I'm a snob...), no reason why a front person shouldn't be interested in adding some useful and effective percussion now and then when it actually adds to the sound.

The one gear loading exception I've been perfectly fine with is having a charismatic front person go out after the show and REALLY work the room with PR and fan base building stuff in a way that really matters; some of these opportunities are lost if the PR is supposed to happen after all is loaded up and stowed away. Doesn't excuse the load IN though.



Thats a very good point. Thanks. Although, my old singer never did that.

There is a proximity effect with microphones.

If you have them in proximity to your head for an extended period of time it makes your head go soft.

----------------------

I would suggest going out and seeing a lot of bands, when you see a singer you like approach them about joining your band. Who knows, they may be sick of the one they are in.

Unfortunately, a good frontperson makes all of the difference. Unless you are playing to a bunch of dudes with their arms crossed most people pay attention to the singer.

A friend of mine is a director and he gave me a bit of casting advice... Don't hire a**holes no matter how good they are.

I recently met a woman who had band experience, looked good and by all accounts has a good voice and plays a little guitar and maybe something else. Unfortunately, she's never made it to a single rehearsal. I guess she's just not interested and can't seem to say it. On the other hand, we're getting so good as a three piece that I don't know if I even want another person in the band.

Man, all this lead-singer bashing seems to have just a sprinkle of envy on top...:lol:

Vocals make the band for better or worse. A good set of pipes will carry the most mediocre of ensembles, and a bad frontman will send people packing, doesn't matter what the rest of the band sounds like. It's worth putting in the time to find the right one, even if you have to go through a dozen before you find one and have put up with a little B$ in the end.

And bashing vocalists that don't play an instrument????? Robert Plant?? Mick Jagger?? Roger Daltrey??

You all are nuts. Vocal cords are absolutely an instrument my friends.

Mick Jagger & Roger Daltrey both play multiple instruments.

Mick Jagger & Roger Daltrey both play multiple instruments.

I'm sure that's true, I threw out the first three "front men" that popped in my head. Point was more in reference to the absurdity of the notion that someone who "just sings" and doesn't "play something" is somehow less musically talented or knowledgeable or legitimate of an artist.

Would be like a sculptor saying all those oil-painting, pastoral themed Frenchies are total wannabes since everyone knows sculptors are the REAL artists.

Well,,,,, who was the lead singer in the Band ? They all (except Robbie ) sang lead at times, and each had a distinctive and effective singing style, or for that matter what about the Beatles ? Same thing, maybe you should use what you have now, and not worry about finding a "lead singer" .

Man, all this lead-singer bashing seems to have just a sprinkle of envy on top...

Vocals make the band for better or worse. A good set of pipes will carry the most mediocre of ensembles, and a bad frontman will send people packing, doesn't matter what the rest of the band sounds like. It's worth putting in the time to find the right one, even if you have to go through a dozen before you find one and have put up with a little B$ in the end.

And bashing vocalists that don't play an instrument????? Robert Plant?? Mick Jagger?? Roger Daltrey??

You all are nuts. Vocal cords are absolutely an instrument my friends.

I'm sure that's true, I threw out the first three "front men" that popped in my head. Point was more in reference to the absurdity of the notion that someone who "just sings" and doesn't "play something" is somehow less musically talented or knowledgeable or legitimate of an artist.

Would be like a sculptor saying all those oil-painting, pastoral themed Frenchies are total wannabes since everyone knows sculptors are the REAL artists.

And Plant played some pretty mean blooze harp.

Personal preferences don't necessarily constitute "bashing" by default. We're all free to like and dislike as we choose, that's what makes the world go 'round. I prefer acts with lots of vocal harmonies to those fronted by a single voice; although I have tremendous respect for them, I've never been crazy about solo acts; I prefer front persons that can contribute on a certain level instrumentally, particularly in acts that feature some improvisation and interplay. Some folks more readily identify with that front person with the hand-held mic, I don't.

Agreed, the human voice is an instrument unto itself, arguably the highest one to aspire to. Which is why my preference is to work with instrumentalists that also sing.

Ugh.

the single worst thing about any band I've ever been in, is a lead singer who cant play an instrument.

Agreed.


I was referring to this, not the thread as a whole. And I'm totally on board, having someone who can play and sing is twice as good in a band, I just think the whole "drummers are like this", "front men are like this" "people who only sing or only play key-tar are like this" type of conversation is comical.

It's the pot calling the kettle black. All musicians, regardless of what instrument they play (or sing) are pains in the a$$, think that they're always right and let everyone know it (myself, admittedly, included.) It's one of the joys of being an artist...if you don't think you're the best, no way anyone else will. Only difference with musicians as opposed to other types of artists, is that we're forced to work together, and it usually makes for frustrating, but completely enjoyable circumstances. We wouldn't keep doing it otherwise

I was referring to this, not the thread as a whole. And I'm totally on board, having someone who can play and sing is twice as good in a band, I just think the whole "drummers are like this", "front men are like this" "people who only sing or only play key-tar are like this" type of conversation is comical.

It's the pot calling the kettle black. All musicians, regardless of what instrument they play (or sing) are pains in the a$$, think that they're always right and let everyone know it (myself, admittedly, included.) It's one of the joys of being an artist...if you don't think you're the best, no way anyone else will. Only difference with musicians as opposed to other types of artists, is that we're forced to work together, and it usually makes for frustrating, but completely enjoyable circumstances. We wouldn't keep doing it otherwise



nah, you're dead wrong.

sorry.

singers are the worst, by far.

especially singers that cant play anything.

nah, you're dead wrong.

sorry.

singers are the worst, by far.

especially singers that cant play anything.

I'm not wrong, you're wrong. I'm the best so I can't be wrong. Besides, says so in your name.

I'm going to go throw stuff at my bass player. Bass players are the worst.

We have been friends for over 20 years, three years ago we started out as a duo both playing guitar and sharing the vocals. If a song required anything more than cowboy chords or if it was difficult to play and sing I would play whilst my friend sang. Then somehow we accumulated another guitarist, bassist and drummer (again long time friends who all sing). So he is now lead vocalist and has discarded his guitar. I'm still singing lead one some numbers (I generally sing an octave lower so some numbers suit me better) and the other (female) guitarist takes a few numbers during which time he leaves the stage. It just feels wrong. Mine are all songs we used to do as a duo so the guitar is not beyond him (Mustang Sally, Midnight Hour, Hallelujah I love her so, I knew the bride, Rescue Me, etc) three or four chord stuff. I want to sing lead on more stuff, as does the other guitarist, and he encourages us both to do so, but I don't want my mate to spend half the night off stage. So I can understand why you want a singer who also plays an instrument. If we were in this for the money and being hard nosed I would probably say that we had one too many in the band, and one of us had to go (which might well be me), but rehearsal and our gigs are the backbone of our social life. So if you can find a really good singer (and they are few and far between judging by the bands I see) take them, but if not either stay as you are or find another musician who compliments your set up and who may or may not sing.

Sooooo.... After a lengthy parade of folks, last night at our regular rehearsal, comes a knock on the door and in steps the lady that was supposed to audition NEXT week. Well....the date mix up was really my fault but..... we decided to roll with it. After working our way through about 5 or 6 of the tunes we gave her, and 2 or three more that we threw off the cuff, we could tell. She totally brought the rock. I honestly think we were playing better just to keep up. And....she seemed to be pretty normal too. So looks like she's got the gig. We even invited her to come down Saturday to our gig and sit in when she can. I'm excited, but the guys seem really stoked. Even our normally crumudgenny (sorry for the spelling) was smiling.

Wow nice, does sound promising. How did you find her, craigslist?

A lead singer that can totally rock and doesn't have a huge ego.. nice find.. good luck with that!

Mick Jagger & Roger Daltrey both play multiple instruments.

Ladies' naughty bits don't count as instruments.

Wow nice, does sound promising. How did you find her, craigslist?

A lead singer that can totally rock and doesn't have a huge ego.. nice find.. good luck with that!

Yep Craigs. We were pretty stoked. I hope over time it works out.

So she accepted our offer to join the band. Here we go. Let's hope this is our tick to some nicer gigs!

Good luck! It's not easy to find a GOOD singer who doesn't suffer from LVS.
Might want to qualify your search/audition criteria more exactly in your ads.

I'm very excited about the next one up though. I've had a few chats with her and heard her material. She definitely brings the rock. And seems like a cool person. So we'll see.

A rock chick, nice.

Don't forget the pics so we can check her out too. :grin:

[Provocative part of this post: For the average non-musician fan, I think a majority of them think its Robert Plant and Led Zepelin, Mick and the Stones, What's-His-Name and Van Halen. ]

According to Keefs auto-biography, Mick did think it was Mick & the Stones, until Charlie picked him up by the shirt lapels & put him straight. :grin:

According to Keefs auto-biography, Mick did think it was Mick & the Stones, until Charlie picked him up by the shirt lapels & put him straight. :grin:

One of my all-time favorite rock stories! "I'm not your drummer - you're MY singer."

So a little follow up on how this all worked out. So, we brought her in as our singer. Rehearsals going great. We did a few things without her, because she wasn't quite ready.

Finally, yesterday we did our first gig with our new singer. I have to say. She really brought her A game. She was amazing. The gig went off great, she has some set of pipes. Now....we are scurrying back to the drawing board to come up with more tunes to feature her...as well as some different styles that we hadn't before delved into. I am very optomistic that adding her is going to open doors to a lot of venues we hadn't before been able to break into. A good ending to the story for a change.

Good find. I play in a band where the leader's wife is the primary singer and when I joined, I was a little worried since she had only sang karaoke. But, she learn how to call the breaks and do the other things that a singer needs to do to front a blues band.

Well......it was good while it lasted. She sent us a "Dear John" letter over the weekend. Claimed we weren't gigging enough. Truth be told we had been after her for weeks for song ideas that she'd like to sing. She never did it. She barely learned our material. And missed a pile of rehearsals. Should've known better. I'm done with lead singers. Now looking for a keyboard player so I can focus on vocals.

Lead singers who dont play an instrument are 99% of the time, a royal pain in the arse.

Thank you American Idol for furthering the cult of singer worship, and justifying the attitudes of all wannabee divas.

Sorry you had to find out the hard way.

Can't say I'm surprised by the outcome. Lead Singers that do not play instruments have always been and will always be a huge pain in the ass. Sorry this experiment didn't work out.

Good luck...

I need to take some singing lessons.

But...I'm not really a great crowd whipper upper. Nor are any of my 3 other compatriots. For a bar band thats trying to get a following...because we all know thats what gets gigs....its pretty important.

We spend most of our rehearsal time practicing our "spontaneous chatter" and transitions from song to song . . .

Well......it was good while it lasted. She sent us a "Dear John" letter over the weekend. Claimed we weren't gigging enough.

Hmm. Bet she didn't make a single attempt to land any, either. Our former lead singer's reaction was to the same problem was to go out and get about 10 gigs.

She left us after a year and a half, but it was from SERIOUS family problems and a 60 mile round trip on rehearsal nights. We miss her, and hope she can get back on her feet soon.

Well the good news is we have already been approached by a much younger female singer who is a solid functioning guitarist who likes our material and wants us to give a shot. I'm willing to take the chance but with some trepidation. I want a fifth band member and NOT a singer who needs a backing group. I like that she plays guitar.

Homerun Mike!

We had a much younger female singer (myfs) for a while, and it was absolutely perfect while it lasted. Tons of benefits, including bringing a younger crowd and balancing out the old guy factor.

Please forgive me for offering unsolicited advice, but how about having her sing 50% and you guy do the rest.

Wow nice, does sound promising. How did you find her, craigslist?

A lead singer that can totally rock and doesn't have a huge ego.. nice find.. good luck with that!

You just described my wife, who I met when she auditioned for my band 24 years ago. We got married in 2001, and we're still rockin'!

Homerun Mike!

We had a much younger female singer (myfs) for a while, and it was absolutely perfect while it lasted. Tons of benefits, including bringing a younger crowd and balancing out the old guy factor.

Please forgive me for offering unsolicited advice, but how about having her sing 50% and you guy do the rest.

I hope its a homerun. We thought the last one was....but turned out to be a dud. She was a great singer, but I must admit that I was a little bugged when I found out (when a friend recognized her from many years ago) that she was at least 10 years older than she said, and was using a different name. I blew it off figuring...at least she could sing. Who cares if she's a little excentric.

Even if we do get another singer....the guys will likely sing a fair portion of the vocals.

BTW, with me....all well intentioned, unsolicited advice is ALWAYS welcome :smile:

So, tonights we try round 2. One promising thing so far. I sent an email last night before going into the woodshed to practice, to find out what if anything I should work on. Everything on her list is already in our bag o' tricks. Fingers crossed.

Ugh.

the single worst thing about any band I've ever been in, is a lead singer who cant play an instrument.

Voice is an instrument

Singing and fronting (aka ENTERTAINING) is more work than playing an instrument.

If it wasn't, more guitarists would do it themselves.

It's unrealistic to expect someone to carry the lion's share of the work without A LOT of creative input.

That said, most singer/frontmen are total a**-hats.








........

Voice is an instrument


that doesnt change the fact that MOST singers who only sing, and dont play any other kind of an instrument, are complete and total pains in the ass.

chick singers are the worst. I've worked with all too many of them, only two did not succeed in destroying the band from within.

That being said, someone who can sing and play very well at the same time, has my great respect and admiration. Guys like Prince, Hendrix, Elton John, they amaze me.

I play guitar, and I am also a vocalist. Singing properly and well is alot more work than playing on the frets. Seems some of you have some jealousy issues against singers.

I play guitar, and I am also a vocalist. Singing properly and well is alot more work than playing on the frets. Seems some of you have some jealousy issues against singers.

I've sang, fronted bands, played lead and sang AND fronted bands, all at the same time.

Singing is MUCH EASIER than playing lead, and singing requires far less homework. In my opinion, but, I have done both. I've worked with many singers than NEVER did homework, never practiced.. just showed up, opened their mouths, and out it came, a golden voice.

You're not going to get a lot of sympathy from us old farts who've toiled behind a zillion guys like you, who think your job is harder than ours, and you're more important than we are. the term Diva comes quickly to mind.

I'm not wrong, you're wrong. I'm the best so I can't be wrong. Besides, says so in your name.

I'm going to go throw stuff at my bass player. Bass players are the worst.

Thus, my friends, Wrong Note Rod and Chele have reached the height of true discourse in internet forumdom....

it will be difficult to find a more idiotic set of 'points' today, but, I am confident that they will be 'made' and we will all get to read them.

Blow me.

This has been a funny read.


So, OP, is the new chick hot?

This has been a funny read.


So, OP, is the new chick hot?


I suppose, but I don't really feel right answering that, as she's young enough for me to be her dad.

Heh.

Singers are, well, singers. Kinda like the frog and the scorpion story. They're still singers.

And for young Matthew, sure, when you're young and in love (with yourself) you can feel like it's all for one and one for all. Then you meet a girl singer. Oh, she's great. STOP. No, she has a great voice. Then the trouble starts. I don't know if it's mental or not but let me ask you, how many sane people do you know that have actually said aloud or to themselves "I think it's a great idea if I pick up a tamborine and play it on this song" and it's not an Archies song? How about "the guys'll love it if I scat here instead of letting the guitar player stretch out". Yeah. The voice is an instrument. There are some instruments best left alone. I know never say say never but; I will never have a bassoon player in my band.

In other words if you don't play, and you're not the one paying me you'd better carry your load. That could be selling CDs, shirts, hats, booking jobs, taking care of the money, etc. It's been 25 years since I used a road crew. I'm pretty sure most of us carry our own stuff so somebody that walks in with only a 58 can help out in other ways.

I'm pretty sure most of us carry our own stuff so somebody that walks in with only a 58 can help out in other ways.
When they walk in with a 357 then I let 'em slide on the monitor hauling.

357, 358, whatever it takes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iX3kxAA2L4Q