Way To Memorize Relative Minors

I tried to use all guitarist but couldn't think of anyone with the intials FD.

C -> Am and C# -> A#M and Cb -> Abm Chet Atkins

G -> Em and Gb -> Ebm GE Smith

D -> Bm and Db -> Bbm Dickey Betts

A -> F#m and Ab -> Fm Ace Frehley

E -> C#m and Eb -> Cm Eric Clapton

B -> G#m and Bb -> Gm Billy Gibbons

F -> Dm and F# -> D#m Fats Domino

You don't need to memorize them. The interval is always the same.

You don't need to memorize them. The interval is always the same.

Ok...then it's a way to memorize the Major 6th interval in each key. Same thing right...or am I missing something.

In a harmonized major scale the 6th is minor. In a minor scale the 6th is major.

I applaud your creativity and I guess whatever works for you but it sure seems unnecessarily complicated to me. There's only 7 to memorize because there's only 7 letter names. And now you've got to remember the names of 7 guitarists as well. Too much work my friend.:mrgreen:

For example using relative minor (or up a maj 6th):

If the key is some form of 'C' (ie, C, C#, Cb, or even C## or Cbb) the relative minor is always going to be some kind of 'A' because "A" is always 6 letter names up from 'C' regardless of #'s or b's.

Likewise for all other letter name relationships.

Up a maj 6th from any kind of 'B' will always be some kind of 'G'.

Up a maj 6th from any kind of 'F' will always be some kind of 'D'.

And as I've said there's only 7 of those to memorize for each of all the intervals.

It is cool if those chord tones remind you of the guitarist name! Something to reach for when you need a good sounding "betts" or "chet".

Have to say I'm in the MJ and Boney boat on this one.

I know somebasic theory - enough to be considered very ignorant! And everybody learns differently but for me understanding the intervals as served me very well!....As well as I can be served as a hobby hackster :mrgreen:.

KC

3 frets down is a lot easier to remember than going 9 frets up.
Think about a barred "D major" on the 5th fret, its minor is B on the 2nd fret.

For people my age and those who are familiar with some of the 60s music, the way I found the relative minor back when my theory was a lot weaker than it is now, I used the opening for "Little Red Riding Hood" by Sam the Sham and the Pharaohs or the lick in Joe Cocker's version of "A Little Help From My Friends" after the pause and just before "Do you need anybody?" Both licks start on the tonic and end up on the root of the relative minor so it is one way I navigated to the right note. I, too, think it's more work to memorize 6 guitarists and a New Orleans piano player than to learn an interval.

3 frets down is a lot easier to remember than going 9 frets up.
Think about a barred "D major" on the 5th fret, its minor is B on the 2nd fret.

Yeah but we're not necessarily talking about guitar playing, we're talking music theory. Two different things. Music is not strictly a guitar-centric activity (at least it shouldn't be:mrgreen:) If you need to have a guitar in your hands or even if you have to visualize a guitar fretboard to know how to find a relative minor then you are at a disadvantage in my opinion.

But relating your '3 frets down' example to intervals, yes, you can definitely count a minor 3rd down and arrive at the same letter name.

Here's a helpful thing to remember: when naming intervals all we're doing is counting letter names. Not frets. Not spaces between notes. Not pitches. Just letter names.

And as a result of remembering that we can simplify the whole matter.

For example from any kind of 'C' to any kind of 'E' is always going to be some kind of 3rd because 'C' and 'E' are always 3 letters apart regardless of #'s and b's.

So given the map above I can instantly know that any kind of 3rd above 'F##' ,for example, is going to be some kind of 'A' because 'F' and 'A' are 3 letter names apart.

For me that's the easiest roadmap through this stuff.

That went over like a dead fish. Oh well...it helps me and I just thought I'd share.

:smile:"For example from any kind of 'C' to any kind of 'E' is always going to be some kind of 3rd because 'C' and 'E' are always 3 letters apart regardless of #'s and b's."

As long as its understood that the letters are scale tones. :smile:

:smile:"For example from any kind of 'C' to any kind of 'E' is always going to be some kind of 3rd because 'C' and 'E' are always 3 letters apart regardless of #'s and b's."

As long as its understood that the letters are scale tones. :smile:

Well, we are talking about music right.:lol:

We've specifically been talking about naming things and not about what those names represent on an instrument (frets, keys,valves) or what their auditory representation is.

Yes. I hope the OP gets something out of this discussion.

Knowing that Am and C share two notes (C and E), and by extension all relative min/maj's have two common tones is far more beneficial than the method of knowing it. Knowing that helps you understand why it's useful.

Or how about this one? The only minor triad built off scale tones which contains the tonic is the vi. Go through all the minors. The one which contains the note naming the chord whose relative minor you want is it.

I remember like this, if I forget:

Play the Major chord on the A (5th) string; eg C = x35553

Rel minor 1st pos is from E string at bottom of the chord; eg 5th fret

555555
887778

I have trouble remembering kids names, too... even if they are related..... ;)

I use my fingers to count letters to six, then hope I'm not flat or sharp.

That went over like a dead fish. Oh well...it helps me and I just thought I'd share.

It made me think about something that I would not normally think about, so I appreciate it.

So, could I play me some Billy Gibbons in the key of Dickey Betts?

Hmm. I can't think of an F. D. guitarist either.

That went over like a dead fish. Oh well...it helps me and I just thought I'd share.

AD, i think these discussions are great! It wasn't a dead fish at all!

It's started conversation the gave me some additional insight to the relative minors!

Thanks for putting it out there and to all the others who jumped in!

This has become my favorite part of the forum!

KC

Knowing that Am and C share two notes (C and E), and by extension all relative min/maj's have two common tones is far more beneficial than the method of knowing it. Knowing that helps you understand why it's useful.
I believe the relative minor is a key, not a chord.

The relative minor key shares all of the same notes, eg, key of C and key of Am.

The relative minor is both a key and a chord.

But aren't there several relative minor chords?
In C, there is Dm, Em, and Am

Yes, but THE relative minor of a tonic is the vi chord.

Ok, so there is the relative minor chord.

Didn't know that. Is it because it is the key chord in the relative minor scale?

Ok, so there is the relative minor chord.

Didn't know that. Is it because it is the key chord in the relative minor scale?

Probably because it is the most closely related diatonic minor triad to the tonic major triad. As Ken pointed out the relative maj/min share two notes in common. The two other diatonic minor triads are certainly related to the tonic major triad because they are in the same key but they are not nearly as closely related in terms of sharing common notes. That's probably why the VIm is called the relative minor.

The only minor triad built with scale tones which contains the tonic. Key of C - Dm = DFA; Em = EGB, Am = ACE.

Em shares two notes though?

edit - just noticed, only Am has a C in it

It isn't the sharing of notes. The only one that has a C is Am.

It isn't the sharing of notes. The only one that has a C is Am.

That makes the most sense.

But....if two triads are going to share two notes that will make the most 'relatedness' it would be the R and 3rd. So the 'C' nails it and the 3rd puts the icing on the cake in terms of the strength of relationship. (I think that makes some sense, doesn't it?)

Does to me. How about this for a definition: "The note naming a minor chord's third is the note naming its relative major." Or, "The note naming the root of a chord names the third of its relative minor."

I was fooling around with this idea a while back but really didn't get it right away that the relative scale to the F minor scale was A major.

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=10530096

I was fooling around with this idea a while back but really didn't get it right away that the relative scale to the F minor scale was A major.

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=10530096

Did you mean to say Ab Major?

Ed

Or F# minor.

Did you mean to say Ab Major?

Ed

No I meant to say F#minor. :oops:

I tried to use all guitarist but couldn't think of anyone with the intials FD.

C -> Am and C# -> A#M and Cb -> Abm Chet Atkins

G -> Em and Gb -> Ebm GE Smith

D -> Bm and Db -> Bbm Dickey Betts

A -> F#m and Ab -> Fm Ace Frehley

E -> C#m and Eb -> Cm Eric Clapton

B -> G#m and Bb -> Gm Billy Gibbons

F -> Dm and F# -> D#m Fats Domino

I am giving this to one of my guitar students. He is just getting into improvisation and these would be great pneumonic devices for him- Thanks!

I am giving this to one of my guitar students. He is just getting into improvisation and these would be great pneumonic devices for him- Thanks!

That's cool. Also it might inspire him to find out who those guys are if he's a youngin' who doesn't know.

f d frank dorittke

Ss9Z4Vj2mrY

f d frank dorittke

Ss9Z4Vj2mrY

Here's the original song CohG31ecYfA (couldn't abide the cover version)


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