JUST POSTED! 2011 Build Challenge -- Official Rules and Details -- Don't miss out!

The 2011 Build Challenge will be starting on March 1, 2011. On March 1st I will post the way you will be required to prove that you are starting on that date. So, starting early will not be possible -- so don't even try. You'll be required to show all the raw wood used in the build with the proof of the date.

Here are the rules this year.* Sorry if this is too difficult, too short or the wrong time of year. Deal with it. No whining!

1. You will be required to build both a body and a neck from scratch. No purchased/owned necks for 2011.

2. The contest will last 2 months. The contest ends May 3, 2011 (our 12th Anniversary).

3. The body must have a obvious resemblance to a Telecaster shape -- everything else about the guitar can be different than a Telecaster. It must have a finish -- no bare wood.

4. There is no limit to the amount of money you can spend. But you must do all the work yourself and document all the work in your thread, as well.

5. All members will be required to post a video (60 sec minimum length) by noon Central Standard US Time May 3, 2011 of the guitar being played -- if electric through an amplifier -- with sound on YouTube. A special YouTube Channel will be set up for this. Don't have a video camera? Find a friend with a camcorder or a camera or a cell phone with video capabilities. We want to know your guitar works, stays in tune and plays. It does not have to be you playing the guitar in the video. No video... and you'll be disqualified.

6. One winner and two-runner ups will be selected by the membership. Multiple criteria will be used in the judging. The criteria will include final product outcome, work process thread, choice of parts utilized, inventiveness and beauty. Final product outcome scores will count double, all other scores are counted once. In other words the final guitar outcome, in total, will be more highly weighted than any other single criteria.

7. One entry per member please. Once a member starts a build thread he may not start another or document the build of more than one guitar in a build thread.

We will have a separate forum for your build threads -- You must start your build thread by midnight on March 1st in this new forum once it appears. So decide now if you are in or not. No late entries.

The Grand Prize will be a Fender Mustang III Amplifier (100 watt / 12" speaker) (http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fender-Mustang-III-100W-1x12-Guitar-Combo-Amp?sku=H70085). 2nd Place Prize a Fender Mustang II Amplifier (40 watt / 12" speaker) (http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fender-Mustang-II-40W-1x12-Guitar-Combo-Amp?sku=H61790) and a Fender Mustang I Amp (20 watt / 8" speaker) (http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fender-Mustang-I-20W-1x8-Guitar-Combo-Amp?sku=H61791) for third place.

Yes, we are making it more difficult this year. It's our 3rd year and we want to see what works best. So, this year it's the all important "difficult" year. If it doesn't work out as well, we'll change it next year.

* These rules are subject to change -- based upon any unforeseen problems that arise.

Sweet.
I'll be in.

-josh

competing against CNC's and money is going to be tough on me, a 100 watt amp is a cool prize though

Just like when I run marathons, I am going to be a winner by finishing this one. The chance to get feedback from this group on my project is worth the price of admission. (Which will still be just $211 for me cause I am cheap. :razz:)
Now I need to find someone in the DC area with a planer and joiner. :sad:
Patrick

Is there a definition for the judging criteria for #1 and #3?

1. "final product outcome" (what does this mean?) This is 2/5 of the total judgement...

2. "work process thread" (self explanitory)

3. "choice of parts utilized" ... How will this be scored? What parts get a higher score?
(does Mare Pickups, Callaham, Rutters and Glendale hardware trump GFS and Fender hardware and pickups?)

4. "inventiveness and beauty"

I have mixed reactions to the no dollar limit... that seems to open the floodgates for the rich kids to outspend the people with less money.

Is there a definition for the judging criteria for #1 and #3?

1. "final product outcome" (what does this mean?) This is 2/5 of the total judgement...

2. "work process thread" (self explanitory)

3. "choice of parts utilized" ... How will this be scored? What parts get a higher score?
(does Mare Pickups, Callaham, Rutters and Glendale hardware trump GFS and Fender hardware and pickups?)

4. "inventiveness and beauty"

I have mixed reactions to the no dollar limit... that seems to open the floodgates for the rich kids to outspend the people with less money.

Yeah. This. No dollar limit is a bit of a mistake, IMHO. That said I do think that the prizes make it somewhat self-limiting. No one wants to spend $2100.00 to win a grand prize of a $300 amp.

The pickups/quality of parts question is another one worth visiting, except, I think, that much of what's being sold today in guitar parts is really snake oil.
Truth will out. People should just make the best guitars they can. If a person doesn't win, he or she should be proud of their work.

If, and I am saying its a big if.. if I do win or even place I'm not keeping the amp. I'm going to donate it to a local high school music program that might need it.

That said, I'm probably not going to win.:mrgreen::lol::lol:

Oh well, I wish everyone luck. I think this is going to be a great contest.

Bajaa's Dad

So one of the Master Builders from the Custom Shop can enter?

Is there a definition for the judging criteria for #1 and #3?

3. "choice of parts utilized" ... How will this be scored? What parts get a higher score?
(does Mare Pickups, Callaham, Rutters and Glendale hardware trump GFS and Fender hardware and pickups?)


Way I read it is that imaginative/resourceful use of parts will trump the "throwing money at it" approach.

Just let me be the first to predict that Scatter Lee will win it thanks to the tailpiece and bridge fabricated out of old Buick parts taken from the stomach of a gator that he's gonna drag up from underneath his house.:twisted::cool:

Well the "build your own neck" deal puts me out of the competition. And I have spent the last 5 weekends digging through old houses looking for free lumber for the challenge.:sad:

I know, I know. No whining. Maybe next year.

Thanks for the comments:

No Cost Limits. Since everyone has to build a a body and neck from scratch the remaining parts are pretty much commodities. How much more can someone spend on these remaining parts? And, even if they did spend a fortune it may have no impact on the outcome anyway.

"competing against CNC's and money is going to be tough" This has nothing to do with the tools being used -- just as in the $100 limit during the first contest it made no difference whether the body was made with a dremmel tool or a CNC -- tools have NEVER been part of the cost equation.

Final Product Outcome ===> The guitar that gets made. In the end it will all be about the final guitar that is produced.

Choice of parts utilized. Every guitar is the sum total of it's parts, it's spec sheet. We choose the guitars we like and dislike by the choices a manufacturer's spec sheet. This is no different.

Inventiveness and Beauty -- two criteria hold over from last year. Totally subjective. But something really clever or really beautiful can make up for other short comings.

I think when you study it, this will be a harder build all the way around. And, the winners will be judged by not only their final guitar's looks, but it's sound and playability.

This build will require people to make the BEST guitar they can make. Simple as that. Not the best $100 guitar. Or the best parts you can assemble for $200.

Hope this helps. If I'm missing something -- let me know. I'm always willing to reconsider these things. It's not rocket science. I just make it up as I go along.

So one of the Master Builders from the Custom Shop can enter?

Please point out which part of the rules last year, or the year before that precluded this from happening during the last two Build Challenges?

Well the "build your own neck" deal puts me out of the competition.

I labored hard over this decision. It was either do it this way, or have two contests. And, darn it, it's a build challenge. Building a neck is really a challenge. So I went with it for this year.

Perhaps next year I won't.

Please point out which part of the rules last year, or the year before that precluded this from happening during the last two Build Challenges?

The spend limit. People who build for a living are not likely to advertise to the world that they can build a supurb guitar for only $200. I think this has been the reason why the "pro builders" of the TDPRI have been absent from the competitions.

By not limiting materials costs a builder could take a photo essay of an actual Custom Shop build and enter it. Maybe that'll up the ante, but maybe it'll make those pondering entry balk.

That said - maybe we'll get some of the pro builder in now there's no limits. They probably have a build to do during that time span - all they have to do is take photos. :grin:

I labored hard over this decision. It was either do it this way, or have two contests. And, darn it, it's a build challenge. Building a neck is really a challenge. So I went with it for this year.

Perhaps next year I won't.

Oh I understand, just kinda bummed. I can't wait to watch though :grin:

So one of the Master Builders from the Custom Shop can enter?
I say - bring 'em on... I would love to see how they did their work. Win or not, I think everyone wins if they are building a guitar they would use.

I did have a couple of questions:
1) What if I wanted to make a Tele with a Strat lower bout? It's a pretty small tweak on the shape, but one that I wanted to build next.

2) If I change my plan on the HW/Pickups or maybe decide to do a maple cap after I get started... Are those kinds of changes OK after we have started? Or, do we need to have a fairly detailed plan and stick to it?
I ask because I'm pretty sure I'll be winding my own pickups and likely making my own bridge, but I'm not sure how that's going to work out time-wise - I may want to put most of my time into a set neck rather than finishing my winder...

I think I'm in this year. I've been working on a house remodel and that is wrapping up so I will get my work space, and time, back and the timing is pretty good for me. I plan on making some new jigs too - I have an idea on a neck back contour duplicator as well as needing to remake some jigs that I would like to improve...

...
This build will require people to make the BEST guitar they can make. ...

That is going to be pretty cool - we have some great builders here and I would love to see what everyone is capable of.

Are pre-slotted (stewmac) fingerboards acceptable if the rest of the neck is still made.

Does this cause a problem since they are preslotted/radiused? This will be my first build and I wanted to use the build off as my catalyst to get me going. Thanks!

Well the "build your own neck" deal puts me out of the competition. And I have spent the last 5 weekends digging through old houses looking for free lumber for the challenge.:sad:

I know, I know. No whining. Maybe next year.

You can do it! ...Go for it !
Buy a slotted radiused fretboard from Stewmac for $14, that takes all the intimidating work out of a neck. If you can build a body you can build a neck.

You can do it! ...Go for it !
Buy a slotted radiused fretboard from Stewmac for $14, that takes all the intimidating work out of a neck. If you can build a body you can build a neck.

Thats the thing. I have never built either :oops: I had planned on using this build challenge to push me into building my first guitar but I think building a guitar AND neck with nothing but a drill, a dremmel, a jigsaw and sand paper in two months is a little ambitious. I appreciate the encouragement though, I plan to build one anyways it just wont meet the challenge requirements. Best of luck to everyone entering. I love this time of the year.

You can do it! ...Go for it !
Buy a slotted radiused fretboard from Stewmac for $14, that takes all the intimidating work out of a neck. If you can build a body you can build a neck.

This put us overseas at an disadvantage, the cheapest I can get a slotted fretboard is somewhere around $75 and quality is... well, so-so

Making the neck is no problem but getting a workable neck with all the slots right might be a bit tough for a beginner in the allowed timespan, one of the conditions IS that it should be "tunable and sound".

I've really been looking forward to doing this competition, I've followed the others with keen interest and collected things for my Tele-build, but I think I have to sit this one out.

Edit:
One solution would be to get help with the slotting, but that violates rule 4

I don't have too many objections to the rules. The prizes seem a little, um, heavy for any potential international winners. Usual freight unpaid deal applies I presume?

This put us overseas at an disadvantage, the cheapest I can get a slotted fretboard is somewhere around $75 and quality is... well, so-so


Stew mac's slotted and radiused boards are $20. $12 for maple. How much do you get stung at customs? Ouch.

A ruler, a mitre box and a saw is all you need. Seriously - 95% of guitar building is bravery, 5% is skill :grin:. Everyone here who's built a few guitars knows just how much easier it was after it's finished compared to before it was started. This phenomenon exists and fuels Guitar Building Addiction - once you realise how easy it is, suddenly you can have every guitar you ever wanted, customised to your requirements ... and have fun building them. It will snowball. Win/win.

It's much easier than you think :wink:.

I have GBA. Things sound OK with the rules. We've seen a lot of cool builds since the first contest. The body has to look like a tele.... can that be exaggerated like a telemaster shape or it has to be "the" tele shape? I think coming up with a new and unique idea will be harder than anything else here. It would also be nice to see a rubric of how the scoring will be done beforehand if that is possible.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubric_(academic))

Don't fret!!
If one is truly nervous aout making a fretted neck, you could go fretless.
Having to make a neck opens up new possibilities like a Turkish saz tele. The saz instruments have adjustable frets made of fishing line tied around the neck.

I'm not opposed to thinking outside of the box.

As a new builder who's been using this challenge as an excuse to put off starting his first build, I have to say that I welcome the "no spending limits" rule.

For example, one potential project is a twelve string. 12 tuners cost twice as much and I don't want to screw with finding something on ebay or whatever, or using POS tuners I'm going to replace after the build anyway. So, the cost of tuners is pretty substantial if the limit is only $200 or whatever. As a first build I'm still going to try to keep material costs low, but I don't have to "worry" about it from a build standpoint.

As for building a neck... I had planned on that anyway. One option is to make the neck pocket a standard size so a bolt on neck will fit if it all goes wrong. One of my potential project doesn't fit that criteria but the others all do.

Now the question is which of many projects do I choose? I had already started gathering parts for two different projects, but I'm also considering a third now that spending limits are off. Well, third and fourth actually... what to do, what to do...

I'll probably be in this year's challenge. I already have the jigs and templates built so I can concentrate on the guitar and not-so-much all of the prep work like last year. I've a couple ideas stirring around in my head. First things first. Gotta go and shovel a path to my workroom - then shovel the workroom too.

I want to enter this year but I don't think I can with school, I'm definitely going to be watching this closely though (if nothing else it helps me learn everyones secrets).

Who will the judges be?

Perhaps as a fund raising measure any member who does not participate in the challenge can buy a spot on the judging panel... for say $25.00.

competing against CNC's and money is going to be tough on me, a 100 watt amp is a cool prize though

Hmmm. I think I'd bet on you winning over the CNC+money any day

Let me answer some of these questions:

Custom Shop / Pro Builders -- Since they've always been allowed and welcome in the past, I'd say we'll have exactly the same number this year as we had in previous years.

Slotted Fretboard -- first I wasn't aware it existed. But, I just said you had to build the neck, I made no mention of frets or fingerboards. So, I can't see how it's a problem.

Slotted Fretboards cost too much -- see the no cost limit rule.

Tele body -- I'll go with what we had last year, it can be a variation on a Tele theme. But we have to see the resemblance to a Tele in it -- and I doubt you'd win over many votes from members here if it's not Tele enough, though.

What if I change my plans? -- You don't file a flight plan in advance. It's your guitar do whatever you want. Change your mind every day.

Judges -- as I said in the rules -- "One winner and two-runner ups will be selected by the membership."

well I think I'm in this time, I have several parts I've been scavenging, throughout the year, had started a neck blank and body blank and put them on the backburner. However since I already glued and trued the blank for the neck will it count as usable? I have other blank material but this glue up looks esp. nice.(maple/walnut 5 pc)

OK, I understand there is no cost limit - but will the cost have to be disclosed? Or be a factor? (i.e. will a guy get points if he discloses he put the thing together for $200).

Don't fret!!
If one is truly nervous aout making a fretted neck, you could go fretless.
Having to make a neck opens up new possibilities like a Turkish saz tele. The saz instruments have adjustable frets made of fishing line tied around the neck.

I'm not opposed to thinking outside of the box.
No need for a truss rod!

OK, I understand there is no cost limit - but will the cost have to be disclosed? Or be a factor? (i.e. will a guy get points if he discloses he put the thing together for $200).

I'm not sure about this. It's a good question. I'll get back to you about this. (Not the points for under $200 part -- that's a no, but the disclosure part.)

Just to clarify, we will have to sign up on March 1st, and we will have up until 11:59 pm to sign up? Also for the picture with all raw wood to be used, we need to have all wood on hand by March 1st? We can not buy the wood after this date? I have all the wood require for the neck but do not have the main body part as of yet. I could not star the contest with what I have and then buy the body wood after March 1st? I just want to be clear.

Thanks, Gari

Sounds like fun, hopefully I'll have time to toss my hat in since I need a new amp. :wink:

does it have to have six strings? (for that matter, could it be a bass as long as the body is telecaster shaped?)

Sounds like fun, hopefully I'll have time to toss my hat in since I need a new amp. :wink:

Wow, aren't you full of yourself... :razz:

:mrgreen:

:wink:

Just to clarify, we will have to sign up on March 1st, and we will have up until 11:59 pm to sign up? Also for the picture with all raw wood to be used, we need to have all wood on hand by March 1st? We can not buy the wood after this date? I have all the wood require for the neck but do not have the main body part as of yet. I could not star the contest with what I have and then buy the body wood after March 1st? I just want to be clear.

Thanks, Gari

You have to start you thread (which is how you enter by end of day 3/1) No, you don't have to have the wood on 3/1. Just start a thread by 3/1.

does it have to have six strings? (for that matter, could it be a bass as long as the body is telecaster shaped?)

Nope, 4, 6, 7, 8, 10, 12 what ever you want. Tele Bass? Sure.

Wow, aren't you full of yourself...

Hey I've won the last two years haven't I....oh, wait....nevermind. :razz:

I am SO looking forward to this. I'll have my wood ready.

now that I have all the templates ready, a couple of bodies and one neck under my belt I'll have to throw my hat in... I've been itching to build a couple more necks and this just might be the motivation I needed. I was planning on doing this over the summer...I better start thinking now...

so - using using slotted fretboards is OK ?

so - using using slotted fretboards is OK ?

Yes.

Hmm, I might just enter this years contest... See if my first total diy neck build works out this week ;)
Does it have to be a full scale guitar?

I think this is a very good challenge. Very interesting in fact that it raises so many questions. The "no cost limit" rule is frightening because it says clearly that there is no shortcuts, nothing for hiding behind ; you just have to do your best for quality and creativity.

I had a project on the cheap side, now I must think about it again, under a different angle, and see if I will have the time to build the neck. Big challenge to me. I like it.

so - using using slotted fretboards is OK ?

See previous answer:


Slotted Fretboard -- first I wasn't aware it existed. But, I just said you had to build the neck, I made no mention of frets or fingerboards. So, I can't see how it's a problem.

One thing for EVERYONE to consider in this year's challenge. There's no cost limit.

BUT!

The winners will be chosen by the membership at large. Some of them love the expensive goodies. And some of them are turned off by such extravagance. Successful builders in this Challenge will play to this audience and so, too rich may or may not work against you.

The goal is to make a guitar that members of the TDPRI will look at and say "YES!" So, build all the weird looking, mega decked out, upside down tele-like guitars you want, but keep in mind that you probably can't win with that combo -- unless it's so great to the general Tele playing/buying public that you garner enough votes to win.

That is the Challenge -- should you choose to accept it.

Sorry if this is already covered, as i didn't read the whole thread. But requiring people to post a video is ridiculous(no offense meant), and might exclude a lot of people. I know that I am not set up to do any video. And i really don't see the point. If the builds are posted on this forum, that's all the proof you need that the instrument was constructed. If the point is proof that the guitar is wired and capable of producing sound, i find that rather rude(again, no offense), in that you are questioning a person's integrity at the very outset of the build(whether or not they would falsely represent that their work was good. Goes against everything i know about this forum) . It also cuts into build time, as everyone will have to have the guitar completed in time to actually record a video and do all the other little things necessary to prep it and get it uploaded to the youtube site. I don't know about you, but that could take me days. With all the really fine players on this board, I'm not about to slap up a last minute, off the cuff video. Not whining, just pointing out how that requirement hit me.
I really like the rest of it. No restrictions on cost and no restrictions other than a tele shape will give us a wider and more diverse group of offerings, I think. Except for the video requirement, i think the rules are great! Good job!

Hmmmm.......... I have an interesting idea. Now if I can just find someone to play it for the video.

Hmmmm.......... I have an interesting idea. Now if I can just find someone to play it for the video.

Jack, can I please play one of your guitars? :mrgreen:

Sorry if this is already covered, as i didn't read the whole thread. But requiring people to post a video is ridiculous(no offense meant), and might exclude a lot of people. I know that I am not set up to do any video. And i really don't see the point. If the builds are posted on this forum, that's all the proof you need that the instrument was constructed. If the point is proof that the guitar is wired and capable of producing sound, i find that rather rude(again, no offense), in that you are questioning a person's integrity at the very outset of the build(whether or not they would falsely represent that their work was good. Goes against everything i know about this forum) . It also cuts into build time, as everyone will have to have the guitar completed in time to actually record a video and do all the other little things necessary to prep it and get it uploaded to the youtube site. I don't know about you, but that could take me days. With all the really fine players on this board, I'm not about to slap up a last minute, off the cuff video. Not whining, just pointing out how that requirement hit me.
I really like the rest of it. No restrictions on cost and no restrictions other than a tele shape will give us a wider and more diverse group of offerings, I think. Except for the video requirement, i think the rules are great! Good job!

Hmmmm.......... I have an interesting idea. Now if I can just find someone to play it for the video.

Hey, I'm the first to say I build a better guitar than I play, but I think this year I'll be making my own Youtube debut for this challenge.

Gitlvr, there's no "setup" required. I bet 5 of your buddies have cell phones that take movies that can be uploaded to youtube, c'mon have fun with it! (you won't play worse than me!)

Jack, are you a "stairway" guy, a "freebird" guy or an "enter sandman" guy? :grin: Let's see those skilled hands run up and down the fretboard!

I really like the no cost restriction because I hate having to use crap tuners and/or pickups (I figure this year's guitar will come in at about $300-$400).

Game On!

Sorry if this is already covered, as i didn't read the whole thread. But requiring people to post a video is ridiculous(no offense meant), and might exclude a lot of people.

That's your opinion and it's fine. If it keeps you from entering then so be it. We've had a large number of people suggest that it would be good to actually see or hear the guitars being played.

And, in last year's Challenge several did post YouTube vids of the guitar and it made a huge difference.

The video can be easily taken from a Cell Phone and it need only be 60 secs long and it doesn't have to be the builder that's playing it. If that keeps folks out of the contest... then we'll just have to live with that for this year.

If it works out badly, we won't do it next year. We're still learning what works and what doesn't here.

I will be watching from the sidelines. Can't wait.

I really like the rules!

(I am only a spectator no matter what the rules)

Yeah. This. No dollar limit is a bit of a mistake, IMHO. That said I do think that the prizes make it somewhat self-limiting. No one wants to spend $2100.00 to win a grand prize of a $300 amp.

The pickups/quality of parts question is another one worth visiting, except, I think, that much of what's being sold today in guitar parts is really snake oil.
Truth will out. People should just make the best guitars they can. If a person doesn't win, he or she should be proud of their work.

If, and I am saying its a big if.. if I do win or even place I'm not keeping the amp. I'm going to donate it to a local high school music program that might need it.

That said, I'm probably not going to win.:mrgreen::lol::lol:

Oh well, I wish everyone luck. I think this is going to be a great contest.

Bajaa's Dad

I don't think so. I'd take the Scattercaster over most of the vendor guitars I see here.

Hey, I'm the first to say I build a better guitar than I play, but I think this year I'll be making my own Youtube debut for this challenge.

Game On!

I'm not sure on my capabilities of builing one yet. But I'm gonna give 'er a whirl. I think my playing may help me on the sympathy vote :lol:

Gitlvr, there's no "setup" required. I bet 5 of your buddies have cell phones that take movies that can be uploaded to youtube, c'mon have fun with it! (you won't play worse than me!)

Actually, for me there'd be quite a lot of "set up". Firstly, i don't own a video camera, nor is my 5 year old cell phone capable of it.
Secondly, ever try uploading a video on dial up? I have a problem with small, compressed mp3 files "timing out". I wouldn't even want to find out how much grief a video would cause. Plus, i don't have a membership with You Tube, nor do i want one. Nor do I want to participate in a contest that requires that. On dial up, You Tube is absolutely usesless to me. And upgrading my internet access to high speed or otherwise upgrading my system to participate is not an expense i care to take on.
And as far as playing worse than you, that's debatable. You haven't heard me play. I'd want some time to edit. And I certainly wouldn't want the sound you'd get from the mic on a video camera or cell phone. I'd want to record the audio and video simultaneously, but from two different sources, and integrate them later. This would also mean video and audio editing software, which i don't have. If I am going to spend the time, money and sweat necessary to build a nice guitar, I definately want the audio of it to sound decent. An mp3 file of the instrument would be far easier, and sound far better, IMHO.

I don't have a problem with the video idea, I just don't think it should be a requirement. But it doesn't really matter. I'm not trying to harp on it and "discuss" it to death. I've stated my opinion. If I'm in the minority, that's fine with me. But the learning curve for me to deal with video online is enough to make me hesitant . It took me a month to figure out how to attach files in an email( not literally a month, but close enough).
I'm just one guy. I'm sure there'll be plenty of participants. I'll just sit back and watch it unfold, and cheer everybody on. That's part of participation as well. You guys need a cheering section. I'll join that.

Mike, we obviously know that not everyone is on broadband, nor YouTube and not everyone has a smart phone or camera. But according to our stats over 98.5% of our members are on broadband.

Out of 1.32 million visits in the last 30 days, less than 20,000 were on dial-up. Really.

This is the reason we feel it is acceptable to expect that those entering this Challenge will have that capability.

Actually, for me there'd be quite a lot of "set up". Firstly, i don't own a video camera, nor is my 5 year old cell phone capable of it.
Secondly, ever try uploading a video on dial up? I have a problem with small, compressed mp3 files "timing out". I wouldn't even want to find out how much grief a video would cause. Plus, i don't have a membership with You Tube, nor do i want one. Nor do I want to participate in a contest that requires that. On dial up, You Tube is absolutely usesless to me. And upgrading my internet access to high speed or otherwise upgrading my system to participate is not an expense i care to take on.
And as far as playing worse than you, that's debatable. You haven't heard me play. I'd want some time to edit. And I certainly wouldn't want the sound you'd get from the mic on a video camera or cell phone. I'd want to record the audio and video simultaneously, but from two different sources, and integrate them later. This would also mean video and audio editing software, which i don't have. If I am going to spend the time, money and sweat necessary to build a nice guitar, I definately want the audio of it to sound decent. An mp3 file of the instrument would be far easier, and sound far better, IMHO.

I don't have a problem with the video idea, I just don't think it should be a requirement. But it doesn't really matter. I'm not trying to harp on it and "discuss" it to death. I've stated my opinion. If I'm in the minority, that's fine with me. But the learning curve for me to deal with video online is enough to make me hesitant . It took me a month to figure out how to attach files in an email( not literally a month, but close enough).
I'm just one guy. I'm sure there'll be plenty of participants. I'll just sit back and watch it unfold, and cheer everybody on. That's part of participation as well. You guys need a cheering section. I'll join that.

I see you are in Northern Virginia. That is just over the river from me. I would be happy to video your guitar and upload it for you. Hell i could even have you over to record a clean guitar track on my home studio. and video the process for you so it sounds great. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. I am happy to share mine with you for this project, cause more entries is good for everyone. And I know some KICK A$$ guitarists that would be happy to lay down a track for you right there in NOVA. C'mon if you believe you can compete then you really should.
Patrick

Not everyone is going to finish that gets started as can be seen from the past 2 years. Go as far as you can I say...kind of like a marathon.

I'll have to give this some serious consideration. The timing isn't the best for me but I might give it a go anyway. I built 3 short scale Teles for a friend last year and I want one for myself. They were really cool guitars and they were just as much fun to build as they were to play.

I see you are in Northern Virginia. That is just over the river from me. I would be happy to video your guitar and upload it for you. Hell i could even have you over to record a clean guitar track on my home studio. and video the process for you so it sounds great. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. I am happy to share mine with you for this project, cause more entries is good for everyone. And I know some KICK A$$ guitarists that would be happy to lay down a track for you right there in NOVA. C'mon if you believe you can compete then you really should.
Patrick
Patrick, thanks for that. That's an awesome offer. I may consider it.
TDPRI, I understand the percentages, but you might consider what percentage of forum members here actually participate in build threads. I bet that's a lot lower. IMHO, it makes no sense to exclude even a small percentage of those. Even so, no hard feelings. i appreciate everything you do here. I know there's a lot on your plate.
However, I may do a pseudo-entry. IOW, build alongside the contestants, but not actually enter. The only reason, to be honest, that i want to participate in the build off is to be more active on this board. I can still do that, even outside the build. No worries, and I wish everyone luck, whatever it is that I finally decide to do.

p.s.: I hope you understand I'm not trying to cause a problem. I love this place, and I think that you and the moderators here do a bang up job!

I am ordering parts as we speak ...

If I can work out a few details in the next couple of days then I'll be entering, if not, I'll be checking out all the build threads with great interest.

When will the separate forum for the 2011 build challenge threads be available?
Or is it up somewhere and I missed it?

Patrick, thanks for that. That's an awesome offer. I may consider it.
TDPRI, I understand the percentages, but you might consider what percentage of forum members here actually participate in build threads. I bet that's a lot lower. IMHO, it makes no sense to exclude even a small percentage of those. Even so, no hard feelings. i appreciate everything you do here. I know there's a lot on your plate.
However, I may do a pseudo-entry. IOW, build alongside the contestants, but not actually enter. The only reason, to be honest, that i want to participate in the build off is to be more active on this board. I can still do that, even outside the build. No worries, and I wish everyone luck, whatever it is that I finally decide to do.

p.s.: I hope you understand I'm not trying to cause a problem. I love this place, and I think that you and the moderators here do a bang up job!

What if I say that having to build your own neck unfairly excludes xx% of people because they don't have the capability to build their own neck without spending money on tools they don't already have...any maybe they don't even want those tools...just like you won't want a youtube account. Every rule of the challenge is going to exclude someone on some level or another... I personally love that we will see AND hear these guitars this year. It's going to be a great challenge...

You said, but the video has nothing to do with the ability to build a guitar...neither did a $100 price limit on the first challenge... it's all good. I hope you'll build and take up the offer of whodatpat to get the video done.

Here are the rules this year.* Sorry if this is too difficult, too short or the wrong time of year. Deal with it. No whining!


I was reviewing the rules and noticed the quote above.:twisted:

When will the separate forum for the 2011 build challenge threads be available?
Or is it up somewhere and I missed it?

We'll open this up a couple of days before the start, most likely.

This looks like an awesome challenge this year. I am spewing that I can't enter. My wife says, "build the house before you build any more guitars." I think this set of rules has the potential for some excellent work. I will be a very keen spectator and voter. Now I just need to wait till next year before I get another shot.

I don't think I am going to enter this year. I have been gathering all the parts for a 12 string (minus the body wood), including the neck, for this challenge; but right now I don't feel I am ready to build a neck, or buy the tools necessary to build one.

(Might change my mind, though. But most likely not.)

That said, I am definitely going to follow the contestant's threads here!

Tuur, you've got a jigsaw, a router, a drill press and probably some wood rasps right? = tools needed for a neck ;) To plane the blank I bought a router bit set €7,5 at my local hubo shop. The largest bit and passes of max 0.5mm to get the wood to thickness works just fine. To enlarge the flat area under the neck blank I mounted a piece of mdf to the drill press table.

Bij vragen, pm gerust ;)

I don't think I can even find my router in that mess of a garage, but I will enjoy watching this build challenge. I've wondered what would happen if the cost factor were left open. And I think a lot of people, even spectators like myself, will learn about neck-building through this contest.

This looks like an awesome challenge this year. I am spewing that I can't enter. My wife says, "build the house before you build any more guitars." I think this set of rules has the potential for some excellent work. I will be a very keen spectator and voter. Now I just need to wait till next year before I get another shot.

One way I get my babe to do stuff for me is to call it 'crafting'. I can get her to do anything if I call it crafting.

Since your wife won't let you build a guitar.. she should build it for you!!!!:mrgreen:

Stew mac's slotted and radiused boards are $20. $12 for maple. How much do you get stung at customs? Ouch.

A ruler, a mitre box and a saw is all you need. Seriously - 95% of guitar building is bravery, 5% is skill :grin:. Everyone here who's built a few guitars knows just how much easier it was after it's finished compared to before it was started. This phenomenon exists and fuels Guitar Building Addiction - once you realise how easy it is, suddenly you can have every guitar you ever wanted, customised to your requirements ... and have fun building them. It will snowball. Win/win.

It's much easier than you think :wink:.

Just checked out Stewmac.com for an example
Fretboard $12
Shipping $30
Customs 4%
VAT 25%
Total $55

So yeah, a bit cheaper...

The theory of neck making is no problem, just don't want to do my first neck in a competition. I have my build all worked out. Telemaster alder body with two mahogany racing stripes and a spalted birch top, keystones pickup and nickel hardware, mapel neck with rosewood fingerboard and S-tastic wiring
I have most of the things needed collected already but what I lack is time.:cry:
Besides, lumberyards don't carry maple here, basically what we have is pine, fir and oak.
So a maple neck blank and a slotted fretbord is $150 right from the bat, and I already scored a nice unfinished neck with some figure in the wood for $15 from the local ebay.
I'm really not whining. The rules are the rules, take it or leave it.

But rules are meant to be bent right?:idea::cool:
If I remove the fretboard from the neck I've got I can reuse it. Plus that gives me a free trussrod and a waste piece of maple I might be able to make a neck from:twisted:

I might enter into the competition and try my hand on a neck, better DNF than DNS right?

I have my build all worked out. Telemaster alder body with two mahogany racing stripes and a spalted birch top, keystones pickup and nickel hardware, mapel neck with rosewood fingerboard and S-tastic wiring


Sounds like a good plan!

But:

3. The body must have a Telecaster shape -- everything else can be different. It must have a finish -- no bare wood.

Sounds like a good plan!

But:
Originally Posted by rules
3. The body must have a Telecaster shape -- everything else can be different. It must have a finish -- no bare wood.

Tele body -- I'll go with what we had last year, it can be a variation on a Tele theme. But we have to see the resemblance to a Tele in it -- and I doubt you'd win over many votes from members here if it's not Tele enough, though.
I think there's enough leeway in there, and finish will be True-oil. I don't think I'll ever use anything else since GPW made my try it.

I think there's enough leeway in there,

Hmmm..

Telemaster = Jazzmaster Shape.

Telecaster = Telecaster Shape.

Opening the door to Telemasters means opening the door to Stratoteles and Telepauls and everything else with a Tele bridge doesn't it?

I don't care but I think Paul should draw a line maybe? Personally, I'd be happy to build a Telepaul, I have too many Tele/Esquires.

I'm going to quote Rule #3.

3. The body must have a Telecaster shape -- everything else can be different. It must have a finish -- no bare wood.

Ryden .......... What's so hard to understand?

"On March 1st I will post the way you will be required to prove that you are starting on that date. So, starting early will not be possible -- so don't even try. You'll be required to show all the raw wood used in the build with the proof of the date. "

Maybe I am not understanding this, but does that mean I can't purchase the wood for my project till March 1? Same goes for parts?

hockeygoon, I read that as you have to have your wood still in mill form and then they will say something like you have to post a photo with your wood in the raw form, along with something like the first page of some major newspaper, and some word (which they will announce) written plainly on the wood on or after the start date.

no way do I see them not allowing someone to use wood they've had seasoning for years; Just not allow the use of wood that has been seasoning in a the shape of a Tele body and neck for years.

"On March 1st I will post the way you will be required to prove that you are starting on that date. So, starting early will not be possible -- so don't even try. You'll be required to show all the raw wood used in the build with the proof of the date. "

Maybe I am not understanding this, but does that mean I can't purchase the wood for my project till March 1? Same goes for parts?

If it's like the last few years (sounds like it is) you just have to say you are participating on march 1st. You can buy what you want or use what you've got but before cutting the wood blanks you need to prove (in Paul's later-to-be-specified way) that no cutting or building was done prior to march 1st.

[expletive removed] I was hoping this wasn't going to happen so soon. I was hoping it would hold off until the docs were finished poking and prodding and I could hold a Router :sad::sad: It's one of the reasons I signed up to the site, love the challenge threads.

Tuur Doownload the pdf for the neck jig and look up the youtube videos . That was my plan. Plus a hollow body short scale fretless telebass bass ragin' now.

Ah well hopefully next time I will be able to wield a router without risking life and limb.

And can I be one of the first to say GOOD LUCK TO ALL who enter. As a spectator I can't wait till March the 1st now .:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

OK, two answers to the above questions:

A Les Paul or a Jazzmaster or Jaguar or a Mostrite or etc is NOT a Telecaster or Telecaster modified body shape. Feel free to build what you want, but if it's not a Tele body, or a Tele body with some changes (but still basically a Tele) it will be disqualified. The rules are not any body shape, with a Tele bridge. It's a Tele body shape with any kind of bridge.

And, as the others have said, you just can't start cutting and shaping the wood until the Challenge starts. I will give you instructions on how you will be expected to prove you waited to start the building process. But that doesn't mean you can't get the wood in your possession at this point. You certainly can. All the other parts as well.

no way do I see them not allowing someone to use wood they've had seasoning for years; Just not allow the use of wood that has been seasoning in a the shape of a Tele body and neck for years.

:lol: that's funny. Great, thanks for the claification TDPRI, all systems go!

"Are we go for launch? Fret hammer?" Check.
"Truss rod?" Check, systems green.
"Hand plane?" We're a go.
"Router? Router?" Uh, I've got a burned bushing, your gonna have to do without me.

To the "Telecaster shape" question, is this something that ends up just being controlled essentially in the end by the voting population? I mean there is no process to get your plans approved? Build threads don't get locked or users banned as soon as it's seen a JM or LP or strat like body is cutout, right?

Personally I'd like to participate but I can't rationalize building a tele guitar for myself as I'm currently waiting on lacquer to cure on a JM build. My son (12) has expressed interest in a bass so I was thinking short scale '68 Telecaster bass as built by Fender which fits this by name but not by the implied 6 string guitar shape. I'd just like to participate under a time constraint that I don't usually have.

Thoughts?

Oh course the wife may squash the whole idea of "another guitar" anyway!
Lee

To the "Telecaster shape" question, is this something that ends up just being controlled essentially in the end by the voting population? I mean there is no process to get your plans approved? Build threads don't get locked or users banned as soon as it's seen a JM or LP or strat like body is cutout, right?

Personally I'd like to participate but I can't rationalize building a tele guitar for myself as I'm currently waiting on lacquer to cure on a JM build. My son (12) has expressed interest in a bass so I was thinking short scale '68 Telecaster bass as built by Fender which fits this by name but not by the implied 6 string guitar shape. I'd just like to participate under a time constraint that I don't usually have.

Thoughts?

Oh course the wife may squash the whole idea of "another guitar" anyway!
Lee

A Tele Bass is Tele shaped and Paul already cleared and approved that question earlier in this thread.

To the "Telecaster shape" question, is this something that ends up just being controlled essentially in the end by the voting population? I mean there is no process to get your plans approved? Build threads don't get locked or users banned as soon as it's seen a JM or LP or strat like body is cutout, right?

Personally I'd like to participate but I can't rationalize building a tele guitar for myself as I'm currently waiting on lacquer to cure on a JM build. My son (12) has expressed interest in a bass so I was thinking short scale '68 Telecaster bass as built by Fender which fits this by name but not by the implied 6 string guitar shape. I'd just like to participate under a time constraint that I don't usually have.

Thoughts?

Oh course the wife may squash the whole idea of "another guitar" anyway!
Lee

TDPRI stated 4,5,6,7,8,12, any string number as long as the body is tele shaped.

I understood that string count wasn't an issue and a bass was ok. If the double cut Telecaster bass is enough of the "tele shape", meaning guitar, then I'm good.

Now to get buy-in from the son ... and the all important wife. How do I play this?
:roll:

luckily i just put a rock on my girlfriends finger so now i can participate guilt free :-D, first time builder so we'll see how it goes. I've been working on my plan for about a month in cad so we'll see. Cant wait!

I glued together a few body blanks last year. Can I use one
as my starting point, or do I have to start from a single plank
of wood?

Not a big deal, but I want to get ready as this'll be my first
neck build, and time is likely to become an issue.

The wood must be unshaped plank. It cannot be cut into anything resembling a guitar body shape.

That should answer your question.

I don't want to answer yes or no, because people keep asking one step further -- first it's "I've glued the wood together" and if I say yes the next question is "I've cut it to a basic shape" and that's followed with, "I've trimmed the outer edges." See the problem?

So, I'll just state the rules. -- You must start with wood blanks.

I hope that answers your question.

I think there should be a rule that it has to be handmade, or other words no CNC machines.

there is still a considerable amount of tooling/setting up involved with a CNC. Might as well tell people they cant use any jigs or power tools too.

When it comes down to it, its voted on by forum members, so they'll decide whether or not to vote for a CNC build or not.

I think there should be a rule that it has to be handmade, or other words no CNC machines.

OK, it must be handmade -- no power tools of any kind can be used.










Just kidding.

I think there should be a rule that it has to be handmade, or other words no CNC machines.
What you may not know about CNC is that you have to create a toolpath and that means draw the entire part in 2D or 3D. It would be great if you could just take a drawing like Ed Hawley's or TDowns and use it as is, but things need to be tweaked for one's own machine.
Then you have to convert that drawing into a Stereolithography or DWG file to generate the code for the machine to run based on the tool used in the router, size of the cnc machine, etc. Then you have to do a trial run. I do it out of scrap wood. Then you have to correct any errors that crop up. As an example I had a pixel causing the tool to mark a hole in a couple bodies before I noticed and fixed it. This takes probably 3x the time it takes to do it by hand. The beauty is once that all those things are done, you get a faster machined product. That means I can get a body routed in less than an hour. Then it is off to drill, sand, and roundover.
I can show you the 10 blem necks and bodies I sold off for next to nothing before I got what I would consider a good result. Compare that to taking a TDowns drawing and making a template and using a router to do the same thing. Which one sounds faster and easier :-)
If I decide to enter the contest I will be using my CNC router, but I also will have to create a new drawing for the body, neck, and pickguard because I want to do something unique. I just love the whole process even though it doesn't really save me any time.
I might add that I do have a drawing all ready to go for a regular tele body and pickguard but haven't quite gotten the hang of making the 3D version of a tele neck. There is a learning curve to newish software that takes the untrained quite a while to master. For what I have in mind I'd be using non tradtional items within the tele framework. These will require some things that aren't on any of the models or drawings I currently have with the exception of a perimeter outline.

Can I build a Tele shaped Keytar :mrgreen:?

http://suitandtieguy.com/sights/doing_it_wrong_keytar.jpg

Can I build a Tele shaped Keytar :mrgreen:?
..
I'm not sure I would vote for that, unless it had a Tele bridge and/or was made of CF.

After reading guitarbuilder's post, it sounds to me like templates, saws and routers are the easy way to go.

Can I build a Tele shaped Keytar :mrgreen:?



Born instigator :lol:

I think there should be a rule that it has to be handmade, or other words no CNC machines.

I use a hand held router and I have no problem with cnc guys. The cnc would only be an advantage if we were making 20... Or more... It is their choice how to persue their hobby. Everyone should be able to use whatever tools they want to.

That means I can get a body routed in less than an hour.

With a full set of templates and starting with a thicknessed blank it would take me maybe1/2 hour to saw out the shape, route it to final dimensions and route the neck pocket and various cavities. Maybe 15 minutes more to add the jack and ferrule holes.

So, if you don't have a CNC don't feel bad or that you're at a disadvantage. It's just a tool like any other...and like any other tool, I wish to hell I had one. :mrgreen:

I use a hand held router and I have no problem with cnc guys. The cnc would only be an advantage if we were making 20... Or more... It is their choice how to persue their hobby. Everyone should be able to use whatever tools they want to.
+1 - I say - someone - impress the heck out of everyone with what you can do with it: Whatever it is - a chisel and a block plane, a router, a CNC machine, a banana and a carrot.... Let see what everyone's best work is.

I use a hand held router and I have no problem with cnc guys. The cnc would only be an advantage if we were making 20... Or more... It is their choice how to persue their hobby. Everyone should be able to use whatever tools they want to.


They don't bother me either. I've got my weed eater tuned up, oiled the timberstretcher, and cleaned the tip on the blow torch. I'm ready!:roll:

Thanks for the quick reply, but I can't find a clear answer in
there. Or rather, I see several different answers.

Maybe I could have made my question clearer: is it legal to start
with a two-piece, rectangular body blank?

Thanks for your patience.

74254




The wood must be unshaped plank. It cannot be cut into anything resembling a guitar body shape.

That should answer your question.

I don't want to answer yes or no, because people keep asking one step further -- first it's "I've glued the wood together" and if I say yes the next question is "I've cut it to a basic shape" and that's followed with, "I've trimmed the outer edges." See the problem?

So, I'll just state the rules. -- You must start with wood blanks.

I hope that answers your question.

I use a hand held router and I have no problem with cnc guys. The cnc would only be an advantage if we were making 20... Or more... It is their choice how to persue their hobby. Everyone should be able to use whatever tools they want to.

Another +1. A CNC won't make you more creative or more
inventive or more artistic, and that's what I think will count
in the end.

Sounds like a fun challenge. I've picked out the trees I'll cut to mill my wood from. I've got a couple bucket loads of ore to smelt some metals from. I've got my home made blast furnace ready to cast tuners, screws, and neck plates. I've got a cow picked out to butcher for the bone for the nut. And boiled up a mess of chicken bones for gelatin for the adhesive on the sticker. I'm ready!!

Well, thanks for the clarifications Paul, as I stated in my question, I do have a second set of unglued, mostly untrimmed parts ready to be used in place of the stuff I stopped myself on, execpt to find another piece to put in for the stringers between the maple sections... Sounds like a road trip to Woodcraft. Hmm, walnut, purpleheart or what ever gets my attention... First things first, gotta fix a crack in the back of the flattop I'm working to get finished to be used for my church's praise group startup... ought to make for a really "fun" weekend

Shouldn't there be a rule that CNC guys can't start programming until March 1st? ;-)

Shouldn't there be a rule that CNC guys can't start programming until March 1st? ;-)
As long as there isn't any template printing or construction before that date... I see no problem holding off...:-). Actually I haven't made up my mind about anything...only thinking about different ideas of things to do and whether I want to do it at all.

By the way, that time estimate I made earlier is based on my personal machine which cost less than 2000 dollars. If you want more speed and accuracy you have to spend a lot more than that. Mine does about 55 inches per minute with the pedal to the metal. It's like the old muscle car days. I have the equivelent of a slant 6.

Things that determine the speed are the screws and motors. Mine are 300 in-lbs I think and 10 turns per inch on each axis.

I'm going to quote Rule #3.



Ryden .......... What's so hard to understand?
Sorry, seems to bit of a mix up here.
I'm not going to do a Jazzmaster body But a Jazzcaster (http://www.tdpri.com/forum/tele-home-depot/168351-jazzcaster-prototype.html)
http://i55.tinypic.com/flzx3o.jpg
If thats not Tele enough, I'll stay out of it and just build it outside the comp

hmmm... that looks and sounds familiar :-)

Maybe I could have made my question clearer: is it legal to start
with a two-piece, rectangular body blank?

What's the difference between that and me going out and buying a one piece mahogany blank from a plank that's been milled already at my lumber yard? My interpretation is that I think you just have to build the body not necessarily cut the tree down and prep the wood into boards. Some people will glue up, some won't, but I'm not the boss.


I think I spend too much time at this forum........

With a full set of templates... (yada, yada, yada...)

hey Mike... that new avatar... did you grow some hair... or is that Bob Villa with a 'fro... ??? :mrgreen:

hey Mike... that new avatar... did you grow some hair... or is that Bob Villa with a 'fro... ??? :mrgreen:

It's... Bob Ross! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob Ross)

MghiBW3r65M

[B]


I think I spend too much time at this forum........

It benefits the forum, Mark - so don't feel too bad. :lol:

[B]I think I spend too much time at this forum........

You're not a Doctor of Teleocity yet, so there is hope... :wink:

hmmm... that looks and sounds familiar :-)
I expect it does:smile:

I'd been sitting and drawing body shapes in Visio and found this really great mutation of the Tele, and then I stumbled onto you post...
There's nothing new under the sun is there?

Edit:
It is the Telecaster lines, only 3/4 of it has been skewed 10 degrees, the lower bout being left to fit a standard pickguard

***It's... Bob Ross!***

We don't make mistakes - We have happy accidents

In case you are wondering , this is what that pine version of Teleblues001's concept ( his shape idea not mine) turned into.
Check out post 316. It was part of a charity donation project in another thread here. The squier talk people ended the thread, but you can see basically what was done along the way. It got sent out for new paint and then onto the recipient I guess.

http://www.squier-talk.com/forum/squier-stratocasters/2817-members-christmas-charity-build-8.html

Oh well, I guess making another Telecaster harp guitar is out, since it doesn't truly look like a telecaster body.
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc331/rockndrtom/Harpguitar%20revisited/100_2652.jpg

hey Mike... that new avatar... did you grow some hair... or is that Bob Villa with a 'fro... ??

Like Turr said, the inimitable Bob Ross, whom I was once compared to on this very forum for my ability to (seemingly) create solid body guitars with a snap of my fingers. :grin:

Like Turr said, the inimitable Bob Ross, whom I was once compared to on this very forum for my ability to (seemingly) create solid body guitars with a snap of my fingers. :grin:

From happy little trees.

I guess Flatfive wants me to tell him it's OK to use a piece of wood that is made up of two pieces of wood glued together?

I'm standing by my initial answer -- the wood can not be pre-cut into any guitar body shape.

Flatfive, is the wood you want to use cut into any guitar body shape? If it is, then no you can't use it. If it's not then you can use it.

I hope this clarifies everything for you.

Don't over think things. The wood does not have to still be growing on a tree for you to use it in the Challenge. You just can't get started on cutting it into a guitar shape before March 1st.

As Guitarbuilder said, "what's the difference between that and a single piece of wood that I bought from my lumber yard?".

Oh well, I guess making another Telecaster harp guitar is out, since it doesn't truly look like a telecaster body.


Dr. Tom -- I'd say that your guitar harp has plenty enough Tele body shape to qualify. As does the Jazzcaster drawing shown above.

http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc331/rockndrtom/Harpguitar%20revisited/100_2652.jpg

Looks like a tele to me. A really weird tele, but a tele nonetheless.

I guess Flatfive wants me to tell him it's OK to use a piece of wood that is made up of two pieces of wood glued together?

Actually, that's a handy clarification. I have several top sets (still rectangular) that I've joined together and thicknessed and are just sitting around waiting to be used for something.

Actually, that's a handy clarification. I have several top sets (still rectangular) that I've joined together and thicknessed and are just sitting around waiting to be used for something.

+1

The wood must be unshaped plank. It cannot be cut into anything resembling a guitar body shape.

Thanks for the quick reply, but I can't find a clear answer in
there. Or rather, I see several different answers.

Maybe I could have made my question clearer: is it legal to start
with a two-piece, rectangular body blank?

C'mon people ........... you can't get more clear than Paul's reply above.

Uh oh ........caveat...... the following picture is pretty close to the shape of a Bo Diddley guitar.

......http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tele-home-depot/74254d1298518569-just-posted-2011-build-challenge-official-rules-details-dont-miss-out-img_6828-jpg

http://whateves.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/bo_diddley-773864.jpg

Actually, a 'yes' or 'no' would have been clearer, and I
sincerely don't understand the reluctance to give that kind of
answer. I thought my question was straightforward.

Maybe the concern is that a direct answer would lead
to many other questions.

C'mon people ........... you can't get more clear than Paul's reply above.

Actually, a 'yes' or 'no' would have been clearer, and I
sincerely don't understand the reluctance to give that kind of
answer. I thought my question was straightforward.

Maybe the concern is that a direct answer would lead
to many other questions.

Actually, that's exactly why, as stated in post #92.
The wood must be unshaped plank. It cannot be cut into anything resembling a guitar body shape.

That should answer your question.

I don't want to answer yes or no, because people keep asking one step further -- first it's "I've glued the wood together" and if I say yes the next question is "I've cut it to a basic shape" and that's followed with, "I've trimmed the outer edges." See the problem?

So, I'll just state the rules. -- You must start with wood blanks.

I hope that answers your question.

A two(or more) piece body blank is a wood blank. Pretty crystal clear to me. You're good to go. I look forward to watching your build progress.

Actually, that's exactly why, as stated in post #92.


A two(or more) piece body blank is a wood blank. Pretty crystal clear to me. You're good to go.
I thought so too, besides I actually have a couple of blanks in the same state that I had glued together already a long time ago - I was thinking I might use one of them. Their wood is not all that pretty. So, once I figure out if I'm going to go for a clear or something like a CAR finish I'll figure out what wood to use.

Actually, that's exactly why, as stated in post #92.

A two(or more) piece body blank is a wood blank. Pretty crystal clear to me. You're good to go. I look forward to watching your build progress.

Thank you yes. Folks always ask me to interpret the rules -- but that creates a mine-field. I always just try to answer with the rules and trust folks will stop overthinking it and just follow the simple rules.

Uh oh ........caveat...... the following picture is pretty close to the shape of a Bo Diddley guitar.

......http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tele-home-depot/74254d1298518569-just-posted-2011-build-challenge-official-rules-details-dont-miss-out-img_6828-jpg



But the greenish-yellow blob of glue is way prettier than any ornamentation I've seen on any Bo Diddley guitar.

But the greenish-yellow blob of glue is way prettier than any ornamentation I've seen on any Bo Diddley guitar.

:lol:
Wait'll you see the veneer that goes over that!

A two(or more) piece body blank is a wood blank.

True, but I think the questions have arisen from inconsistant terms throughout this thread. TDPRI has referred to the starting point as "raw wood", "wood blanks", and "wood planks". These are 3 different things. Those who see this figuratively are comfortable with some level of assumption. Others who take it literally would need clarification on this.

It's these differences in us that make us unique, creative and curious creatures. Let's not make some feel less capable or less intelligent simply because they ask questions.

Peace,
Mark

C'mon people ........... you can't get more clear than Paul's reply above.

Uh oh ........caveat...... the following picture is pretty close to the shape of a Bo Diddley guitar.

......http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tele-home-depot/74254d1298518569-just-posted-2011-build-challenge-official-rules-details-dont-miss-out-img_6828-jpg

http://whateves.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/bo_diddley-773864.jpg

I have those EXACT amps!! Great minds think alike. I love Bo Diddley. Only he can make a guitar INTO a box lol.:razz::lol::grin:

Bajaa'sDad

what if i have an ash burl that is naturally shaped as a telecaster?

True, but I think the questions have arisen from inconsistant terms throughout this thread. TDPRI has referred to the starting point as "raw wood", "wood blanks", and "wood planks". These are 3 different things. Those who see this figuratively are comfortable with some level of assumption. Others who take it literally would need clarification on this.

It's these differences in us that make us unique, creative and curious creatures. Let's not make some feel less capable or less intelligent simply because they ask questions.

Peace,
Mark
That was absolutely not my intention. I apolgize if it seemed that way. I was simply trying to help him with his question.
And i guarantee I have asked some questions on this board that made me seem less capable or less intelligent. And probably will again, lol.

what if i have an ash burl that is naturally shaped as a telecaster?

You'd probably better take picks with the bark still on it :lol:

hey Mike... that new avatar... did you grow some hair... or is that Bob Villa with a 'fro... ??

Like Turr said, the inimitable Bob Ross, whom I was once compared to on this very forum for my ability to (seemingly) create solid body guitars with a snap of my fingers. :grin:

And a fine resemblance it is :wink:

Dave

That was absolutely not my intention. I apolgize if it seemed that way. I was simply trying to help him with his question.
And i guarantee I have asked some questions on this board that made me seem less capable or less intelligent. And probably will again, lol.

Sorry Mike. I was trying to make a point and I ended up pointing a finger...not my intention either. My apologies.

Peace,
Mark

(now to find some wood to make a neck out of, not easy here)

That's your opinion and it's fine. If it keeps you from entering then so be it. We've had a large number of people suggest that it would be good to actually see or hear the guitars being played.

And, in last year's Challenge several did post YouTube vids of the guitar and it made a huge difference.

The video can be easily taken from a Cell Phone and it need only be 60 secs long and it doesn't have to be the builder that's playing it. If that keeps folks out of the contest... then we'll just have to live with that for this year.

If it works out badly, we won't do it next year. We're still learning what works and what doesn't here.

My phone will only record video for 30 seconds... :mad::sad::neutral::oops::sad::confused:

My phone will only record video for 30 seconds... :mad::sad::neutral::oops::sad::confused:

You can get a web cam for very little dosh:

http://www.amazon.com/Webcam-Camera-Vision-Meeting-compatible/dp/B0015TJNEY/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1298609615&sr=1-1

My phone will only record video for 30 seconds... :mad::sad::neutral::oops::sad::confused:

Well, make two of em. :idea: :roll: :rolleyes:

You can get a web cam for very little dosh:

http://www.amazon.com/Webcam-Camera-Vision-Meeting-compatible/dp/B0015TJNEY/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1298609615&sr=1-1

$6.37 including shipping and it has lights!

You can get a web cam for very little dosh:

http://www.amazon.com/Webcam-Camera-Vision-Meeting-compatible/dp/B0015TJNEY/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1298609615&sr=1-1

$6.37 including shipping and it has lights!


From the Amazon website...

Technical Details
USB interface, no external power supply needed
6 bright white LEDs for night vision
Plug & Play compatible
No built-in microphone
Heavy-duty clip w/ foam pads, will not scratch surfaces it's mounted on

(now to find some wood to make a neck out of, not easy here)

I can help.

From the Amazon website...no built-in microphone

Oops -- thanks for spotting that. There are lots of them
under $10 with mic, though.

http://www.amazon.com/Flexible-Megapixel-Camera-Webcam-Microphone/dp/B0019WF4FE/ref=sr_1_22?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1298638499&sr=1-22

For a little more there are options like this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826193044

Is it just me or does no one have video function in their digi cams? Both of mine do, even my old junk phones, current phone, and my company phone. The video part doesn't seem like a bad deal.

The neck scares me, but the challenge and what I am going to learn is worth it. My goal is to finish and make a tele from scratch. Perhaps one that only a mother could love, but it sounds like fun.

Chuck

"Humans, when presented with an opportunity or challenge will immediately migrate toward the most minute detail of inconvenience, focus on it, then amplify it beyond all logical proportions."

I hope to have fun with this year's challenge by doing several things I've never done in a build before. I expect the video will hurt the viewers more than it will hurt me. :grin:
Good luck to everyone that can adapt to this year's rules, chooses to participate and takes it for what it is: A Challenge.


BTW, if anyone can swipe Jack Wells' design notebook there's a C-note in it for ya. :mrgreen:

I agree newtwanger. I come to look at it as a personal challenge mostly.
Oigun, thanks, I'll send a pm.

"Humans, when presented with an opportunity or challenge will immediately migrate toward the most minute detail of inconvenience, focus on it, then amplify it beyond all logical proportions."

That is so true. What is the source of that quote?

For me doing something I've never done before sometimes presents a road block. I guess I don't want to screw up the work I've completed up to that point. With neck building, the road block for me was the fretting. I had started several necks but stopped at the fretting process. Last year's challenge forced me to plow on through.

I still remember someone saying, "I didn't know you knew how to build guitars." I just said, "I didn't".

Good luck to everyone that can adapt to this year's rules, chooses to participate and takes it for what it is: A Challenge.

Great quote, I am looking forward to the challenge and have a few personal 'firsts' planned for my build. Nothing ground-breaking on the design front.

Have fun everyone, I think it will be good to follow all the builds.

That is so true. What is the source of that quote?

My website from 2003. I was a teacher for 8 years and often wrote humorous stuff from the perspective of my cat to get the students thinking.
The original reference was to a team project that required each member to do something that was not clearly explained but could be researched and derived.
I found it appropriate in the current context too.

It was originally signed "Dinsdale the cat" but that wouldn't have made sense here. Now I guess it does. :smile:

Now can I have a peek at your design book Jack?

I don't understand why there are so many questions about the rules. The Rules were stated in the first post. The rest are just loop holes. By asking questions, you are just closing all the loop holes.

C'mon people ........... you can't get more clear than Paul's reply above.

Uh oh ........caveat...... the following picture is pretty close to the shape of a Bo Diddley guitar.

......http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tele-home-depot/74254d1298518569-just-posted-2011-build-challenge-official-rules-details-dont-miss-out-img_6828-jpg

http://whateves.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/bo_diddley-773864.jpg

You had me watching Bo Diddley videos all night long. Thanks!:twisted:

"Humans, when presented with an opportunity or challenge will immediately migrate toward the most minute detail of inconvenience, focus on it, then amplify it beyond all logical proportions."



I like that. I can't wait for the contest to start and the other stuff to end.

Is there a rule that all the questions end once the challenge begins?

This will be my first for the challenge and I look forward to it as well. I haven't completed a build in under 4 months (with some taking years), so my personal challenge is obvious.

Good luck to everyone.

I haven't completed a build in under 4 months (with some taking years), so my personal challenge is obvious.


I'm thinking the same thing. I listed most of the steps I thought I'd have to do to make a guitar, then divided everything up by the weeks the contest runs and the plan seems a bit ambitious to me, but what the heck. I'm going to give it a go. It will be my first build so there will be much learning going on no matter how far along I get before the challenge ends. Which reminds me, I need to order some tools...

OK so no more late night posting, I just realized the post I made the other night came off just a bit, hmm, obnoxious to my reading now. I didn't mean to sound that way if I did to any reader, I was attempting to be a smart alec, normally I'm up for any challenge when I can, and per others sentiments getting a project done well and in less than 4 months will be my biggest challenge....

Desmo, I agree, I finished a recent build, that I started about 5 years ago...

Getting myself partially ready. Word of advice, the weekend staff at Office Depot in Joplin, MO, a bunch of hair lips. I got one Terry Downs print that I almost got charged 24.99 for until I said if it's that much I'm not buying it. It magically became 2.89 :lol:. Then I couldn't get anymore because they had no more paper. Looks like I'm Rogers, AR bound so I can get some templates made up this weekend.

The neck part is scary for a beginner, but I plan on learning, not winning, and to me the neck is the single most important part of my guitar. There are a lot of posts here that explain the process, so surely I can come up with something that resembles a neck. I want to build something I will play, so learning and building the jigs to cut in a truss rod, tapping in the frets, and all the final work that makes it playable is a really cool challenge.

I just spent several hours in the shop rebuilding the jig I use to drill the concentric truss rod holes in the headstock. I've been dreading rebuilding this thing but preparation for the 2011 build has me out in the shop blasting the music and smiling.

And just think, I also get to build a guitar.

I just spent several hours in the shop rebuilding the jig I use to drill the concentric truss rod holes in the headstock.

Will there be pics of the jig in your build thread? C'mon, share...

Peace,
Mark

Will there be pics of the jig in your build thread? C'mon, share...

Peace,
Mark

Ya - I make all of my truss rods at the head - any screwup in the location seems to stick out like a black eye! Drilling that hole in the right location, at the right angle is something I have make 3 different jigs for and I still completely lack the confidence to do it right the first time - I tend to make 3 necks at a time and count on two of them being good enough - that one step vexes me to no end!!! I've gotten them dead on and others about a 1/16" off and still worked great.

If someone has a good jig for making that hole in the headstock that is not locked into the tuner hole location I would love to see it.

Nope, 4, 6, 7, 8, 10, 12 what ever you want. Tele Bass? Sure.

...1? Teledey bow? :mrgreen:

Dug out and gathered up some stashed parts, got a small idea. Could be fun...
For me, it is a very defiinite "we'll see" in a few days.

"I've never really done this kind of thing before, have you?"
And he said, "Yes I have But only a time or two"

The rules seem pretty straight forward, no problem there. The only question I have is: how many times can I enter? Two months should give me enough time to do between three and six guitars... :twisted: :cool:

The rules seem pretty straight forward, no problem there. The only question I have is: how many times can I enter? Two months should give me enough time to do between three and six guitars... :twisted: :cool:


Show off...:wink:

The rules seem pretty straight forward, no problem there. The only question I have is: how many times can I enter? Two months should give me enough time to do between three and six guitars... :twisted: :cool:
I'm not sure if you could enter several times - but I'm still in awe of your entry from last year. This is amazing work:
http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tdpri-2010-%24210-tele-build-challenge/48504d1272917895-2010-tdpri-%24210-challenge-were-there-dudes-dsc12471-jpg
http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tdpri-2010-%24210-tele-build-challenge/48447d1272879052-2010-tdpri-%24210-challenge-were-there-dudes-dsc12486-jpg

I guess you could give us another effort like this, then have more time for this:

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/attachments/tdpri-2010-%24210-tele-build-challenge/42836d1267906218-2010-tdpri-%24210-challenge-were-there-dudes-dsc11825-jpg

I'm not sure if you could enter several times - but I'm still in awe of your entry from last year. This is amazing work:



Thank you for the kind words!

Two months should give me enough time to do between three and six guitars

Sounds like automation to me.

I think it's in the best interest of everyone if there is only one entry per member.

I will add this to the rules.

Well the "build your own neck" deal puts me out of the competition.

I know, I know. No whining. Maybe next year.




+1.



Having never made a neck, it would probably take me more than 2 months to figure that out, not being the sharpest nail in the bin...:roll:

That is absolutely ok though, as I'm time/money constrained right now anyway, so I will be 100% content to watch this one from the sidelines.


As vintageNut says, there's always next year....:grin:

Just counted 40 participants already signed up. This should be a fun couple o' months.

+1.



Having never made a neck, it would probably take me more than 2 months to figure that out, not being the sharpest nail in the bin...:roll:

That is absolutely ok though, as I'm time/money constrained right now anyway, so I will be 100% content to watch this one from the sidelines.


As vintageNut says, there's always next year....:grin:

I reckon the cure time on the finish is the 800 pound gorilla on critical path, so if I can't be all machined and sanded to dry fit about a week after start..... (and I can't).....
So I'll be in the popcorn section as well. With those who have already announced, this will be exciting to watch.

I reckon the cure time on the finish is the 800 pound gorilla on critical path,

Yeah, I'd enter but the 2 month period is way too fast for me. Finish curing time is pretty much the problem here.

I reckon the cure time on the finish is the 800 pound gorilla on critical path, so if I can't be all machined and sanded to dry fit about a week after start..... (and I can't).....
So I'll be in the popcorn section as well. With those who have already announced, this will be exciting to watch.
It's going to be a week or two after I post my entry before I can get the wood for my build. And if I'm lucky I'll have a week or two for finish(if the weather is nice enough to let me work steadily on the build). So this guitar will not be lacquered. Poly or true oil should do the trick.

It's going to be a week or two after I post my entry before I can get the wood for my build. And if I'm lucky I'll have a week or two for finish(if the weather is nice enough to let me work steadily on the build). So this guitar will not be lacquered. Poly or true oil should do the trick.

That's the right attitude and the right solution. Looking forward to your build gitlvr!

I reckon the cure time on the finish is the 800 pound gorilla on critical path, so if I can't be all machined and sanded to dry fit about a week after start..... (and I can't).....
So I'll be in the popcorn section as well. With those who have already announced, this will be exciting to watch.

That too. I recently had to wait 2 months to get a low enough humidity reading to spray lacquer, let alone the hang time. Maybe we will see a lot of tung oil finishes in this competition.

I am content to be a spectator. I do want to get in a build challenge eventually.

Good luck to all the contestants...:grin:

For the last build contest I entered (on a different forum) I used wipe on poly. It dries nice and hard very fast. Oil finishes are another good option. No one has any valid excuse here, IMO. :mrgreen:

Sounds like automation to me.

Nah, just 18 hour days seven days a week. :twisted:

Though I suppose good planning and 40 or 50 years experience helps a little. :wink:

I think it's in the best interest of everyone if there is only one entry per member.

I will add this to the rules.

I'm good with that. You don't want any liabillity for me dying of a heart attack at my age. :mrgreen:

It would have been fun to try though. :cool:

That too. I recently had to wait 2 months to get a low enough humidity reading to spray lacquer, let alone the hang time. Maybe we will see a lot of tung oil finishes in this competition.

I am content to be a spectator. I do want to get in a build challenge eventually.

Good luck to all the contestants...:grin:

Whatever you do, don't use tung oil! Real tung oil that is. It takes longer than anything in the world to dry! Like more than a month or two. How do I know? I'll give you three guesses, and the first eight don't count. :cry:

If you're going to use oil then use Tru Oil, available at gun shops for finishing gun stocks. It dries to sand in an hour and you can build up a nice finish in two or three days max. :grin:

NOTE: To be fair, tung oil will give you the absolutely best oil finish you can get, but only at the cost of a lot of time waiting for it to dry properly. If you're interested you can find lots of good info through Google.

Yeah, I'd enter but the 2 month period is way too fast for me. Finish curing time is pretty much the problem here.

Hmmmm, y'all might want to have a look through this here brochure from StewMac. According to it, you should be able to get a perfect finish in 8 to 12 days using nitro. I can vouch for the fact that they're right as I've used this very schedule for years, in every kind of weather and with no problems. Perfect lacquer every time! :wink:

That's the right attitude and the right solution. Looking forward to your build gitlvr!
Shellac is all I ever use - put it on and buff it out just like lacquer - only it cures faster and is not as toxic. It's a nice hard finish too.

To all all of you out there who aren't going to enter for one reason or another, just remember this: one day you'll be as old as me (if you're not already :wink:) and you'll look back and say "You know, there was this guitar building contest, but I didn't enter 'cause I knew I could never win anyway." There'll be some other guys out there that are saying " Yeah, there was this guitar building contest, and I built that guitar right over there on the wall!" And their kids and their friends are going to look at it and say "Damn! That's really cool!"

You have nothing to fear but fear itself! Get your butts in gear and beat me! :wink: