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Springs vs Rubber Spacers

robert91352
January 24th, 2010, 08:01 PM
Can metal springs be subed for the rubber spacers? '51 Norcaster pups.

bri
January 24th, 2010, 08:20 PM
Short answer-yes. The tonal differences could be debated ad infinitum I'm sure. I've had guitars with both and couldn't notice any difference, but maybe that's just me.
Brian

robert91352
January 24th, 2010, 08:24 PM
I heard that it contributes to the hum. But if you have had experience with both and didn't notice any negative effects, I'll give it a try. Thanks

rainedave
January 24th, 2010, 11:22 PM
I use silicone fuel tubing (used in the r/c hobby). You can buy three feet of it for a couple of bucks ant any hobby shop.

RD

robert91352
January 25th, 2010, 12:16 AM
Thanks rd... rb

Matt_B
January 25th, 2010, 08:12 AM
I heard that it contributes to the hum.I understand that this is something you heard but logically speaking, how do you think springs would add to the hum?

castpolymer
January 25th, 2010, 10:10 AM
I only use springs made of depleted uranium. The added density really gives me great low end on my pickups.

gatego
January 25th, 2010, 10:19 AM
despite the sound discussion i'd like to bring up another aspect of rubber (silicone,...) it is an electrical insulator and therefore it does not hurt the delicate wires of the coil. If you compress a tube by tightening the pup srews it may touch the wires but it even woul not damage the laquer on the copper wires. Springs are different...

LaExpatriot
January 25th, 2010, 10:36 AM
I like to use springs b/c the tubing is a pain. Every guitar I have had that used the tubing I had issues with the pickups getting loose or not staying in the correct position. After a change to springs I have had no issues.
I do not knwo that it makes any sonic difference but to me the ease of use is better.
Just my opinion.

Two Steps Back
January 25th, 2010, 07:35 PM
I just installed a set of keystones in my partscaster and as I have been tightening the screws on the neck pickup to raise it, the neck side has risen much more than the body side, so it's tilted a bit now. Don't know if it matters much, but it looks a bit funny. Is this what you mean by "not staying in the correct position"?

tgfmike
January 25th, 2010, 07:53 PM
I use springs.

rand z
January 26th, 2010, 02:35 PM
i use both. tubing is a little easier to compress and install. springs, when compressed have, on occasion, flown around the room on me.

cant say that i have noticed any diff in sound. i do think the the tubing weakens over time, where springs have better rigidity.

rand z

Tommyboy
January 26th, 2010, 02:44 PM
I only use springs made of depleted uranium. The added density really gives me great low end on my pickups.

Uhmm...do those springs come in different colors? I heard red ones sound better. :lol:

fendorst
January 27th, 2010, 02:40 PM
tubing seems to isolate vibrations to the pickup, springs seem to let more vibration get to the pickup. so springs (to my ears) give the guitar a more rattly or "live" sound. when i throw my switch into the bridge pup position i hear an audible clank. i like it, and i like slighlty microphonic pups.

i can't say whether i hear an actual tonal difference in the guitar between tubing and springs. but the springs do transfer more vibration and mechanical noise to the bridge pup and definitely make it more clanky.

i happen to like that clanky microphonic "live" sound, but some folks don't.

castpolymer
January 27th, 2010, 03:20 PM
Uhmm...do those springs come in different colors? I heard red ones sound better. :lol:

Red is standard. If you really want to chase that tone, the blue ones have a bit of cobalt added!:wink:

3 Chord
January 28th, 2010, 10:43 PM
Yes. And if springs give the guitar more of a "rattly or live sound", isn't this why we all play Telecasters in the first place?

Personally, I use what I have at the time.

refin
January 28th, 2010, 10:52 PM
Excuse me...........are we REALLY talking tonal/buzz differences between springs and rubber grommets? :shock: :roll:

fezz parka
January 28th, 2010, 10:55 PM
Minutia makes the world go around, Steve.:grin:

fendorst
January 29th, 2010, 02:37 AM
springs vs. tubage is no dumber a discussion than 42 vs. 43 gauge wire wrapping a pickup... or cloth pushback insulation vs. rubber... or 1/4" saddles vs. 5/16"... or handwound vs. machine wound... or callaham vs. glendale, lollar vs. lawrence... or quarter sawn vs. flat sawn... or orange drop vs. paper in oil... or mexico vs. indonesia... or alnico X vs. alnico Y... or domed vs. flat... or alder vs. ash... or 3/64" vs. 4/64" between the pickup and strings... or blackguard vs. whiteguard... or 8 holes vs. 5 holes... or why i NEED a new guitar vs. why the woman who let me marry her says the kids need shoes... or brown vs. the topeka board of education... or the colts vs. the saints... or... or... or...

PeteMac
January 29th, 2010, 07:21 AM
On my partscaster, springs just wouldn't fit ! So I cut some pieces of foam rubber and put those under the neck pickup.
Soft, firm hold and tone for days !!!

prawnik
January 29th, 2010, 10:21 AM
Excuse me...........are we REALLY talking tonal/buzz differences between springs and rubber grommets? :shock: :roll:

Um, this is the TDPRI, sir. We will debate "changes in tone" that a bat could not distinguish in a double-blind test.

(Actually, the TDPRI is one of the more laid-back and skeptical places as far as tone-chasing goes.)

slauson slim
January 29th, 2010, 12:33 PM
Springs - more boing and clank, esp on bridge pickup.

Geosh
January 29th, 2010, 07:52 PM
Red is standard. If you really want to chase that tone, the blue ones have a bit of cobalt added!:wink:

I like the ones that are a slight greenish color and that glow in the dark. Handling them can be an issue, but if you want the best "vintage" tone sometimes you have to make sacrifices!

Daywalker
July 15th, 2011, 10:57 PM
Hey all, I just picked up a slightly used 2010 Baja Tele. She plays and looks great. I have a question about the neck pickup though. It is tilted backwards. I have examined this phenomena and think that the root cause might be improperly drilled holes or the rubber grommets underneath. Any Tele wizards out there know of the right fix?

D.Allen
July 15th, 2011, 11:18 PM
I like both springs and tubing.
When it's really hot out I go to where a cold spring runs into the river and grab a tube and jump in. It's amazing try it you might like it.

nattaruk
July 15th, 2011, 11:20 PM
A spring has a resonant frequency so any vibration near that frequency will be transmitted through the spring. A spring will only dampen vibration at frequencies not close to its resonance, (cf the bridge springs).
Rubber or plastic tubing does not resonate, so it will be better at dampening, if that is what you want.
At least this topic has a scientific basis for its effect on tone unlike capacitor type etc.

Teleterr
July 16th, 2011, 03:16 PM
Once you know the height you want the P/Up at , remove the spring or tube and replace it w washers.The hard coupling transmits the body's vibes that either springs or washers deaden and give a livelier tone. Screwing the P/Up into the body on washers is better still.

Teleterr
July 16th, 2011, 03:18 PM
If you can't hear the difference in caps...well that's a different thread.

Colt W. Knight
July 16th, 2011, 06:40 PM
Excuse me...........are we REALLY talking tonal/buzz differences between springs and rubber grommets? :shock: :roll:

Somebody told me the other day that the material an electrosocket is made of changes the tone of a guitar.

So at this point, I wonder .............

Colt W. Knight
July 16th, 2011, 06:50 PM
If you can't hear the difference in caps...well that's a different thread.

Are you talking about differences in value or differences in construction material?

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/tele-technical/281657-polyester-vs-polypropylene-tone-caps.html

Tony Reid
July 16th, 2011, 11:41 PM
I have tried both and now I only use the rubber tubing.
IMHO there are several differences:
1. If your Tele bridge pickup is already a bit microphonic (usually a good thing), if you use springs you will get uncontrollable feedback (usually a high pitched squeal) very easily. Although at very low volumes the springs will add to the liveliness of the pickup.
2. Rubber tubing makes it easier to install pickups; it stays on the screws, doesn't fall off or fly around the room.
3. On a strat, springs will help to ground the height adjustment screws if you have shielding on the back of your pickguard. Sometimes you will get a buzzing sound when your finger/s touch them, if you are using the tubing. But not enough of a problem for me to use springs.
4. Rubber tubing still allows some of the vibrations from the guitar body to affect the pickup - I get a healthy audible click when I rapidly throw the switch to front or back pickup on all of my Teles. However, I am still undecided as to whether or not this is a good thing.
Tonally - I can't hear any difference (apart from what I mentioned in point 1.), especially on a Strat.

stevieboy
July 17th, 2011, 01:54 AM
Tubing, for two reasons.

1. It's readily available. Like, in the living room in my wife's aquarium supplies stash.

2. I can cut it to the size I need, rather than try to squeeze a spring that's too big down when it's already tough enough to get the screws threaded. Big tone effect there, the tone of my swearing is much more subdued.

Wyzsard
July 17th, 2011, 03:12 AM
About the 3:20 mark, Jason explains why he likes to use springs.

1ZWGITsDCvs&NR=1

Tony Reid
July 17th, 2011, 03:14 AM
the tone of my swearing is much more subdued.

+1 on that!:lol:

Tony Reid
July 17th, 2011, 03:25 AM
About the 3:20 mark, Jason explains why he likes to use springs.
Opinions are also divided among pickup winders. Don Mare, Owen Duffy and Fred Stuart all supply their pickups with rubber tubing. Don also personally warned me about the 'squeal' when I sent him a note one time about how I much I was enjoying the extra liveliness of one of his bridge pickups when I intsalled it with springs) and had been playing it only at low volume. I changed back to the rubber after turning up the volume ....:oops:

robt57
July 17th, 2011, 03:26 AM
Definitely maybe...

telerocker1988
July 17th, 2011, 03:47 AM
I prefer the surgical tubing/rubber spacers. I get fed up with springs too easily.

vanguard
July 17th, 2011, 09:51 AM
springs cause feedback, can sever windings, and are unwieldy as all hell.

give me the squishy yellow stuff

Wyzsard
July 17th, 2011, 04:29 PM
What did Leo use while he ran things ?