Dreaded..F barre chord

I do it this way...gave up on the conventional way....works for me...makes it easy to switch too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anyone else here :razz: use their thumb

Nope, I just made myself practice it until I got it right. However, everyone is different. There's plenty of good guitar players that play the F that way.

My theory is that if I want to barre a Bmaj and any other chords from the second positions on...I'd better learn to barre the F first. I have kind of small hands so it's impossible for me to play a lot of chords with my thumb.

Heck, that way is way harder than the traditional! You should be able to do some crazy stuff if you can get that position.

You could also play a closed position F. Or just do an inversion with the 3rd in the bass. You can definitely stretch your fingers

Hmmm....never thought of that. Use my thumb to get the F# on a D/F#. Not a big fan of the first fret Bb either.

I was grateful to have practiced all of my barre chords when I realized there was life beyond the first five frets!

Jimi and Merle Travis played in that style !!! i just play an F on the four highest strings ... a lot of my barre chords use only three notes ... cheating, laziness, and shortcutting all work for me !!!

Im trying the barre, theres no way i could get my thumb over the neck like that and then move to something else, but a mate of mine does what you do and has for years...

thats exactly how i do it! i play a lot with my thumb...actually i do all my barre chords like that.

Hendrix played the E shaped bar chord a lot with his thumb. He'd often mute the A string with his thumb which freed up his pinky to do cool stuff. Wind Cries Mary chorus is an example...

Although it's instinctive for me to use the the first finger barre, I sometimes thumb it a la Jimi, covering both the 5th and the octave with my 3rd finger leaves the pinky free for all kinds of jiggery-pokery.

After Initially injuring my wrist with barre chords, I came back and now only play E shape and A shape chords. For F bar you don't need to play the 5th and 6th string. They're repetitions of other notes already being played, so F barre does not need to be barred.

After Initially injuring my wrist with barre chords, I came back and now only play E shape and A shape chords. For F bar you don't need to play the 5th and 6th string. They're repetitions of other notes already being played, so F barre does not need to be barred.

Very true! Especially if you're in a band with others covering the bass part of the spectrum, just play the first four strings. I almost never play the A and E strings...of course unless it's called for. You can usually get away with the abridged version.

I agree with others: the dreaded chord for me is Bb (A form). But of course you can play that 4-string F figure up at the 6th fret and have a nicer sounding Bb, add the 5th on the A string (8th fret) and you've got a very nice chord, much better than the A form Bb at the first fret. Not that anyone asked.

Depends on what I'm playing, but I frequently play F this way if I'm doing pinger picking stuff since it leaves 1 - 5 available for playing other notes. Never had a problem with full bar chords though. Just do what comes natural.

i do the thumb thing too, always have ... it helps to have big hands, tho!

i usually catch both the A and D strings with the third finger (spatulate fingertips!) and leave the pinky free for the 7th if needed.

Do what feels natural and give practice to what does not.
Pretty soon you'll have both applications down pat and be a better player for it.

After Initially injuring my wrist with barre chords, I came back and now only play E shape and A shape chords. For F bar you don't need to play the 5th and 6th string. They're repetitions of other notes already being played, so F barre does not need to be barred.

Same here, but for different reasons, It's impossible for me to barre all 6 strings, due to a seriously bust up index finger some years ago. I "cheat" on lots of chords. Necesity is the mother of invention as they say.

I use both... it depends on what is before and after the F...

You can not do a shuffle with the thumb over position or quickly switch to a 6th, 7th, minor or other variants and when using the thumb over... The thumb over is good for some fingerstyle applications.

The ring finger on the left hand can be trained to hyper extend.

I asked my friend Florencio how he was fretting a "C" chord at the third fret, long ago.

He took his hands off the guitar and pressed his two ring fingers together, bending each backwards.

The one on his L. hand flexed back A LOT further than on his R. hand.

Ah! Epiphany!

It is very handy to train that finger to cover the B,G, and D strings on a Barre chord.

You might be amazed how stretching, hyper extending that digit can bring quick results.

sometimes yes

sometimes no

depends where those fingers came from

depends upon where those fingers have to go

if you know what I mean!

:wink:

IMHO you are handicapping yourself, making 1st fret Bb and 1st fret Eb harder to switch to. I will always recommend just keep trying until it stops being hard to do.

sometimes yes

sometimes no

depends where those fingers came from

depends upon where those fingers have to go

if you know what I mean!

:wink:

+1 All up and down the neck.

The only time I hook my thumb over the top is for a 6/9 chord..

Depends on how well the guitar is set up, too. Even on an acoustic, holding down the F chord shouldn't be much harder than an F# or barred G, but many have excessively high nut slots.

- Scott

If you have large hands like I do "extra large gloves are tight", doing the proper bar chords are extremely uncomfortable, and for me causes tendon problems.
I can do the F chord barring with my thumb only on my slim necked G&L Asat.

Both ways, depending on the song, and on which chord I'm coming from/going to. Like some other folks here, I only use my ring finger for the A and D string (also just use the middle finger to cover the A and D strings for an open E chord, and play open Am the same way)

I can do both fine but I like the OP method best. I also use it to alternate base notes on the F for a couple blues songs from E-F.

I have always gripped the neck like that though. I rarely grip the neck traditionally.

Funny that this thread would be up here now. I was noticing that same problem with the F barre chord (actually F minor) yesterday. And, I needed the low note on the big string.

I only have this problem with my acoustic guitar... maybe the nut slots and/or overall action are too high, maybe the strings are too heavy... I don't know.

What I did find, is that the problem seemed to be where the middle knuckle of my pointer finger wasn't quite fretting the string it was over - leaving at least one dead string. My solution was to change the position of that pointer finger. I usually fret those E-shaped barre chords with the end of that finger on the big E string - I moved my finger so its bottom (where it connects to my hand) frets the little E string - a lot of the finger just extends past the neck. I think that just hides the not-quite-fretting part of that pointer finger behind the strings I'm fretting with other fingers. So far, it's working for me.

Rjes, I always wanted to make my F chord that way so I could get the Fmaj7 with the bass F but I broke my left index as a kid which makes that grip impossible to do. I'm stuck with the Full F Bar Chord or the grip without the bass F..........

I use my thumb when it's handy, but seldom for barre chords.

I forced myself to learn "normal" barre chords when I first started. Then a year or two into playing, I realized if I was playing ALL barre chords in a song, my left hand hurt like blazes.

I spent tons of time coming up with different inversions, partial barres, partial chords, open-string voicings, etc., just so I wouldn't have to barre... and nowadays, I rarely have to.

I use my thumb for the F barre chord sometimes. It opens up some nice possibilities for me like lifting my 2nd finger to add the open G string to the chord, or moving my first finger to add the open E string for a Maj.7th. voicing. Another option is dropped D tuning, which puts the 6th. string F on the 3rd. fret and works surprisingly well in the key of C or A minor. While I agree with some of the others that you don't need the low F in some musical settings, both of these work well for the times when you do and allow you to add a little harmonic movement.

Nope, I just made myself practice it until I got it right. However, everyone is different. There's plenty of good guitar players that play the F that way.

My theory is that if I want to barre a Bmaj and any other chords from the second positions on...I'd better learn to barre the F first. I have kind of small hands so it's impossible for me to play a lot of chords with my thumb.
Have you considered a smaller guitar? Perhaps a 3/4 size? My wife (5 foot nuthin and 100 lbs.) has the same problem with small hands, and this solution has made her very happy!

Cheers, Peter

Doesn't matter how you finger it, as long as it sounds good...


BUT


these bar chords and 1st position cowboy chords sound horrible, IMHO. One of the worst sounds in existence on any instrument. If you play voicings like that (with 3 F's, 2 C's, voicings that cover 5 or 6 strings), you can turn the sound of your whole band into a muddy, mushy mess.


If you want to play chords that sound a little better
- play fewer notes (leave the root to the bass player..)
- try spread triads, or any approach to spread out the notes
- consider the band context: if your singer sings a C that's on the B string, 1st fret of your guitar, play chord notes that stay underneath it (on E, A, D, or g strings), and leave out the C in your chord...

As a terrible guitar player (who also can't play barre chords) may I ask a dumb question?

Why is the Subject about F barre chords?

The O/P's fingering would also work one fret up as a F# chord ... two frets up as a G chord and so on.

I'd call the topic "sixth string rooted chords" or something like that.

Probably because most folks initially learn it as a four string 'F' chord, then learn that "closed" shapes can be moved up the neck (and given new names), and then they learn the 6 string version, so they associate it with 'F'. "Guitaristically", it's obviously an 'E' shape.

I mostly play chord fragments, but there are times when a closed six string barre is the order of the day. Getting them to sound good when they're needed is an art, as to touch and intonation.

We all have physical limitations to deal with. I'd say: go with what's comfortable, but keep pushing as to what is not. A friend of mine is a lifer musician that has never held any job other than musician, for decades. He can play multiple improvised choruses of "Donna Lee" or "Cherokee" that are amazing, and he can land an orchestra pit gig any day of the week and sight read like there's no tomorrow. He's a walking encyclopedia of music and music history, and he's done *a few* more gigs than me. On the flip side, as much of a Beatles freak as he is, he can't play that D/A to A barre cadence that John Lennon played on "I've Got A Feeling" - cleanly and consistently for three solid minutes - to save his life, whereas I use that move frequently. He and I joke about it all the time, but I consider him to be among my mentors. Everybody's different.

As a terrible guitar player (who also can't play barre chords) may I ask a dumb question?

Why is the Subject about F barre chords?


I think the point behind specifically saying F is that that particular chord shape in the first position is physically taxing as it is so close to the nut. On aa cheap acoustic with think strings it can sometimes seem like you need vice grip hands to get at F and B in position 1. I was pretty good at this when i was a kid since i had strong hands, but after several hand operations and a significantly weaker left hand i can relate. I hate songs that have lots of F & Bb bar chords in them. They wear me out in a hurry.

I think the point behind specifically saying F is that that particular chord shape in the first position is physically taxing as it is so close to the nut. On aa cheap acoustic with think strings it can sometimes seem like you need vice grip hands to get at F and B in position 1. I was pretty good at this when i was a kid since i had strong hands, but after several hand operations and a significantly weaker left hand i can relate. I hate songs that have lots of F & Bb bar chords in them. They wear me out in a hurry.

Your'e explanation is right on ...I could play them easier when I was younger or even now on an electric with narrow fingerboard..But if I play barre chords F - G it hurts my thumb in lower palm area and will screw it up for days or forever if I keep doing it..

I've got really short fingers for a man ... I can hook my thumb around on the first few
frets and just catch the E string but not up the guitar ... I find the standard barr chord positions are the most comfortable for me for stumming.
Songs like 'born to be wild' using the pinky and stretching ... murder!

My solution was to change the position of that pointer finger.

My similar solution was turning my index finger just a little so the strings are held down by the side of my index finger. We're all so different, haha.

aint it a b#$ch when some strings are dampened?

Learnt from the start to use my thumb, and find it easier that a first finger barre.

I remember that my initial problem with this shape, wasn't the thumb thing, but getting the first finger to flatten on the first & second strings.

I never had trouble with it. Remember, your index finger only frets strings 1, 2, and 6.....not all of them.

It can be brutal if your nut isn't done right, though.

I think the point behind specifically saying F is that that particular chord shape in the first position is physically taxing as it is so close to the nut.


Got it. Makes sense. Thanks.

A beginner acquaintance recently asked me about playing the dreaded "F" chord on his guitar. He handed it to me and I found I couldn't play a full barre F chord on it either! Like many guitars I come across owned by relatively inexperienced players, the nut was cut way too high. With acoustic gauge strings, 54's I'd guess, this meant for a very tough squeeze on the first couple of frets. I showed him my own guitar, with the nut cut correctly so the clearance over the first fret is only fractionally greater than the clearance over the second fret when fretted at the first, and he could play a barre chord on it fairly easily. Action at the twelfth fret on both guitars was more or less the same.

Rick J

Cursed with small hands.....SO barre chords are the only way as getting my thumb around is near impossible for an f chord......

I'm self-taught but I learned early on that when you drape the thumb over the neck it makes it very difficult to move/use your other fingers. I think it really limits what you can do. I always considered it bad technique.

A gazillion ways to express an "F" chord. No right way, no wrong way. What works best and is comfortable for you. Barre chords are considered "power chords" which are favored by rock rhythm players. Jazz, Classical, Fingerstyle players all tend to favor fingerings that offer greater flexibility for inversion, change, etc.

Basically, if you want to effectively barre and you have no physical challenges, then keep practicing at it. Don't overdo the practice however. I ended up with a frozen shoulder from over practicing on the fiddle a few years back. Probably improper positioning played a part as well, I admit.

Good Luck!

www.edharrismusic.com

Lots of acoustic players use the "thumb over" F chord. Even on a good acoustic, it's pretty hard to get a clean tone from a full barre at the first fret.

But even for advanced players, the "thumb over" makes for easier chord changes, and allows them to use the pinky to add melody notes. From Doc Watson to Rev. Gary Davis to the aforementioned Merle Travis, it's one thing they agree on.

I remember reading somewhere that Jimmy Page said he couldn't make proper barre chords,and played them like the OP pic.
I find the downfall of alot of acoustics (even high end stuff) is that the nut slots could be cut a little deeper.

Amen to that allen st. john!

I use both methods, but I think I go with the thumb more often. It depends on if my hand is in pain at the moment I have to change to F! Long time with the aches and pains in my left hand. But higher up the neck I usually go with the 1st finger Barre. When I learned, it was the thumb on the 6th string, then went to the finger, now back to mostly the thumb in my older age.

Get the nut cut down and use lighter strings.