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Best Pot For Gradual Volume Swells?

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 03:28 PM
I need a new volume pot. Not sure what's in there now, but as soon as it comes off zero there's low volume, I want something that's more gradual. It seems to me it should turn a bit and then have gradual increase.
What do you guys recommend?

wetland10
September 2nd, 2009, 03:30 PM
Audio taper pot?

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 03:50 PM
Yes, audio taper. I'm looking for brand name recommendations. Maybe I'll buy a few and see if I can find one I like, I guess.

KevinB
September 2nd, 2009, 03:56 PM
Take a look at RS Guitar Work's superpots (http://www.rsguitarworks.net/rsstore/product_info.php?cPath=45_65&products_id=287).

They are made by CTS to RS' specifications.

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 04:03 PM
Thanks, KevinB, I'm gonna give one of those a try!:cool:

Wally
September 2nd, 2009, 04:13 PM
sultan, you might take a look at what you are playing. IF there is a treble bypass cap circuit on that volume pot, just cut it out and the audio taper will return to normal.

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 05:07 PM
sultan, you might take a look at what you are playing. IF there is a treble bypass cap circuit on that volume pot, just cut it out and the audio taper will return to normal.
I was wondering about that, and saw something about it after a search. I do have a treble bleed, I'm going to unhook it and see what happens.

Is there a way to wire up a treble bleed that won't affect the taper?

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 05:11 PM
1. If you like the feel of an audio taper pot, where basically the volume control is very slow until you hit 7 or so and then it takes off, perhaps you may want to try the 50s wiring of your tone control (where the tone cap connects to the wiper of the volume control, as opposed to the input lug) instead. Otherwise, adding any brightness network will "speed up" the taper. [ Note - I don't own a vintage guitar, but I believe that old audio pots used in guitars may have had a 30% taper -- this was certainly the case with vintage amplifiers -- which is quite a bit closer to linear than to the 10% taper that most (except custom made) new pots have. ]

Wally
September 2nd, 2009, 05:12 PM
Sultan, the treble bypass circuit is there to allow a gradual taper....that is, it comes on down low on the dial and gradually increases. Without the treble bypass cap on an audio taper pot, the pot really isn't of much use from 7 on down on the dial. Most people who do volume swells prefer audio tapers without the treble bypass cap for this reason. Those of us who like to go from clean to csream with certain amps like to have a treble bypass cap on an audio taper or simply have a linear taper volume pot.

Wally
September 2nd, 2009, 05:17 PM
1. If you like the feel of an audio taper pot, where basically the volume control is very slow until you hit 7 or so and then it takes off, perhaps you may want to try the 50s wiring of your tone control (where the tone cap connects to the wiper of the volume control, as opposed to the input lug) instead. Otherwise, adding any brightness network will "speed up" the taper. [ Note - I don't own a vintage guitar, but I believe that old audio pots used in guitars may have had a 30% taper -- this was certainly the case with vintage amplifiers -- which is quite a bit closer to linear than to the 10% taper that most (except custom made) new pots have. ]



IME, the '50's wiring(Gibson) acts somewhat like the treble bypass cap or the linear taper....that is, it yields a wider use of the pot's range.
Vintage pots??? IME, Fender used audio pots that act a lot like audio pots of today. My old Gibson...pre-'70's.... acts this way. All old FEnders act like audio pots....until FEnder started using the treble bypaoss cap in the late
'60's. Gibson started using 300K linear taper pots in the early '70's.

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 05:37 PM
Sultan, the treble bypass circuit is there to allow a gradual taper....that is, it comes on down low on the dial and gradually increases. Without the treble bypass cap on an audio taper pot, the pot really isn't of much use from 7 on down on the dial. Most people who do volume swells prefer audio tapers without the treble bypass cap for this reason. Those of us who like to go from clean to csream with certain amps like to have a treble bypass cap on an audio taper or simply have a linear taper volume pot.
Yep, I took it out and that fixed the 'problem'. This is a humbucker tele, it doesn't seem to make much difference in the tone either way. Don't know why TV Jones recommends it, it comes with the pickups.
I like this better, but it is a drastic change in the taper, as you said, not much use below 7 except for swells.

Telesavalis
September 2nd, 2009, 05:38 PM
Hydro?

Bozo Bus
September 2nd, 2009, 05:45 PM
:rolleyes:Hydro?

sultan59
September 2nd, 2009, 05:48 PM
Hydro?
wouldn't that be best for immediate blast off?:mrgreen:

Wally
September 2nd, 2009, 05:54 PM
Yep, I took it out and that fixed the 'problem'. This is a humbucker tele, it doesn't seem to make much difference in the tone either way. Don't know why TV Jones recommends it, it comes with the pickups.
I like this better, but it is a drastic change in the taper, as you said, not much use below 7 except for swells.

Sultan, the treble bypass cap allows the frequencies selected by the value of the cap to be passed on as the volume pot is turned down. This maintains presence. The lack of the treble bypass cap results in what you are hearing now.....the highs are not there as you turn the pot down and so there is no 'presence'.....and those lower settings are not of much use. Witha treble bypss cap, a linear taper pot, or with the '50's wiring; one can find more usefulnness of those lower volume settings.

jefrs
September 2nd, 2009, 07:35 PM
It is the audio or log taper that gives the sudden shut off, an A250k turned halfway is reduced to 25k (1:10), so sudden death.

The linear pot on the other hand gives gradual control of the volume, a B250k turned halfway is 125k (1:1).

Fender generally fit CTS audio taper to MIM and MIA. Alpha pots (split spline shafts) are available as both audio/log (A) or linear (B) in 250k or 500k.

The treble bleed cap does not help with volume swells because it alters the tone. The volume control on 50's wiring also acts as a tone control if the tone control itself is wound back.

H/S combinations are notoriously difficult to match to one tone control, the only one I've found to work simultaneously for HB and SC is the Fender TBX - with a B500K vol pot. It's to do with matching load to the impedance of the pickup. If you want the tone to remain stable at all volume positions than the load must remain stable, i.e. tone control before volume, the vol pot is the main load to the pickup. A HB usually wants a 500k vol pot, they go muddy on 250k, a SC prefers 250k but can make-do with 500k. Same with the tone control, HB and SC have different requirements, a Delta no-load will work but only when turned up to 10 and disconnected, the TBX offers over 1megohm at 10 and the cap is out of circuit, effectively no-load, above halfway it is purely resistive, below halfway it becomes an A250k plus cap.

I have an H/S tele and get very acceptable controls with B500k vol and a TBX. The vol can be rolled back to 3 and still be there, the TBX runs both HB and SC together well.

One should experiment.

Swiftpicx
September 5th, 2009, 11:11 AM
Hello jefrs

Thanks for your post's, & the info. they contain.
would this set up ( B250K & TBX ) also work on a S/S Tele ( Fender Texas Specials )
would you please recomend a true blend pot for this set up also ?

I'm not sue if I want the TBX, or a DPDT ~ DP3T mini switch to change cap value's & just go with the A250k tone pot & a blend.

Thanks for a reply

Steve

Televised
September 5th, 2009, 11:27 AM
Based on the title, I thought this thread was going to be involving recreational suggestions circa 60's...Woodstock etc. My Bad.