Hipshot question (calling Will Ray...)

This is mostly directed at Will, but I figured I'd post here since his answers are often informative. So...

OK, Will, I notice the Will Ray Store on Ebay (I assume it's you) is selling Hipshot plain B-benders. Fantastic price, I might add. But I see you don't have the version with the drop D lever.

So is there something I should know? Like is the tuning machine version somehow better than the toggle on the bender plate? Or is this just because you got a volume deal on a bunch of the plain ones?

I ask because I'm sure I want a hipshot B bender, just debating the toggle versus tuning machine approach to drop D. (I love the tuning machine version on my bass, FWIW.)

Thanks in advance,
--Rob in WI

My Hipshot has B & G benders, and 3 toggles. I have the tuner version on 4 other guitars and my baritone. I prefer the toggle on the Hipshot itself. It's faster, for me at least. I don't have to take my hand off the neck while I'm still playing. If you're playing with your left hand down near the nut, okay. But if you're up higher on the neck??? It just is lost time to move your hand, flip the tuner lever, and then move back to where you need to be.

Good point

I actually found that the lever on the hipshot is much better than the peg style.

OK, Will, I notice the Will Ray Store on Ebay (I assume it's you) is selling Hipshot plain B-benders. Fantastic price, I might add. But I see you don't have the version with the drop D lever.

So is there something I should know?

I ask because I'm sure I want a hipshot B bender, just debating the toggle versus tuning machine approach to drop D. (I love the tuning machine version on my bass, FWIW.)

Thanks in advance,
--Rob in WI

Hi Rob,
Although I started out with the standard Hipshot with the drop D lever, I have always preferred the simple, streamlined version of the Hipshot. I just never seem to need the drop D, and it usually requires an extra hole drilled somewhere. Plus the extra lever adds a tad more weight.

I like simple. And the basic Hipshot we sell at our eBay store is something I had urged Dave Borisoff at Hipshot to make for many years (I've been using a Hipshot since 1983).

I also have G&L install the streamlined version on all my USA and import signature model guitars.

But keep in mind that you can always start out with the simple version and add attachments as you go. That's the beauty of the Hipshot. And there are plenty of people out there who use the attachments well.

Cheers.
Will

Thanks Will. Good point about adding parts.

Hi There...and hello, Will! I a big, big fan...as well as a hipshot bender! Your DVD helped me truly immerse myself in the wild world of bending.

I prefer the D lever. You can switch between open and drop-d mid song without taking your fret hand off the neck.

I also have the g-a lever. I find the b lever and the g palm lever - when working together in tandem - can make for some excellent pedal steel sounds.

:)

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I like all Hipshots - the streamlined ones as well as the fancy-pants versions. For some reason I'm just not into the de-tuners on them. Nothing wrong with using them. Plenty of great players use them. It's all just what you get used to.

BTW, Dave Borisoff (inventor of the Hipshot) was just visiting with Gayle and I on Monday and he has some new things coming out in January that will be most interesting for us benders.

Keep bending!

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Hi!

I have started to develop a lust for somekind of Hipshot bender. While I probably have enough challenge in basic b-bender I wonder should I buy a one with g palm leveler as well (since the price is in the same ball park anyway)?

Main concern is does the palm lever hinder somehow my playing just by being there, even if I don't use it? Like accidental bends, or hitting right hand there painfully or such.

Some suggestions for seller in EU would be appreciated as well. Thomann sells them starting 169 € (plus 20 € shipping)

Hi!

I have started to develop a lust for somekind of Hipshot bender. While I probably have enough challenge in basic b-bender I wonder should I buy a one with g palm leveler as well (since the price is in the same ball park anyway)?

Main concern is does the palm lever hinder somehow my playing just by being there, even if I don't use it? Like accidental bends, or hitting right hand there painfully or such.

Some suggestions for seller in EU would be appreciated as well. Thomann sells them starting 169 € (plus 20 € shipping)

I bought the one with g palm bender. I don't like the g palm bender too much yet, but I don't think it's hinder my playing technique. No accidental bends or so. I just think that the b-bender (hip bender) works really smooth and I can use my booth hands for playing guitar.

But for the price i think one can buy the version with the g-bender and then decide.

I bought my Hipshot B-bender at thomann. It less than a week to deliver it to sweden (working days).

//P

As Will implies, *where* you have the drop-D lever is not as important as the primary question - do you *need* it?

Most players never use a dropped-D; some only rarely. In those cases, it probably doesn't make sense to have one at all. If you use it on one song a gig (and for the whole song) you can pretty easily just tune the string down the old-fashioned way.

But if you use dropped-D a lot, or play songs where you need it midstream, then it makes sense.

It's like guys who put them on guitars to emulate Clarence White - he used a *high* dropped D on Nashville West and a few other things, but on the low end he used his Keith tuner on the "A" string...not the E. Marty Stuart moved it to the E (although it's been said Clarence had his on the E a few times). Out of the guys I know with Nashville West and similar model bender guitars with Keith or Schaller D-tuners, almost none of them ever use the low one at all.

Gadgets like that are nice to have - but only if you actually NEED them. Like Will, when I played my Hipshot for a couple of years I used only the "b" hip lever...the other stuff was unused...in fact, I didn't even hook strings up to them after a while!

I prefer a Scruggs tuner for dropping my low string, and use the standard Will Ray model hipshot. I have owned a couple different hipshots and found (for me at least) the simple hipshot works the best.

When I was giggin' 5-6 nights a week, I used the toggles a lot! My B/G Hipshot has three. Lowering the E's to D's, and the A to G. Instant Low G Dobro/Bottleneck tuning. Man, I used them a lot! I also use my G-bender much more often than my B-bender. But,,,,, this is my style, not anyone else's. You have to decide for yourself.

One further question: it seems to be possible to add more toggles in to hipshot benders.

I wonder is there a difference between E-D toggle and A-G toggle, is it possible to move E toggle into A toggle easily or at all.

You can definitely add or subtract features; you'll need a good pair of snap-ring pliers.

Although I moved to Glasers and then Parsons' I have fond memories of seeing Will at the Palomino with his 3 pickup Tele with Hipshot and visiting Dave and his dad in early 1990 at the old Van Nuys shop where they installed my lefty standard version. I still have it, waiting for the right non-Tele guitar. Still make the Hipshot booth a regular NAMM stop.

Thank you all!

As experts would you please look at a picture in this link:
http://www.thomann.de/fi/hipshot_standard_b_bender.htm

Does it have all these three options: a hip operated B bender, palm G bender and toggle for low E to D?

It has.

You may get better prices (even import taxes and shipping fees regarded) for any custom configured HipShots at Ed's shop:
http://myworld.ebay.de/eosada/

I have dealt several times with Ed, and he is friendly and correct.

Greetings -
Luther

Danke Schön! I just ordered the one in the Thomann link. Can't wait to get my hands on to it.

I have fond memories of seeing Will at the Palomino with his 3 pickup Tele with Hipshot and visiting Dave and his dad in early 1990 at the old Van Nuys shop where they installed my lefty standard version. I still have it, waiting for the right non-Tele guitar. Still make the Hipshot booth a regular NAMM stop.
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I still have that old Tele too. I really miss the Palomino club. Some good memories there.

Dave was over at the house last week and we talked about the early Hipshot days. He put out his first benders in 1983, the year I got my first one. I guess that makes the Hipshot bender 25 years old now.

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Danke Schön! I just ordered the one in the Thomann link. Can't wait to get my hands on to it.

:)

I did the same some years ago and even paid 50 Euros more for my first B/G/E-Bender than you now. Sometimes it's important to do things "right now".

You will very much enjoy playing your guitar with the new Hipshot!

Greetings -
Luther

You can definitely add or subtract features; you'll need a good pair of snap-ring pliers.


anybody have a link to buy the proper snap ring pliers?

Ok, now I got one. It's installed, kinda, or in the middle of instruction process. I think I almost got "what goes where" but one lil' detail I can't quite understand.

In this picture you see two heavy springs under the B-bender and E>D lever. Mine has one spring more under the palm lever as well. They don't seem to be connected to anything really... what's their function and should I connect them somewhere? Or something into them. The manual doesn't seem to say anything about them.

http://images7.thomann.de/pics/bdb/116845/83516_800.jpg

They're string guides: the strings go under the "hooks" and on towards the bridge (better string pressure that way, I imagine)

Thanks, Iain!

It seems to me I don't need the string guides. I don't seem to need bigger holes for string thru bridge holes nor notches either that way.

Strings have enough room height wise when they go straight from tail pieces to hipshot string holes. (I like quite a high action.)

I don't have string slipping sideways since I removed brass barrels and put harder steel barrels with string slots instead. Now I wonder if it would be a good idea to have the neck shimmed a bit so I could get tail pieces even higher if the need arises to get more string angle (tail pieces to bender)?

Bender works quite well indeed. It's been years since I got this exited in guitar playing that I got blisters in me fingers! However I notice other strings to go slightly down out of tune when another string is bended. I wonder does adding another two screws in addition to strap holder button screw help to that problem?

Before drilling more holes,,,, get a "C" clamp. Use it to very firmly clamp the top of the Hipshot to your guitar body. Use a wood shim and a piece of cloth to avoid damaging your guitar. With the Hipshot clamped tightly, play it and see if the other strings still drop. If they do, extra screws probably won't help. With it still clamped, bend the string manually. If the other strings still drop, it may be your guitar.

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Look, if you hook up a tuner and bend strings manually or with a bender, you'll find the other strings are going to go slightly out of tune (flat) on the tuner. That's normal, and it's one reason I fine-tune my Hipshot to bend the B sting slightly flat, so that it matches the other strings. Don't sweat it. It's normal.

As to the retainer springs, I never use them anymore because I drill a hole behind the bridge which keeps the angle just right. When I play, I use a pick and fingers on my right hand and tend to "lift" the strings off the bridge saddle if the angle isn't perfect. If you use a pick only, you may not need anything.

Just my 2¢ worth.


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Look, if you hook up a tuner and bend strings manually or with a bender, you'll find the other strings are going to go slightly out of tune (flat) on the tuner. That's normal, and it's one reason I fine-tune my Hipshot to bend the B sting slightly flat, so that it matches the other strings. Don't sweat it. It's normal.

Thanks, Will!

Slightly flat is the key word here indeed. I'm sure I can live with that.

As to the retainer springs, I never use them anymore because I drill a hole behind the bridge which keeps the angle just right. When I play, I use a pick and fingers on my right hand and tend to "lift" the strings off the bridge saddle if the angle isn't perfect. If you use a pick only, you may not need anything.

I use both pick and fingers too but I may be a bit more gentle - or use heavier strings - since I don't seem to have the problem with lifting the string off of the saddles.

Now I need some grease to lumbricate critical points. Into local bicycle repair shop.

BTW: What a great resource this forum is! Newbie gets instant advice from the best of the field.