Ceriatone Overtone first impressions

candh · November 26th, 2007, 11:26 PM

I posted this on the Ceriatoneforum but I know there were a few interested in the amp here. There is nothing technical just some comments. This is all IMHO of course.

I have had the Overtone for more than a week now and have been playing it and A/B'ing with the D'Lite. I only had one chance to get it up to gig volumes at a jam the other night so most of my observations are of the amp at less than perfect (lower volume) conditions.

That said,, Let me first dispell the sentiment that there might be something wrong with the amp. (People were grumbling waiting for a review)
Trust me there is NOTHING wrong with the Overtone. If a negative thing could be said about the amp is it has far too many great and useable tones and it's going to take much longer than a week to get aquainted with this "multitalented" amplifier.

Let's begin with the cleans....

Like the D'lite you have two distinct flavors of clean at your disposal. With the clean volume down and the master up there is a lot of beautiful sparkle and jingle like any good blackface and the bright switch in conjunction with the tone stack can get you all kinds of variability on that theme. If you crank up the clean channel volume (about 2'oclock) and keep the master low the cleans warm up (like all similar amps) but the range of clean from dark to sparkle can be finely adjusted with the tone tack, bright switch and the deep switch, which itself adds a very attractive scooped tone where the amp is warm yet sparkly on the top end. Engage the PAB and your mids come alive for a lot of cut in a big band setting. I don't know why but the treble pot in the tone stack remains somewhat interactive with the PAB engaged. It made me think of the 5E3 tone/volume interaction and actually makes for a nice jazz tone....lol. Between all of the switching options and interactivity there are seemingly limitless permutations on the tones you get in the clean channel alone.
If I were to make a generalization on comparing the cleans of the Overtone to the D'Lite it would be that the Overtone is bigger and bolder. The mid focus is very present but there is also the ability to dial in more highs and significantly more lows if desired.

The OD channel.....

The jury is still out on this one. Not because of anything bad but for the most part I haven't had all that much time to dig into it. In it's stock form the amp is tailored for humbuckers ( like all of these D flavoured circuits) and the wide range of the aforementioned functional clean tones goes for the OD channel as well. On similar settings as the D'Lite the Overtone sounds very um ....similar...I mean VERY close. However, I think it's just my style of playing but I just can't seem to get that "chewy" ScottL tone thing happening (on either amp). The Overtone has quite a bit more punch than the DL so it can do the Marshall grind very nicely. Again, I have to get into the amp more before I can really say any more.

The FET input??.......haven't even tried it yet....so no comment.

Build quality......

I've put together quite a few amps and I know I couldn't do any better than this. I don't think there are any components that I would substitute on the basis of poor quality. Maybe a few Kiwame resistors....lol (I'm on a Kiwame kick these days). I don't know if it's just me but there seem to be a few too many Vishay Dales in here.? I always like to see a dash of CC's for flavour....well, maybe not in this amp.
The chassis is well made and is plenty strong enough to support the rather hefty transformers. I like the fact there are eight bolts to help distribute the hanging weight on your cab. One should consider bracing if you are going to be rough on the cab.

Last but not least......

If you can, try as many different tubes as a possible. These amps get the majority of their tone from the preamp. I've settled on Mullards and Syls for pre's and Winged C's for the power section.
Speakers, too. I am using an Eminence RW&B but as soon as I find one I'm going to try a G12-65 as that is the standard by which all D style amps are played through these days.

All in all, the amp is a tweakers seventh heaven but as stock it can hold it's own to any of the goliaths out there.

And finally...lol At the recent jam there were several BF Fender's, a signature Two Rock, a Maz 18, a brown Vibroverb RI and my D'Lite and the Overtone (just the chassis). The Two Rock and the Overtone were the stars of the party and not to elaborate but .....I don't see any need to be buying a $10,000 Two Rock anytime soon...

Cheers,

Chris

teletard · November 26th, 2007, 11:41 PM

this is the dumble clone? how many watts. how did the cleans lie in the mix with the blackface fenders. so is it more for balls out distortion or the semi distorted tone. does it clean up really sweet with the guitar volume knob

candh · November 27th, 2007, 01:03 AM

Yes, it is the Dumble inspired circuit. It was a bloody loud jam with a heavy handed drummer. We were playing a lot of different styles, country, blues, jazzy bits etc.....The Fenders were loud enough but fatiguing. The only Fender I heard clean was the Vibroverb 2x10 RI but I think it was a little "sick" as it just didn't have any wow to my ears. The Two Rock and Overtone were more than loud and powerful enough to sit in the mix perfectly and never obnoxious. The D'lite lacks a little of the lower mids of the bigger boys but a few guys were VERY impressed with it. These amps have plenty of gain available but clean up really well and the OD channel with the volume rolled off a touch on a Les Paul is a beautiful thing.

It's a two 6L6 amp and has lots of poop so I would say 35+ watts...I don't know.

SMPTE · November 27th, 2007, 02:45 AM

Very very cool, I'm assuming yours came all assembled and ready to go?

jackdc100 · November 29th, 2007, 09:33 PM

So I'm under the impression that you like the overtone better than the Ceriatone? What model D'lite do you own? The 22 or the 44? Did you build the D'lite yourself? Thanks,
-Jack

Joe K · November 30th, 2007, 07:06 AM

Jack, the Overtone is one of Ceriatone's models (currently on hold, i.e., not for sale).

candh · November 30th, 2007, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackdc100

So I'm under the impression that you like the overtone better than the Ceriatone? What model D'lite do you own? The 22 or the 44? Did you build the D'lite yourself? Thanks,
-Jack

Hi Jack,

I was in on the first batch of 22's. Although now I do have 6L6's in the amp instead of the 6V6's so esentially a 44 with an OT mismatch. Yes, I built it. It has to be one of the most enjoyable builds I've done to date.
The Overtone (Ceria) is a fabulous amp and I am very happy that I am one of the handful that got one before Nik halted production. On the other hand the D'lite is an equally superb amp and now that Moss (Brownnote) is offering variations like the 44, 88, HRM and Bluesmaster....wow,,very cool.

jackdc100 · November 30th, 2007, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe K

Jack, the Overtone is one of Ceriatone's models (currently on hold, i.e., not for sale).

I meant the Overtone and the Brown Note. Sorry.

fierce_carrot · December 2nd, 2007, 06:12 AM

Great Review! I've been looking forward to hearing about the Overtone Special and it appears it's another great offering from Nik.

Your quote:

"If a negative thing could be said about the amp is it has far too many great and useable tones and it's going to take much longer than a week to get aquainted with this "multitalented" amplifier"

can be applied to a small number of incredible amps that aren't "off the shelf, mass produced, cookie cutter" products. My Ceriatone Liverpool Trainwreck fits in that category as being incredibly versatile and can completely change tonal directions by just twisting one knob.

I think it's a fantastic thing that Nik, offers these "holy grailamps at costs that are well within reach of the working musician. We've heard what highly paid pros can do with them, I can't wait to hear what local "hot hands" can do!

candh · December 3rd, 2007, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fierce_carrot

Great Review! I've been looking forward to hearing about the Overtone Special and it appears it's another great offering from Nik.

Your quote:

"If a negative thing could be said about the amp is it has far too many great and useable tones and it's going to take much longer than a week to get aquainted with this "multitalented" amplifier"

can be applied to a small number of incredible amps that aren't "off the shelf, mass produced, cookie cutter" products. My Ceriatone Liverpool Trainwreck fits in that category as being incredibly versatile and can completely change tonal directions by just twisting one knob.

I think it's a fantastic thing that Nik, offers these "holy grailamps at costs that are well within reach of the working musician. We've heard what highly paid pros can do with them, I can't wait to hear what local "hot hands" can do!

Hey Fierce,

The Liverpull is going to be "one" of my next amps from Nik. Maybe, we've already talked...can't remember....lol. This Overtone is such a giant killer. In all honesty I'm not completely convinced the amp should sound as great as it does. It's a bit of a bizzare "mutt" of a dumble circuit and I think I am one of the few lucky owners of a true fluke.

The OD is every bit as good as my D'lite but the cleans....oh the cleans....brings a tear to my eye.

Mind you,,,this is after A LOT of speaker and tube swapping.

jackdc100 · December 3rd, 2007, 10:44 PM

Maybe if we send Nik a petition he'll start building the Overtones again.

fierce_carrot · December 4th, 2007, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jackdc100

Maybe if we send Nik a petition he'll start building the Overtones again.

It's a sad thing that a couple of overpriced boutique bedroom boutique builders on two other forums attacked him so viciously that he chose to stop building them. Personally, if they had done that to me...I would have cut the cost of the amp even more and gone after their market....

candh · December 4th, 2007, 08:24 AM

Well, it's possible Nik felt a little pressured but I don't think his choosing to discontinue was based on that. From my conversations with him I think he just realized that these amps take far too much time and effort to build and trying to fill Overtone orders was going to compromise the production of his other amps. I personally think he could make the amp a viable proposition if he ditched all the "stuff" that isn't necessary in the design. But then we are getting into the D'lite area and Nik said he doesn't want to step on Moss' toes.

martyhk · December 7th, 2007, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candh

Well, it's possible Nik felt a little pressured but I don't think his choosing to discontinue was based on that. From my conversations with him I think he just realized that these amps take far too much time and effort to build and trying to fill Overtone orders was going to compromise the production of his other amps. I personally think he could make the amp a viable proposition if he ditched all the "stuff" that isn't necessary in the design. But then we are getting into the D'lite area and Nik said he doesn't want to step on Moss' toes.

I probably know the answer to this already, but what is the "stuff" you think could have been left out of the amp?

candh · December 7th, 2007, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martyhk

I probably know the answer to this already, but what is the "stuff" you think could have been left out of the amp?

I'm sure you know, too. The FET input circuit, effects loop, ground switch, Jazz/rock and deep switches, phase inverter trim pot....for a start. Then you're left with umm......a D'Lite...lol.

martyhk · December 16th, 2007, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by candh

I'm sure you know, too. The FET input circuit, effects loop, ground switch, Jazz/rock and deep switches, phase inverter trim pot....for a start. Then you're left with umm......a D'Lite...lol.

yep, thats what I thought. I tend to agree. I'll let you know when I get mine if I still agree. Btw, any new thoughts on your overtone now that you've had it for awhile?

candh · December 24th, 2007, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martyhk

yep, thats what I thought. I tend to agree. I'll let you know when I get mine if I still agree. Btw, any new thoughts on your overtone now that you've had it for awhile?

Yep, the Overtone honeymoon is over....just got back from Hawaii....lol. I'm spent.....literally. I came back with a 73 Super Reverb chassis from Dan's guitars.

I love the clean on the overtone but the drive channel needs a little tweaking to get the RF tones I've been obsessing over.

November 26th, 2007, 11:26 PM	#1 (permalink)
candh Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ito city, Japan Posts: 150	Ceriatone Overtone first impressions I posted this on the Ceriatoneforum but I know there were a few interested in the amp here. There is nothing technical just some comments. This is all IMHO of course. I have had the Overtone for more than a week now and have been playing it and A/B'ing with the D'Lite. I only had one chance to get it up to gig volumes at a jam the other night so most of my observations are of the amp at less than perfect (lower volume) conditions. That said,, Let me first dispell the sentiment that there might be something wrong with the amp. (People were grumbling waiting for a review) Trust me there is NOTHING wrong with the Overtone. If a negative thing could be said about the amp is it has far too many great and useable tones and it's going to take much longer than a week to get aquainted with this "multitalented" amplifier. Let's begin with the cleans.... Like the D'lite you have two distinct flavors of clean at your disposal. With the clean volume down and the master up there is a lot of beautiful sparkle and jingle like any good blackface and the bright switch in conjunction with the tone stack can get you all kinds of variability on that theme. If you crank up the clean channel volume (about 2'oclock) and keep the master low the cleans warm up (like all similar amps) but the range of clean from dark to sparkle can be finely adjusted with the tone tack, bright switch and the deep switch, which itself adds a very attractive scooped tone where the amp is warm yet sparkly on the top end. Engage the PAB and your mids come alive for a lot of cut in a big band setting. I don't know why but the treble pot in the tone stack remains somewhat interactive with the PAB engaged. It made me think of the 5E3 tone/volume interaction and actually makes for a nice jazz tone....lol. Between all of the switching options and interactivity there are seemingly limitless permutations on the tones you get in the clean channel alone. If I were to make a generalization on comparing the cleans of the Overtone to the D'Lite it would be that the Overtone is bigger and bolder. The mid focus is very present but there is also the ability to dial in more highs and significantly more lows if desired. The OD channel..... The jury is still out on this one. Not because of anything bad but for the most part I haven't had all that much time to dig into it. In it's stock form the amp is tailored for humbuckers ( like all of these D flavoured circuits) and the wide range of the aforementioned functional clean tones goes for the OD channel as well. On similar settings as the D'Lite the Overtone sounds very um ....similar...I mean VERY close. However, I think it's just my style of playing but I just can't seem to get that "chewy" ScottL tone thing happening (on either amp). The Overtone has quite a bit more punch than the DL so it can do the Marshall grind very nicely. Again, I have to get into the amp more before I can really say any more. The FET input??.......haven't even tried it yet....so no comment. Build quality...... I've put together quite a few amps and I know I couldn't do any better than this. I don't think there are any components that I would substitute on the basis of poor quality. Maybe a few Kiwame resistors....lol (I'm on a Kiwame kick these days). I don't know if it's just me but there seem to be a few too many Vishay Dales in here.? I always like to see a dash of CC's for flavour....well, maybe not in this amp. The chassis is well made and is plenty strong enough to support the rather hefty transformers. I like the fact there are eight bolts to help distribute the hanging weight on your cab. One should consider bracing if you are going to be rough on the cab. Last but not least...... If you can, try as many different tubes as a possible. These amps get the majority of their tone from the preamp. I've settled on Mullards and Syls for pre's and Winged C's for the power section. Speakers, too. I am using an Eminence RW&B but as soon as I find one I'm going to try a G12-65 as that is the standard by which all D style amps are played through these days. All in all, the amp is a tweakers seventh heaven but as stock it can hold it's own to any of the goliaths out there. And finally...lol At the recent jam there were several BF Fender's, a signature Two Rock, a Maz 18, a brown Vibroverb RI and my D'Lite and the Overtone (just the chassis). The Two Rock and the Overtone were the stars of the party and not to elaborate but .....I don't see any need to be buying a $10,000 Two Rock anytime soon... Cheers, Chris

November 27th, 2007, 02:45 AM	#4 (permalink)
SMPTE Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Minneeeesoooottta Posts: 1,038	Very very cool, I'm assuming yours came all assembled and ready to go? __________________ Hwy. 1 Texas Telecaster, EJ Stratocaster, MIJ Jazzmaster, Epi Casino Bigsby & Staples, Gibson '61 RI SG, Steinberger Spirit Squier Precision Bass, EMGs & USA Jazz neck

November 29th, 2007, 09:33 PM	#5 (permalink)
jackdc100 Tele-Meister Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 223	Overtone Better? So I'm under the impression that you like the overtone better than the Ceriatone? What model D'lite do you own? The 22 or the 44? Did you build the D'lite yourself? Thanks, -Jack

November 26th, 2007, 11:41 PM	#2 (permalink)
teletard Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2007 Location: hollywood california Age: 34 Posts: 244 11 Photos	this is the dumble clone? how many watts. how did the cleans lie in the mix with the blackface fenders. so is it more for balls out distortion or the semi distorted tone. does it clean up really sweet with the guitar volume knob

November 27th, 2007, 01:03 AM	#3 (permalink)
candh Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ito city, Japan Posts: 150	Yes, it is the Dumble inspired circuit. It was a bloody loud jam with a heavy handed drummer. We were playing a lot of different styles, country, blues, jazzy bits etc.....The Fenders were loud enough but fatiguing. The only Fender I heard clean was the Vibroverb 2x10 RI but I think it was a little "sick" as it just didn't have any wow to my ears. The Two Rock and Overtone were more than loud and powerful enough to sit in the mix perfectly and never obnoxious. The D'lite lacks a little of the lower mids of the bigger boys but a few guys were VERY impressed with it. These amps have plenty of gain available but clean up really well and the OD channel with the volume rolled off a touch on a Les Paul is a beautiful thing. It's a two 6L6 amp and has lots of poop so I would say 35+ watts...I don't know.

November 30th, 2007, 07:06 AM	#6 (permalink)
Joe K Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bethesda, Maryland Posts: 565 6 Photos	Jack, the Overtone is one of Ceriatone's models (currently on hold, i.e., not for sale).

December 2nd, 2007, 06:12 AM	#9 (permalink)
fierce_carrot Tele-Holic Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Iowa Age: 52 Posts: 964	Great Review! I've been looking forward to hearing about the Overtone Special and it appears it's another great offering from Nik. Your quote: "If a negative thing could be said about the amp is it has far too many great and useable tones and it's going to take much longer than a week to get aquainted with this "multitalented" amplifier" can be applied to a small number of incredible amps that aren't "off the shelf, mass produced, cookie cutter" products. My Ceriatone Liverpool Trainwreck fits in that category as being incredibly versatile and can completely change tonal directions by just twisting one knob. I think it's a fantastic thing that Nik, offers these "holy grailamps at costs that are well within reach of the working musician. We've heard what highly paid pros can do with them, I can't wait to hear what local "hot hands" can do!

December 3rd, 2007, 10:44 PM	#11 (permalink)
jackdc100 Tele-Meister Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 223	Maybe if we send Nik a petition he'll start building the Overtones again.

December 4th, 2007, 08:24 AM	#13 (permalink)
candh Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ito city, Japan Posts: 150	Well, it's possible Nik felt a little pressured but I don't think his choosing to discontinue was based on that. From my conversations with him I think he just realized that these amps take far too much time and effort to build and trying to fill Overtone orders was going to compromise the production of his other amps. I personally think he could make the amp a viable proposition if he ditched all the "stuff" that isn't necessary in the design. But then we are getting into the D'lite area and Nik said he doesn't want to step on Moss' toes.