Hot Rod Deluxe = Can of Worms?

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 09:13 AM

I am new around here, so I apologize in advance if I'm re-treading ground with this topic, which surely I must be, but I was just curious...

I was in the tele forum talking with Webmaster and this was stated:

I said, about my new tele that I'm paying off : "I played it through a Blues Jr and a Hot Rod Deluxe and really fell in love with the Deluxe. It sounded like steamed butter with the Highway One."

To which Webmaster replied:
"You've just opened another can o' worms with the HRD. I recommend that you spend some time asking questions in the Amp Central Station forum. HRDs bring out some passionate opinions."

What is the can of worms that surrounds the HRDX and why are people so passionate about it?

I played it and it sounded really, really good to my ears. Are there really people that hate it? Even at $600 for an all tube 40 watter?

Just looking for some opinions on a probable future purchase.

Brennantele · July 6th, 2007, 10:20 AM

There are a lot of threads on the HRDx. It's kind of a love/hate thing around here. I have one and it sounds great. I would say that if you liked it, it doesn't matter what anyone on here says. You'll be spending your money on it. BTW make sure you look for a used one before you spend $600. I gave less than $500 for mine and it's perfect.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brennantele

There are a lot of threads on the HRDx. It's kind of a love/hate thing around here. I have one and it sounds great. I would say that if you liked it, it doesn't matter what anyone on here says. You'll be spending your money on it. BTW make sure you look for a used one before you spend $600. I gave less than $500 for mine and it's perfect.

Thanks for the tips. I did enjoy the one that I played, but you can never tell how the same amp will sound at home. Those guitar stores have a way of making things sound different than they do at home, lol.

I will hunt for a used one before shelling out full price.

Wally · July 6th, 2007, 11:34 AM

highwayone3tone wrote: "I played it and it sounded really, really good to my ears. Are there really people that hate it? Even at $600 for an all tube 40 watter?"

Highway, there are some of the worms....it is not an all-tube amp. The reverb is not tube driven or recovered. One can hear it...it is cold and harsh compared to the typically warm and wet Fender tube reverb. When you go into overdrive, you will be processing the distortion through chips and/or diodes. Many of us prefer tube distortion. Playing the amp straight with no reverb and no overdrive, you will be processing in the tube domain only, and when working properly I don't have much problem with that sound of the amp. There are other issues that some have problems with....others don't.
That said, if you like it, go for it. Just know what it is, and that is not all tube. In order to do what it does in the tube domain, there would be five
12A_7 type tubes instead of 3.

StuH · July 6th, 2007, 11:51 AM

I'm curious about this little amp too. Does it at least have a tube driven pre like the Marshall AVT amps do?

Don't laugh but I rather like the sound of the AVT series but I guess you don't really realize how much better something else sounds untill you own it and hear for yourself.

EDIT) sorry I should read the replies more carefully ( 3 tubes instead of 5 got it)

Wally · July 6th, 2007, 12:19 PM

Stu, those 3 tubes are preamp and driver tubes. The amp also has 2 6L6 power tubes.. It is more tube than not...just not all tube.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

highwayone3tone wrote: "I played it and it sounded really, really good to my ears. Are there really people that hate it? Even at $600 for an all tube 40 watter?"

Highway, there are some of the worms....it is not an all-tube amp. The reverb is not tube driven or recovered. One can hear it...it is cold and harsh compared to the typically warm and wet Fender tube reverb. When you go into overdrive, you will be processing the distortion through chips and/or diodes. Many of us prefer tube distortion. Playing the amp straight with no reverb and no overdrive, you will be processing in the tube domain only, and when working properly I don't have much problem with that sound of the amp. There are other issues that some have problems with....others don't.
That said, if you like it, go for it. Just know what it is, and that is not all tube. In order to do what it does in the tube domain, there would be five
12A_7 type tubes instead of 3.

Thanks for the explanation! I would not have known that it was not 'all tube' if you hadn't explained that.

Is there a comparable 'all tube' amp in that same price range from a different company?

I saw a Peavey at the shop today that had a ton of tubes in the back of it for around 650 or so, but it looked smaller than the Fender size-wise.

I'm just looking for some 'tube tone' at a reasonable price. I played around with the Blues Junior and I liked it, but it didn't have the oomph that I was looking for. Maybe that's due to the 15 watts?

Or maybe I didn't crank it up enough (I didn't want to bother all the other shoppers).

Also, I learned a valuable lesson about tube amps: Don't unplug your guitar until they are turned off!

I come from the school of the solid state. All I've ever done to unplug my guitar is turn down the volume. Another player came along as I was finishing up and I decided to be 'polite' and offer him the amp, he accepted so I turned down the volume and master on the Deluxe and unplugged my tele.... out comes the most horrible sound I've ever heard. Next thing I know an associate is rushing over and telling me to turn the amp off.

I had no idea. I was so embarrassed.

Wally · July 6th, 2007, 12:35 PM

Highway, you should be safe unplugging the cord from the amp rather than from the guitar. FWIW, one is more likely to do damage to a SS amp than to a tube amp by unplugging from the guitar....somehow it puts the amp at risk for taking out a transformer. I certainly agre that one should avoiding causing that POP however necessary. It is hard on hte speaker and could take out a tranny. I have never experienced a problem with turning the amp's volumes down and then unplugging the guitar. Perhaps you overlooked a control somehow.
Good luck on your search for an amp. The HR series and the Blues Deluxe/DeVille cousins have tweed type preamp structure...lot of gain. The only all-tube Fender amp in that price range that you might find with that kind of preamp structure would be a used Bassman RI, and it has no reverb.
The BF Reissues have a different kind of preamp structure, but are all-tube amps...without OD functions. A used Deluxe Reverb RI or Super REverb RI might do it for you with a good pedal to hit the preamp with. Also, as I said, if the HRD does a sound that you like, don't be scared away. A lot of people use them and do well with them. The straight ahead sounds are hot tweed-like sonics.
Other than that, just use your ears and try a lot of amps out. Count preamp tubes. LIsten to the RI reverb sounds, remember them and compare to other amps you try. You will come to be able to hear SS reverb vs. tube reverb.
Mesa Boogie, Rivera and a few other companies build switching overdrive amps that process all functions in the tube domain. They will switch with chips but process with tubes. Youcould get lucky and find something used in that vein.
And...we haven't asked what kind of music and guitars you play. It may be that you don't want or need reverb and/or overdrive.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

Highway, you should be safe unplugging the cord from the amp rather than from the guitar. FWIW, one is more likely to do damage to a SS amp than to a tube amp by unplugging from the guitar....somehow it puts the amp at risk for taking out a transformer. I certainly agre that one should avoiding causing that POP however necessary. It is hard on hte speaker and could take out a tranny. I have never experienced a problem with turning the amp's volumes down and then unplugging the guitar. Perhaps you overlooked a control somehow.
Good luck on your search for an amp. The HR series and the Blues Deluxe/DeVille cousins have tweed type preamp structure...lot of gain. The only all-tube Fender amp in that price range that you might find with that kind of preamp structure would be a used Bassman RI, and it has no reverb.
The BF Reissues have a different kind of preamp structure, but are all-tube amps...without OD functions. A used Deluxe Reverb RI or Super REverb RI might do it for you with a good pedal to hit the preamp with. Also, as I said, if the HRD does a sound that you like, don't be scared away. A lot of people use them and do well with them. The straight ahead sounds are hot tweed-like sonics.
Other than that, just use your ears and try a lot of amps out. Count preamp tubes. LIsten to the RI reverb sounds, remember them and compare to other amps you try. You will come to be able to hear SS reverb vs. tube reverb.
Mesa Boogie, Rivera and a few other companies build switching overdrive amps that process all functions in the tube domain. They will switch with chips but process with tubes. Youcould get lucky and find something used in that vein.
And...we haven't asked what kind of music and guitars you play. It may be that you don't want or need reverb and/or overdrive.

I play a lot of different styles, so normally I need an amp that can pull off multiple styles well. I need something that can be diverse (which is why I love my AD30VT, I just wish it was 'all-tube' now that I've heard how tubes sound..)...

I write low-key 'indie-rock' type of songs, I also write full on rock-distortion songs, as well as hip hop songs.

I do need a good distortion, and I've loved the 'tube breakup' sound that the tube amps have when pushed. I don't need anything beyond that as far as higher gain distortion goes as I've got a Muff if I need any more roar or fuzz.

I'm mainly looking for something that is tube tone, affordable, and loud enough to jam with in a band (not necessarily loud enough to fill a club, as I could always mic it). I just want enough volume not to get 'lost in the mix'.

EDIT- Oh, and I turned down the master, but didn't turn down the volume (thinking that the master would kill all the signal to the speaker). I also had the reverb at about 3. A mistake I won't make twice. I'm turning off -all- Amps before I do anything at all with unplugging or plugging. lol

johnreardon · July 6th, 2007, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highwayone3tone

I play a lot of different styles, so normally I need an amp that can pull off multiple styles well. I need something that can be diverse (which is why I love my AD30VT, I just wish it was 'all-tube' now that I've heard how tubes sound..)...

I write low-key 'indie-rock' type of songs, I also write full on rock-distortion songs, as well as hip hop songs.

I do need a good distortion, and I've loved the 'tube breakup' sound that the tube amps have when pushed. I don't need anything beyond that as far as higher gain distortion goes as I've got a Muff if I need any more roar or fuzz.

I'm mainly looking for something that is tube tone, affordable, and loud enough to jam with in a band (not necessarily loud enough to fill a club, as I could always mic it). I just want enough volume not to get 'lost in the mix'.

lol

I would forget this business about whether it's all valve or not and trust your own ears. I often play a friends HRD at jam sessions. Nothing wrong with distortion at all. And it's loud. I get great sounds with my Fenders and humbucker guitars.

I prefer my Mesa, but the HRD, for me, is a good second best.

Wally · July 6th, 2007, 01:01 PM

Keep stashing money back and checking out everything you can. Don't hurry. Find an amp that does what you want and need. IF you find a chance to play a Rivera, check it out. They are very versatile..from surf to grunge. A good used R55 used is just barely above your current budget. The Rivera-designed Fender switching amps from '83-'85 can be great amps with great versatility...Super Champs, Princeton REv II, Concert II, Deluxe Reverb II. The SC's may be a stretch on you present budget, but you are close to all of those amps. The speakers are the weakest part of them. Be patient, look, listen and learn.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnreardon

I would forget this business about whether it's all valve or not and trust your own ears. I often play a friends HRD at jam sessions. Nothing wrong with distortion at all. And it's loud. I get great sounds with my Fenders and humbucker guitars.

I prefer my Mesa, but the HRD, for me, is a good second best.

That's true, I should trust my ears..

I was looking around and it looks like the Peavey Classic 30 can be had for about 450 depending on where you look... And it seems pretty comparable to the HRD.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

Keep stashing money back and checking out everything you can. Don't hurry. Find an amp that does what you want and need. IF you find a chance to play a Rivera, check it out. They are very versatile..from surf to grunge. A good used R55 used is just barely above your current budget. The Rivera-designed Fender switching amps from '83-'85 can be great amps with great versatility...Super Champs, Princeton REv II, Concert II, Deluxe Reverb II. The SC's may be a stretch on you present budget, but you are close to all of those amps. The speakers are the weakest part of them. Be patient, look, listen and learn.

Thanks for all the advice Wally. What I'm learning, and quickly, is that patience is a virtue when it comes to all musical equipment.

(except for my Highway One tele, which I found and fell in love with and started paying on all in the span of one day.. I guess that sometimes when you know, you just -know-, hopefully whatever amp I get next will feel the same way to me that the guitar did).

I'll keep my eye out for a Rivera (never seen one in these parts, but then if I wasn't looking for that in particular then who knows what I missed).

Wally · July 6th, 2007, 01:12 PM

See, Highway, that's the can of worms. You have your ears. You have to use them to make your decisions. My personal perceptions and choices are made with my ears. I hear things about certain amps that don't please me. I don't have to listen to them if I don't choose to. OThers hear something different and can make their choices.
I have heard all-tube amps with screwed up bias that sounded worse than some of the better SS amps. The difference being that the bias point can be changed in that tube amp, and that SS amp is only what it is. If it suits a person, good for them. Use your ears, choose your gear...make your music.
Those who listen to it will make their choices based on what they hear. Thusly, the world goes around....

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

See, Highway, that's the can of worms. You have your ears. You have to use them to make your decisions. My personal perceptions and choices are made with my ears. I hear things about certain amps that don't please me. I don't have to listen to them if I don't choose to. OThers hear something different and can make their choices.
I have heard all-tube amps with screwed up bias that sounded worse than some of the better SS amps. The difference being that the bias point can be changed in that tube amp, and that SS amp is only what it is. If it suits a person, good for them. Use your ears, choose your gear...make your music.
Those who listen to it will make their choices based on what they hear. Thusly, the world goes around....

haha "the circle of life". I do appreciate you taking the time to respond and help me out. Your efforts haven't been wasted.

I think the store I went to does have a Peavey Classic 30, so I'll probably try that out there and see what my ears tell me. Beyond that their selection is pretty limited, amp-wise. I might have to make a trip down to Guitar Center in West Palm Beach. It's always a zoo, but at least my ears could get some varied sounds to compare.

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 01:27 PM

Hey Wally, or anyone else for that matter, know anything about the Pignose G40V? 40 watts all tube (supposedly) for just over 300 bucks.. Yeah it's only got a ten inch speaker, but it has outputs for extension cabs.. Are Pignose Amps rubbish?

cg73cmc · July 6th, 2007, 01:30 PM

Or ... you could ...

Approach this in a scientific manner. Don't be bothered by the preconceived ideas of others who might tell you that "all these kinda amps sound bad" and "all these kinda amps sound good".

The bottom line is ... YOUR ears are just as good as anyone's elses. If your ears tell you the sound is good - who here can really argue with you?

So I would try a variety of amps. Make it a "quest" and be objective about it. The sound that is produced ... the sound you hear ... is the only important thing that there is. What is between your fingers and your ears is all about producing that sound. Doesn't matter if it's got tubes, or transistors, or op amps, or black and purple tolex. It's the sound that counts.

The reason it's a "can-o-worms" - is that no one can be proven correct on the argument of what produces "good" sound. I've watched this thing spin around for years and no one's ever won it. And the reason is ... you can't prove what good sound is any more than you can prove the existence of a supreme being. Sound is subjective. Hell, Eddie Van Halen hated Ted Nugent's tone. Funny - I've always hated EVH's tone and loved Ted's!

But the good news is ... you don't have prove anything here - your ears will tell you everything you need to know. Just don't let anyone else's "ears" influence you in your decision. Trust your own pair. :)

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cg73cmc

Or ... you could ...

Approach this in a scientific manner. Don't be bothered by the preconceived ideas of others who might tell you that "all these kinda amps sound bad" and "all these kinda amps sound good".

The bottom line is ... YOUR ears are just as good as anyone's elses. If your ears tell you the sound is good - who here can really argue with you?

So I would try a variety of amps. Make it a "quest" and be objective about it. The sound that is produced ... the sound you hear ... is the only important thing that there is. What is between your fingers and your ears is all about producing that sound. Doesn't matter if it's got tubes, or transistors, or op amps, or black and purple tolex. It's the sound that counts.

The reason it's a "can-o-worms" - is that no one can be proven correct on the argument of what produces "good" sound. I've watched this thing spin around for years and no one's ever won it. And the reason is ... you can't prove what good sound is any more than you can prove the existence of a supreme being. Sound is subjective. Hell, Eddie Van Halen hated Ted Nugent's tone. Funny - I've always hated EVH's tone and loved Ted's!

But the good news is ... you don't have prove anything here - your ears will tell you everything you need to know. Just don't let anyone else's "ears" influence you in your decision. Trust your own pair. :)

That's the advice I'm listening to the most, but I also like to know which things are ones that I should add to my checklist of possibilities. :)

I've read some mixed things on the Pignose, but I'll let my ears do the talking. That's a lot of amp for not a lot of money (even if I do need to swap out the speaker and tubes, as I've read over and over about that amp).

eryque · July 6th, 2007, 02:36 PM

You're getting lots of good advice here. If you search the forums you'll find some good & informative threads as well as some heated debates that bordered on flame wars. If you search on HRD or Hot Rod and put my username in the author field you'll find some pretty good threads (not tooting my own horn, I just tend to pipe up about the HRD whenever someone asks about them :) )

highwayone3tone · July 6th, 2007, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eryque

You're getting lots of good advice here. If you search the forums you'll find some good & informative threads as well as some heated debates that bordered on flame wars. If you search on HRD or Hot Rod and put my username in the author field you'll find some pretty good threads (not tooting my own horn, I just tend to pipe up about the HRD whenever someone asks about them :) )

Thanks for the leads, I will look into it when I get a chance (my work day is almost over, I slacked like hell today).

So far I'm aiming to try out the Peavey Classic 30, the Pignose G40V, and all the fender tube amps that I can find. (along with any Laney, Traynor, Mesa Boogie or Riveras that I can find used). My eyes and ears are now open, and my search begins. I'm sure the end is a long way off, but at least I have some great info to go on.

Thanks everybody.

Ptrallan01 · July 6th, 2007, 04:37 PM

is a decent starter tube amp. Remember the price is LOW!!!! So don't expect Deluxe Reverb or Mesa or Allan quality and sound. It isn't all tube as it has a ss rectifier I believe. The original tubes are not so great and the transformers sometimes go off the deepend but the sound once it is retubed is pretty good for a $300 amp. They must be getting a following because 2 years ago you could buy them new for $200 and sometimes $180.

Reliability with them is there biggest drawback. I bought one used it lasted 3+ years and I enjoyed it although it would hum sometimes and it always sounded better standing upside down

. It sounded best on rainy days too

Strange amp that died recently and I am undecided about getting it fixed.

Check out threads by Praisecaster for details about mods that he swears by to his little piggy.

July 6th, 2007, 09:13 AM	#1 (permalink)
highwayone3tone Tele-Meister Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Stuart FL Age: 28 Posts: 227 7 Photos	Hot Rod Deluxe = Can of Worms? I am new around here, so I apologize in advance if I'm re-treading ground with this topic, which surely I must be, but I was just curious... I was in the tele forum talking with Webmaster and this was stated: I said, about my new tele that I'm paying off : "I played it through a Blues Jr and a Hot Rod Deluxe and really fell in love with the Deluxe. It sounded like steamed butter with the Highway One." To which Webmaster replied: "You've just opened another can o' worms with the HRD. I recommend that you spend some time asking questions in the Amp Central Station forum. HRDs bring out some passionate opinions." What is the can of worms that surrounds the HRDX and why are people so passionate about it? I played it and it sounded really, really good to my ears. Are there really people that hate it? Even at $600 for an all tube 40 watter? Just looking for some opinions on a probable future purchase.

July 6th, 2007, 10:20 AM	#2 (permalink)
Brennantele Tele-Meister Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Tuscaloosa, AL Age: 24 Posts: 331	There are a lot of threads on the HRDx. It's kind of a love/hate thing around here. I have one and it sounds great. I would say that if you liked it, it doesn't matter what anyone on here says. You'll be spending your money on it. BTW make sure you look for a used one before you spend $600. I gave less than $500 for mine and it's perfect. __________________ www.myspace.com/brennanbatey

July 6th, 2007, 01:30 PM	#17 (permalink)
cg73cmc Tele-Holic Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 693	Or ... you could ... Approach this in a scientific manner. Don't be bothered by the preconceived ideas of others who might tell you that "all these kinda amps sound bad" and "all these kinda amps sound good". The bottom line is ... YOUR ears are just as good as anyone's elses. If your ears tell you the sound is good - who here can really argue with you? So I would try a variety of amps. Make it a "quest" and be objective about it. The sound that is produced ... the sound you hear ... is the only important thing that there is. What is between your fingers and your ears is all about producing that sound. Doesn't matter if it's got tubes, or transistors, or op amps, or black and purple tolex. It's the sound that counts. The reason it's a "can-o-worms" - is that no one can be proven correct on the argument of what produces "good" sound. I've watched this thing spin around for years and no one's ever won it. And the reason is ... you can't prove what good sound is any more than you can prove the existence of a supreme being. Sound is subjective. Hell, Eddie Van Halen hated Ted Nugent's tone. Funny - I've always hated EVH's tone and loved Ted's! But the good news is ... you don't have prove anything here - your ears will tell you everything you need to know. Just don't let anyone else's "ears" influence you in your decision. Trust your own pair. :) __________________ Take Care! Mark "If I'd known I was going to be a big guitar hero -- I would have practiced more" -- Ace Frehley

July 6th, 2007, 02:36 PM	#19 (permalink)
eryque Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: albany, ny [not chicago] Posts: 6,977 44 Photos	You're getting lots of good advice here. If you search the forums you'll find some good & informative threads as well as some heated debates that bordered on flame wars. If you search on HRD or Hot Rod and put my username in the author field you'll find some pretty good threads (not tooting my own horn, I just tend to pipe up about the HRD whenever someone asks about them :) ) __________________ my blog: eryque.blogspot.com Updated 9.17.08! Subscribe_____________________

July 6th, 2007, 04:37 PM	#21 (permalink)
Ptrallan01 Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 549 3 Photos	Pignose G40V is a decent starter tube amp. Remember the price is LOW!!!! So don't expect Deluxe Reverb or Mesa or Allan quality and sound. It isn't all tube as it has a ss rectifier I believe. The original tubes are not so great and the transformers sometimes go off the deepend but the sound once it is retubed is pretty good for a $300 amp. They must be getting a following because 2 years ago you could buy them new for $200 and sometimes $180. Reliability with them is there biggest drawback. I bought one used it lasted 3+ years and I enjoyed it although it would hum sometimes and it always sounded better standing upside down . It sounded best on rainy days too Strange amp that died recently and I am undecided about getting it fixed. Check out threads by Praisecaster for details about mods that he swears by to his little piggy. __________________ Ooh, I want my guitar to sound like Jimmie Smith's organ!!!

July 6th, 2007, 11:34 AM	#4 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,769	highwayone3tone wrote: "I played it and it sounded really, really good to my ears. Are there really people that hate it? Even at $600 for an all tube 40 watter?" Highway, there are some of the worms....it is not an all-tube amp. The reverb is not tube driven or recovered. One can hear it...it is cold and harsh compared to the typically warm and wet Fender tube reverb. When you go into overdrive, you will be processing the distortion through chips and/or diodes. Many of us prefer tube distortion. Playing the amp straight with no reverb and no overdrive, you will be processing in the tube domain only, and when working properly I don't have much problem with that sound of the amp. There are other issues that some have problems with....others don't. That said, if you like it, go for it. Just know what it is, and that is not all tube. In order to do what it does in the tube domain, there would be five 12A_7 type tubes instead of 3.

July 6th, 2007, 11:51 AM	#5 (permalink)
StuH Tele-Afflicted Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yukon, Canada Age: 38 Posts: 1,465 12 Photos	I'm curious about this little amp too. Does it at least have a tube driven pre like the Marshall AVT amps do? Don't laugh but I rather like the sound of the AVT series but I guess you don't really realize how much better something else sounds untill you own it and hear for yourself. EDIT) sorry I should read the replies more carefully ( 3 tubes instead of 5 got it)

July 6th, 2007, 12:19 PM	#6 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,769	Stu, those 3 tubes are preamp and driver tubes. The amp also has 2 6L6 power tubes.. It is more tube than not...just not all tube.

July 6th, 2007, 12:35 PM	#8 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,769	Highway, you should be safe unplugging the cord from the amp rather than from the guitar. FWIW, one is more likely to do damage to a SS amp than to a tube amp by unplugging from the guitar....somehow it puts the amp at risk for taking out a transformer. I certainly agre that one should avoiding causing that POP however necessary. It is hard on hte speaker and could take out a tranny. I have never experienced a problem with turning the amp's volumes down and then unplugging the guitar. Perhaps you overlooked a control somehow. Good luck on your search for an amp. The HR series and the Blues Deluxe/DeVille cousins have tweed type preamp structure...lot of gain. The only all-tube Fender amp in that price range that you might find with that kind of preamp structure would be a used Bassman RI, and it has no reverb. The BF Reissues have a different kind of preamp structure, but are all-tube amps...without OD functions. A used Deluxe Reverb RI or Super REverb RI might do it for you with a good pedal to hit the preamp with. Also, as I said, if the HRD does a sound that you like, don't be scared away. A lot of people use them and do well with them. The straight ahead sounds are hot tweed-like sonics. Other than that, just use your ears and try a lot of amps out. Count preamp tubes. LIsten to the RI reverb sounds, remember them and compare to other amps you try. You will come to be able to hear SS reverb vs. tube reverb. Mesa Boogie, Rivera and a few other companies build switching overdrive amps that process all functions in the tube domain. They will switch with chips but process with tubes. Youcould get lucky and find something used in that vein. And...we haven't asked what kind of music and guitars you play. It may be that you don't want or need reverb and/or overdrive.

July 6th, 2007, 01:01 PM	#11 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,769	Keep stashing money back and checking out everything you can. Don't hurry. Find an amp that does what you want and need. IF you find a chance to play a Rivera, check it out. They are very versatile..from surf to grunge. A good used R55 used is just barely above your current budget. The Rivera-designed Fender switching amps from '83-'85 can be great amps with great versatility...Super Champs, Princeton REv II, Concert II, Deluxe Reverb II. The SC's may be a stretch on you present budget, but you are close to all of those amps. The speakers are the weakest part of them. Be patient, look, listen and learn.

July 6th, 2007, 01:12 PM	#14 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,769	See, Highway, that's the can of worms. You have your ears. You have to use them to make your decisions. My personal perceptions and choices are made with my ears. I hear things about certain amps that don't please me. I don't have to listen to them if I don't choose to. OThers hear something different and can make their choices. I have heard all-tube amps with screwed up bias that sounded worse than some of the better SS amps. The difference being that the bias point can be changed in that tube amp, and that SS amp is only what it is. If it suits a person, good for them. Use your ears, choose your gear...make your music. Those who listen to it will make their choices based on what they hear. Thusly, the world goes around....

July 6th, 2007, 01:27 PM	#16 (permalink)
highwayone3tone Tele-Meister Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Stuart FL Age: 28 Posts: 227 7 Photos	Hey Wally, or anyone else for that matter, know anything about the Pignose G40V? 40 watts all tube (supposedly) for just over 300 bucks.. Yeah it's only got a ten inch speaker, but it has outputs for extension cabs.. Are Pignose Amps rubbish?