What do you use to Mic your amp?

[Dacious]

Try aiming the mic straight on just inside the rim of a speaker. I've also seen people point them at the blank spot in between speakers. I've seen a sound recordist aim the mic at an angle to the speaker about parallel to the cone a few inches away. It certainly worked as far as captured results.

The suggestion of hanging it down the front is not as silly as it might seem - the 57 has a fairly restricted straight-on pattern and this helps it not be overdriven by sheer input.

You don't want your PA channel distorting and you shouldn't need as much gain and little volume on the slider to match your vox and acoustic instruments.

Other things you can do is engage the lo-cut filter on the channel (bass is not a problem especially with your SR), drop the bass slightly and accentuate the highs a little. You are probably using reverb on your amp as well as perhaps some FX - if so don't use any on the PA. Reverb on top of reverb usually sounds like ass.

[Poppatwang]

Originally Posted by sax4blues

For live playing I use the Sennheiser e609. The sound is good but the major feature for me is that I just hang it over my amp, no stand. One less item to carry, then setup & adjust, then knock over, then readjust, etc.

Ditto that! It'll hang flat against the grill. It's a rehash of an old design, but
I'm surprised it hasn't been in favor all along.

[Chris Callahan]

SM 57 and a condenser mic.

[scooteraz]

Well, I have used an Oktave Mk-219 for some years. It is a large condenser mike, and has been fine. Use it just like one would the Sennheiser 609 or 906 (hang by mike cord over amp or speaker box). I looked up the current version, and they claim a max spl of 122, but the spec sheet included with mine went to something like 137, so I thought I would be OK close miking on small combos.

I got it for something like $80 at a local GC on a blow-out sale; thought I would try something different, and have been pretty happy with it. If I were looking for a new mike, think I would either use the Sennheiser 609 or the 57. 609 would probably get the nod, because of easier deployment. The 906 would be great, but seems kinda spendy to me vs. the 609.

[rythmpyg]

609

[backalleyblues]

Since it's a Super Reverb we're talking about here, you've got it halfway home... now the hard part...

Listen to each speaker, and figure out which one is the best-sounding speaker... then work the mic angles on THAT speaker, and only that speaker.

Something I remember an engineer telling me one time in the studio-turn the amp up full so you can hear the hiss through the mic. Play with the positioning until the hiss sounds its fullest (no thin-sounding hiss). THAT will be your ideal mic position...

Franc Robert
Back Alley Blues Band

[woodman]

Originally Posted by Joe-Bob

Sennheiser e609

that's me too. convenience and quality, tailored to the electric guitar sound, and quite affordable.

[CancerLeoCam]

I use a SM57 piped into a preamp and it sounds good to me.

[Daddy Elmis]

I'm using Sennheiser e609's on all amps, after using `57's for years.

I'm trying to figure out what benefit a condenser mic on a guitar cab would have--except in the case of lower volume, hyper-clean jazz amping. I know Paisley seems to love the Shure KSM27 on some of his Dr. Z's, but I don't quite get needing the subtlety of a large diaphragm condenser on a cranked amp in a live situation.

[Buddaman]

A++ on the Sennheisers

57s are fine, but PLEASE do not hang it and point it at the floor! SM 57s are cardioid mics with a high degree of off-axis rejection. It's actually designed NOT to pick up sounds that come from the sides, so the tones you get by orienting the capsule 90 degrees off-axis to the speaker when you just hang it in front of the speaker are going to be thin and phasey sounding. Obviously, that is a technique that can be used effectively in the studio to get funky, frequency-specific tonalities, but live it just sounds like two cats fighting in a gunny sack IMHO!

I usually aim at a point about half the distance between the center cone and the outer rim of the speaker. Hit a chord and pan the mic (physically) back and forth a couple of times until it sounds the sweetest. All guitars and amps are different, but one of my biggest pet peeves is hearing a great sounding amp poorly mic'ed through a PA. That completely negates the whole idea of spending $$$ on great gear! The only thing that matters is the end result: the tone the audience hears. Just my two cents.

Buddaman

[HC]

I use my soundmans AKG (expensive, can't remember the model) condenser mic live and a StudioProjects B1 condenser in my home studio.

I think condensers sound really good, my guitar is coming through the PA much better than when I used SM57's.

[Tele The Truth]

If you're using a sound guy, most likely he ain't gunna want you to use anything other than a 57. They usually already got their board rung out for em.

[Ben Harmless]

Just wanted to clear up a couple possible misconceptions that might make life easier for folks.

Originally Posted by Tele The Truth

If you're using a sound guy, most likely he ain't gunna want you to use anything other than a 57. They usually already got their board rung out for em.

Nah, what fun would that be?

Actually, the guitar amp mic really doesn't matter nearly as much in terms of feedback because it's not in a spot on stage that will send everything into it. When ringing out a system, one is mostly concerned with onstage monitors (and to some extent the house) bleeding into the vocal mics. You won't usually find many of those anywhere near as close to a guitar amp mic as you will a vocal mic. There are always exceptions of course, and I've had problems with bleed into guitar mics before, but I'm more likely to insist on a change in the monitors at that point anyway.

Originally Posted by Buddaman

57s are fine, but PLEASE do not hang it and point it at the floor! SM 57s are cardioid mics with a high degree of off-axis rejection.

Actually, the cardioid pattern has a good deal of pickup at 90 degrees. A figure eight pattern rejects to the side, but a cardioid typically only rejects at around 180 degrees. Plus, you're not really picking up up at only 90 degrees. If you hang a '57 with the capsule on the grille cloth at the center of a 12" guitar speaker, you're going to pick up the source from about 15 to 165 degrees. I've heard a '57 hung over a cabinet sound just fine. The only real problem is that because the 90 degree pickup works with the speaker, it'll also work in the opposite direction and pickup plenty of stuff from in front of the amp - which can indeed lead to a little "two cats in a sack" problem if the amp is sitting next to, say, drums... Picture a speaker placed in the pickup pattern as illustrated here:



Also, concerning condensor mics FWIW, randysmojo didn't specify whether the thread was about live mic'ing or recording, so I thought I'd add that condenser mics absolutely can be great on guitar amps, not only live, but in the studio. For a distant mic or a room mic, I'd much prefer the detail and pickup of a good condenser. Even live, I've heard some great results and fantastic clarity, though I always do like to check my own ears and I truly am often impressed with the tone and clarity you can indeed achieve with a good ol '57. Still, an AKG 414 can help a massively distorted guitar stay clear in a dense mix. Ask Slayer.

[Tele The Truth]

Originally Posted by Ben Harmless

Just wanted to clear up a couple possible misconceptions that might make life easier for folks.



Nah, what fun would that be?

Actually, the guitar amp mic really doesn't matter nearly as much in terms of feedback because it's not in a spot on stage that will send everything into it. When ringing out a system, one is mostly concerned with onstage monitors (and to some extent the house) bleeding into the vocal mics. You won't usually find many of those anywhere near as close to a guitar amp mic as you will a vocal mic. There are always exceptions of course, and I've had problems with bleed into guitar mics before, but I'm more likely to insist on a change in the monitors at that point anyway.

I get what you're sayin completely.....however I've found that most sound guys 'round my way' like to keep stuff the same from show to show so that they don't have any suprises.

If not, they might have to turn some knobs or sumthin instead of drinking beers and watching the TV at the bar.

[Ben Harmless]

Originally Posted by Tele The Truth

I get what you're sayin completely.....however I've found that most sound guys 'round my way' like to keep stuff the same from show to show so that they don't have any suprises.

If not, they might have to turn some knobs or sumthin instead of drinking beers and watching the TV at the bar.

Oh, you're absolutely right. For a 3-4 band bill at my local rock club, I'd much prefer to just leave the mics set up and point 'em at the next amp, but if someone brings their own, I really don't mind. Besides, most clubs don't have more than a couple of '57s for amps anyway - and I'm sure not going to put anything of my own up there for the bands to get fake (or real) blood all over. Vocal mics are different, but if someone wants to bring their own super-awsome, high-end radio shack mic, they're more than welcome...

...Even at the larger, more upscale, well-equipped places I've worked, it usually winds up as '57s on the amps, most often that's the choice of the artist or their engineer.

[KC]

the problem with hanging the 57 over the amp is not sensitivity -- plenty o'level three inches from the speaker of a guitar amp -- but frequency response. Try talking into the side of a 57 capsule sometime and what you'll hear is a pretty spiky, shrill version of your voice. nasty-sounding.

I used to hang the mics anyway, but only at punk shows were they were certain to get knocked over if they were on a stand in front of the amp. on an open-back cab, you can sometimes mic the back of the speaker, too, with surprisingly good results.

for more sedate acts, it sounds better if you just point the mic at the cone. and really the 57 is the go-to mic for a reason -- over my time in the sound business (ten years) I really got to love the 57, musical-sounding, dead relaible, consistent & durable as hell. A nice fresh 57 and a good-sounding amp is a match made in heaven (or hell, depending on the act).

[Buddaman]

That was my main point. The 90 degree off-axis pick up is THERE, but the frequency response is not the same, plus, you are picking up out of phase signal due to the fact that the reflected sound coming off the floor and back into the on-axis portion of the capsule is slightly behind the tone coming straight into the side of the capsule that is right next to the speaker.

Maybe I am old-school, but as an audio professional who has worked on some of the largest AV integrations in the country, I just can't see how any benefit could ever result from not aiming a directional mic anywhere but somewhat at the source. Anything else will lower the gain-before-feedback ratio and just muddy the overall sound quality.

Either way, whatever it takes to get a decent tone into the PA is what needs to be done. Everyone has their own ways of getting the job done.


Rock on

[Ben Harmless]

Well, I guess I've just had a different experience with the '57s. I don't regularly do it as I nearly always use stands and more direct mic'ing but I've had some decent results draping mics. I think the key could very well be the draped position. It's entirely possible to miss most of the good tone if the mic is hanging too far down over the speaker, and it could result in some harshness, but like any other technique, it takes care to avoid that sort of thing.

[Buddaman]

I agree. At the end of the day, the important thing is that the crowd connects with the musicians and everyone rocks out.
rock on man

[J. Hayes]

you'd better "hang it up" (no pun intended). I haven't encountered a situation where the 57 couldn't handle it. We do outside shows (on the oceanfront) in Va. Beach every summer and other various venues and the 57 will always be my amp mike of choice. I always aim it about halfway between the center and the outer edge of the speaker. On occasion I have hung it over the front of the amp and had no problems, you just have to "fatten" it up a little on the but you can basically get the same sound. As far as vocal mikes go, I always favored the SM-58 but a year or two ago I bought a couple of those re-issued SM-55 "Elvis" mikes which are so cool looking and sound great, they just require a little added volume....JH in Va.