Question for the kit builders...

[Lance]

I've been lurking around the 5E3 forum and contemplating building a tweed amp. I've seen others here that have built the Mission 5E3 kit and have had good results. I may go that way but what I'd REALLLLLY like to build is a tweed Pro with a 15" speaker. I see that Mojotone sells the cabs....not sure about the chassis.

I'm pretty handy with a soldering iron and have built a few effect pedals. Is this a stupid idea for someone that's never tried this before? Should I stick w/ the Mission 5E3 kit for my first go around?

TIA
Lance

[MJ Harnish]

Having built several amps myself (along with a bunch of pedals) I would suggest you go with a kit first. My reasons are that it's cheaper (Bruce's kits are priced very, very reasonably) and more likely to yield positive results right off the bat. It's also helpful to have some instructions and tech support the first time you build an amp b/c lead dress is critical in getting the amp to work well (or at all).

That said, old Fender amps are very well documented with all of the parts, including in most cases the chassis, readily available. The layouts shown in the G.Weber book (and others) tend to be very accurate so you can usually use them as a guide for doing your lead dress. My suggestion would be to create a spreadsheet in which you can enter all the parts you'll need so you can assess exactly what the cost is going to be: You're liable to be stunned at how expensive building an amp yourself can be. :?

In either case, putting the amp together shouldn't be too hard since you've got some soldering experience; I find building FX pedals a lot more frustrating in terms of troubleshooting and wiring. Just keep in mind that you're working with potentially lethal voltages and you need to be especially careful; e.g., a reversed polarized cap in a pedal only means the pedal won't work; in an amp it could explode violently. :(

Have you considered building the Tweed kit as a 15" combo? You'd get the best of both world then. :)

[Lance]

Thanks for the guidance!

Have you considered building the Tweed kit as a 15" combo?

Whoa....I never thought of that! Would it work? Could a 5E3 circuit push a 15"????

There may be other problem I can foresee. Since I'd probably be buying the cabinet, there's a risk that the chassis would be too short for the opening in a Pro cabinet. I'd need to check that out.

Interesting!

L-

[JDO]

ok, let me start by saying that i wrote this long elaborate answer but i had it in my head that you were talking about wanting to build a tweed super and not a tweed pro so i had to scrap it and start over. it helps to actually read the words you look at.

my first question is what kind of tweed pro? are you talking about the 5E5 or 5E5-A or even another one. the two i just mentioned are kind of different.

if you're looking at the 5E5 then the 5E3 with a 15 will be really close. especially if you do the mod to run 6L6's which i don't think is too hard with the missions kit (one resistor change? :? ). with this, you basically have a slightly lower powered 5E5 with the modded missions 5E3 and a 15 (with this mod it can still run 6V6's).

if you're wanting a 5E5-A there are a few differences. taking a quick look at the schematic this is what i see.
1 - an extra gain stage in the preamp (another preamp tube and all the things that go with it)
2 - a difference tone stack
3 - a NFB with presence control
4 - it's fixed bias rather than cathode bias
depending on how good you are with a schematic and such, it might not be that much harder than a 5E3.

Whoa....I never thought of that! Would it work? Could a 5E3 circuit push a 15"????

yep yep. any curcuit can push any size speaker. you just make sure the ohms are right and that the speaker can handle the power the amp puts out.

There may be other problem I can foresee. Since I'd probably be buying the cabinet, there's a risk that the chassis would be too short for the opening in a Pro cabinet. I'd need to check that out.

this is not a problem. go to
http://www.webervst.com/wwwboard/enc...encboard.html? and look to the top of the page. there are a ton of guys who build cabs. i would check out crusty (although i don't know if he does tweed cabs) and bob burt (not sure if he has a link but he post there all the time and is a great builder). for any of these guys it would be no problem for them to build you the cab you want.

now about what to build. something to keep in mind your first build is never your best build. if you have the money to get a 5E3 kit and build it and get experience and then later build what you want then go ahead. that would be the best thing.

but if you know you don't want a 5E3, you won't be happy until you have the tweed pro, and you don't have the money to do both - then i would research, research, research, and a little more research, then i would actually look around for the stuff to make the tweed pro. but, if you have the money, go with the missions kit first. i also think that with a 15 and equiped for 6L6's you'll be quite happy with the 5E3.

[Lance]

I think it seems that the Mission kit is the way to go. I filled out the form to get a quote on a Pro size cabinet. Hopefully, there's a reasonable cabinet builder out there!

Now, I guess the only thing to decide on is if I should go with the 6L6s. (although - it's probably not hard to change that later)

[MJ Harnish]

Whoa....I never thought of that! Would it work? Could a 5E3 circuit push a 15"????

There may be other problem I can foresee. Since I'd probably be buying the cabinet, there's a risk that the chassis would be too short for the opening in a Pro cabinet.

There is no problem with a tweed deluxe pushing a 15" speaker. It takes very little power to drive a speaker load; take a look at the 1/10w ZVex amp which can be used to drive a 4x12" cab for proof. Just make sure you get the correct impedance.

As for the cab, you are very likely to need a custom cab anyways, so you could get it made to fit the chassis; Armadillo Amp Works makes really nice cabs at reasonable prices.
http://www.armadilloampworks.com/

The only potential problem is that if the Mission Amp kit is meant to be mounted vertically (like the original tweeds were) you might need a pretty deep cab to clear the speaker.

Have you considered building a head? Then you could use it with whatever cab you wanted, switching to suit your needs.

[MJ Harnish]

Now, I guess the only thing to decide on is if I should go with the 6L6s. (although - it's probably not hard to change that later)

I would talk to Bruce about 6L6's first, because he might be able to tweak the kit for you to use 6L6's. He also can tell you if power transformer can handle a pair of 6L6's b/c they draw significantly more heater current which the PT *might* not be able to handle. My guess is that this isn't a problem.

[Lance]

Yeah...I thought of having Bruce just ship the parts for a 6L6 amp. From the other posts in firebottle, it looks like there's little difference (1 resistor/tubes) and the PT that he usually uses will work.

So far, I got a quote from Mojotone for $400....complete. Since their web site says that the baffle and grill aren't usually included I asked for clarification. They say this order goes to their "custom shop"...I find that a little "iffy"...we're only talking about making the opening 3" smaller..."custom" is a stretch. At $400, that would be steep compared to Armadillo. I asked but they won't shellac the tweed (looking for the Victoria style finish).

On a head....while that might be easier, I really like combos better. (besides...I have an amazing BF bassman head that I love) To each his own!

[lewis]

Tell Bruce exactly what you want and he will tell you if it's
possible and for what price.
Shellacing your own tweed cabinet is a piece of cake.

[JDO]

I filled out the form to get a quote on a Pro size cabinet. Hopefully, there's a reasonable cabinet builder out there!

are you refering to the thing at the top of the page on the weber enclosers board?

$400.00 seems a little on the high side to me. although, with the three inches that you're talking about with mojo, i can understand why this would have to go to the custom shop. they probably have templates for the ones that are common, where this is a special order and even though it's really just the top board that has to be cut differently, it's still not the norm.

if you have wood working tools - or a friend with some - you might want to just try it on your own. it's pretty fun. i built a 2x10 cab for about $50.00 (tolex, grill clothe, and solid finger joint pine). just another option.

you might also just put on the enclosers board what you're looking for. you might get some other quotes. i have a feeling you can come in under $400.00 for the cab.

[MJ Harnish]

I would just contact Armadillo; the folks on the 18w Marshall group have nothing but good things to say about them. I'd agree that shellacing your own cab is pretty easy.

[Lance]

Requested a quote from Armadillo....

Asked Bruce about 6L6s....

gettin closer....... ;)

[halouis]

so is it built yet?? i'm on my way over. i'll bring my table saw. my soldering irons. and my general lack of refined skills.

should be a fun project. I cant wait to see/hear how it comes out.