Pro Blues guitarist ?

[JohnnyCrash]

Originally Posted by Rich@wildriceband.com

The trend I see is silverface bashing. I can have just about any amp I want, and have owned at least 50 amps over the years. I'm back to 3 silverface amps, and they do what I want better than the others. To make a blanket statement that MV amps suck is offensive to me, and there is alot of anti-silverface rhetoric on the board. I don't know who decided this, don't care, either. They can do anything you want them to, (and sound incredibly good) if you take the time to understand the controls and use them judiciously.
In my opinion. tweed amps are underpowered, primitive, inefficient, and generally not my favorite sound. Not enough clean headroom to do what I want to do. They can be improved with highly efficient speakers, but are still one-trick ponies in live situations until they are mic'd up. I don't want to deal with that stuff, I want to plug in and get down to business- and you can't beat a good Silverface amp.

Don't get me wrong, Rich...

I've got SF Fenders, MV Marshalls, and a few Tweeds... if SFs or MVs "sucked" I wouldn't own them, and/or use them as much as I do. Especially for recording, multiple amps are practically necessity.

As far as "Blues Tone" there's SO MUCH GROUND TO COVER on this subject it's headspinning... regardless of how many years any of us have played blues - there are just too many tones to say "is 100% blues".

Like tastes and opinions the tones are many and varied... and the reasons why some like on or the other are also widely varied...

For instance, your comment on Tweeds being "primitive" and not having as much clean headroom is exactly why I like them, and exactly why you dislike them :)

Those statements are also, to use your words, "blanket statements" that are "bashing" a whole bunch of amps (hehe)...

Generalities withstanding, MV are usually more suited to harder music (which I'm sure most of us enjoy a great deal), and Tweeds just beg for Rolling Stones to be played through em... but in the end we settle on each of our tastes and preferences... and that's something nobody can really bash - Hound Dog and John Lee's tone would be laughable to some tone snobs!

Some folks like nasty raunch in their blues, others like more clean headroom for smooth sweetness - to me, the real point is that we're pretty much all suggesting Fender amps! HAHA!

By the way, when I blast up my SF Fender tomorrow, I'll have a beer for you Rich!

[skip62]

I'm not going to get into the opinion part of this post, cuz it's you're ears that have to decide. But something that hasn't been mentioned is you can turn the master volume up and the gain down. This will give you power tube saturation. This works very well, ask Joe Bonamassa.

Good luck in you're search

[Scott S]

Originally Posted by Rich@wildriceband.com

The trend I see is silverface bashing.

That's to keep the prices down. SHHHH!

[skiraly017]

Not a pro, but amps I have used -

'64 Super Reverb
'68 Super Reverb
'69 Deluxe Reverb
'69 Twin Reverb w/JBL's
Victoria tweed Super
Crate Vintage Club 30
Marshall 50w small box plexi w/matching 8x10" cab
Carr Rambler
Gibson GA-100
RI Bassman
'66 Bandmaster w/matching 1x15" cab
'74 Pro Reverb

There is no one specific amp for blues. Use your ears and find what works and sounds best for you.

[BB]

Originally Posted by skiraly017

There is no one specific amp for blues. Use your ears and find what works and sounds best for you.

Exactly........BB King sounds killer with a solid state lab series amp......Albert King sound great with those old SS Acoustic amps, Jay Owens kills with a SS Peavey Bandit, Luther Dickinson is tasty with a SS Peavey Special 130.....the list goes on and on. If tweeds your bag, excellent...if Silverface, blackface, brownie, et all is good on ya, go for it. I've heard the sweetest blues come from soild state amps and down right plug your ears ugly tones blues from a tweed bassman....and, just the reverse. Different strokes for different folks.

[skiraly017]

Originally Posted by BB

Exactly........BB King sounds killer with a solid state lab series amp......Albert King sound great with those old SS Acoustic amps.

Perfect and excellent examples. Albert's tone just kills.

[KBR]

I am a pro Blues Guitarist, since late 60's.
I love Silver face, Black Face, Tweeds, Brown Amps, Blond Amps...
all Fender Tube amps.


Solid state also can sound good, bottom line, you get out of an Amp what you put into it=PRACTICE, this is the key.
I can sound allright on a SS Amp.
Albert & BB sure did and Do.


KBR

[Wild Rice Chris]

My favorite is the Deluxe Reverb. I have a '72 with a '66 Jensen ceramic in it that is perfect for most things.

Although for slightly lower volumes I have an unknown old amp from the late 40's. That thing is unreal, I keep thinking about cloning it and making a Rice Custom Guitars signature amp.

[nonvintage]

A friend has an amazing nasty little 2-6V6 Bell and Howell suitcase style amp that is unbelievable, I've never heard or saw anything like it. I think it's a PA system for a movie projection system. Not too clean sounding but man it has the coolest one trick pony overdrive I've ever heard.

[Paul G.]

The idea that there is a "blues tone" is just dumb and offensive.

Most pros have developed their own signature sound over years of refinement.

Fortunately the good guys know it's more important to sound and feel right to their own ears than it is to fit a preconception.

P.

[Wild Rice Chris]

I'm with you Paul.

[Wild Rice Chris]

Originally Posted by Big Mike Simpson

Yes, we do Rainin' in my Heart by Slim Harpo... a rough version we recorded in my garage for a demo is on the band website. We do several other songs that use it vibrato and ya I know I could use a pedal but it is in the amp and that's 1 less thing to fool with.

Yes the outboard Fender tube reverbs sound great and they cost as much as an amp.

I have considered building a Weber 5G15 reverb or a 5H15 ReVibe kit, the originals go for 600 to 900 and the repro's get mostly bad reviews.

Well... since everyone seems to disagree with me on the Super Reverb sound vs anything tweed I will not post anymore in this topic...

No... I am not high... haven't been for 20 years...
Been there done that.

I guess you missed that I have a 49 Pro and a 52 Pro...
You are telling me to try what I have already tried...

I am not telling anyone to use what I use...
Perhaps we should rethink the original question...

"Which amps do you prefer, Master volume tube amps or amps with just a single volume control for live situations?"

Big Mike-

THey are talking about modern clones of different amps than the ones you have. The later narrow panel Pro puts out around 40 watts, while yours would do less than 25 watts if they are fully healthy (which I don't know). I've played through a '48 Pro that was way too cool, but unfortunately I couldn't get GC to sell it to me at the marked price (they wanted more than was on the tag!!). It is not as loud as a later amp, plus these guys aren't playing Fenders. Pete Bradt is playing Clay Hullet amps and Johnny Crash is building his own.

I'd equate the difference to comparing a wide panel Bassman and a Bassman 100 (although not quite as extreme).

[Big Mike Simpson]

Well Chris I guess that would explain my perception of available volume from Tweed amps... I'm playing the real thing... All of my amps have been recapped and retubed as necessary to make them sound great but I can only take them to a jam if everyone keeps it down.

According to the FFG the 49 Deluxe is 10 to 14 watts and both the 49 and 52 Pro Amps are rated at 18 to 25 watts. The 49 PRo has KT66 power tubes in it (they were in it when I got it) and I was going to change them but it sounds sooo smooth and creamy I just haven't done it yet. My 74 Princeton Reverb (12" speaker) is rated at 12 to 15 watts and the DRRI at 22 watts but they both seem louder than the original tweed amps.

These original tweed amps all sound great but are on the edge of not being loud enough for a full band. Yes they could be miked but I don't like to depend on a sound man when I don't have to... I have had some real bad sound man experiences and when it does not sound good no one looks at the sound man.

A friend has a narrow panel deluxe and a reverb unit that he built from kits and it is loud enough for jams but he has NO more volume left, it's maxed out.... If the jam volume increases he will be lost in the mix.

[charlie chitlin]

My $.02...If you can't hear a good 5E3 at a jam, you're band is too loud.
And if players are drowning out the guitar player, they should know to chill.
Believe me...I've been there, and have the tinnitus to remind me.

[JohnnyCrash]

For a full swinging band, you guys must be VERY LOUD.

When I'm playing in my hard rock band a tweed could barely keep up (if at all) - I'm the sole guitar player in the 3 piece.

BUT for blues stuff it's plenty loud, though... what kind of blues do you play?

Go for the '59 Bassman or '57 Twin for tweeds... 40 or 50 watts should about cover it...

But if you're STILL pumped for headroom, The SF recommendations are dead on. If you're using OD pedals and stuff (not my kind of blues, but whatever) then a 40+ watt amp will be a good idea too.

BF vs SF
A lot of folks trash SF and prefer BF. There are differences, but they're both still great amps.

MY TWEED BUILDS
My builds are pretty much exactly to spec, except for my Champs (6V6 or 6L6/EL34 switchable - 6 to 10 watts)... my recent Twin build has a 35 watt output transformer, but it's still Cathode biased, so it's not really approaching that OT wattage.

On a 5D8 Twin, like mine, you could swap OTs, and mod it for fixed bias easily and make her 40 watts.

BASICALLY WHAT I'M SAYING IS, that my Tweeds are pretty much the same as the old ones, and do fine for me...

BUT, for your *kitten exploding* volume needs, a SF is less expensive then a BF, sounds awesome, and are readily available!

But yeah, you could do good blues on a lot of different amps (MV or otherwise)... depending on the EXACT blues sound you're looking for :)

[skiraly017]

Originally Posted by JohnnyCrash

*kitten exploding* volume needs

For some reason that phrase makes me laugh and I'm a big cat person.

[Scott S]

Originally Posted by skiraly017

For some reason that phrase makes me laugh and I'm a big cat person.

How could one not love cats? They're delicious!

[JohnnyCrash]

Originally Posted by Scott S

How could one not love cats? They're delicious! :lol:

Especially when masterfully cooked via a Fender amplifier.

[charlie chitlin]

I hate to hijack the thread...but I saw Ted Nugent explode a bird (a pigeon, I think).
Not on purpose...it flew in front of a mile-high stack of speakers at Giant's Stadium.
Lots of people were watching because the bird was obviousely disoriented and flying erratically.

[petebradt]

Originally Posted by Scott S

How could one not love cats? They're delicious!

NOT FUNNY. Any more of this and I'm gonna start talking the same way about babies.

[shakedancer]

[refin]

I have 4 tweeds (Bassman,Tremolux,Pro,and Deluxe) and while I love the tone,I cannot say that they are all there is for blues,or that MV amps are no good.On the fly,I use an early '80s Fender Yale Reverb (Solid State and Master Volume! ) and a Vox Valvetronix,with all the bells and whistles. Both amps do a very credible job for blues.
Remember,Albert King used those hideous solid state Acoustic 270 amps,and they even had a built in horn!But he sounded like Albert,instead of everyone else.I've heard silverface Twins sing,even the ones with the pull MV---and I've heard tweeds barf (Neil Young comes to mind--sorry,just my opinion!).
Find YOUR voice--if it's a tweed,so be it,but if it's a Randall,wail away!