Brownface Kits- Webber?

d. meyers · November 15th, 2005, 01:37 PM

I built a Webber 5f4 kit last year which I love (thanks Rob D.), and I'm ready for a new project- this time something with trem and maby reverb, in the 40W brownface tone ballpark. I played a brown Super the other day that knocked my socks off. Anyone have recommendations for brownface kits? I'd like to build a Brown Super or Vibrolux/verb clone, (that darn Dual Pro is too loud!). Is anyone familiar with any of the newer Webber kits? Would one of those be amenable to brownfacing? I'm afraid of scratchbuilding, although that might be the way to go- the whole layout diagnostics issue is probably beyond my abilities/ test equipment. Fell free to shoot me a link if this has been discussed before- I searched and couldn't find anything.

Dacious · November 15th, 2005, 07:24 PM

Just be warned: a Fender amp with reverb and trem is a complex beast. Doug Hoffman made a board kit. Even he said he was reticent to build them, as they are so hard to get right.

David Barnett · November 15th, 2005, 09:40 PM

I think Allen Amplifiers has one or more brown-ish models.

Wayne Alexander · November 15th, 2005, 10:30 PM

I just finished an Allen Encore, and I've had a Brown Sugar and an Old Flame. The Encore is my personal favorite Allen Amp. It's got the brownface tremolo, which is deep and rich and harmonic-laden, WAY better than blackface tremolo. It has the blackface-style reverb but with 2 knobs - depth, and a tone control that determines how bright the echoey parts are. The main tonal circuitry is blackface Vibrolux, but because of the master volume and raw control and the smaller Vibrolux-type OT compared to the larger, tighter Super-type OT he puts in the Old Flame, the Encore will really sing and grind. It'll play clean up to about 4 or 5 on the dial, but it'll get into glorious Rolling Stones type blooming distortion, without flubbing out. It's got a darker voice than the Old Flame, close (but not identical) to a brownface voice. His kits are expensive and worth it, first rate parts and instructions, cabinetry and speakers, no compromises at all.

mad dog · November 16th, 2005, 10:53 AM

Wayne. How did the Brown Sugar compare to the Encore? Also, have you heard the Hot Fudge w/Nuts? I'm really interested in a 15" or 2x10" speaker amp from Allen, but not sure which one is for me. FWIW, I love tweed circuits, also such usual BF suspects as the Vibrolux and SR, plus brownface Supers and Concerts.

Wayne Alexander · November 16th, 2005, 11:06 AM

Mad Dog, the Brown Sugar was pretty much a Tweed Pro type of sound, but with blackface reverb and the brownface tone stack (including a treble control that is EXTREMELY wide range, goes to an active-boost treble sound at the top). Mine was a 1x15. I liked it ok, but like every tweed amp I've tried, I couldn't find my "voice" in it. I did like it at full grind, where it's got the glorious tweed raunch, but I just didn't like the clean and semidirty sounds as much as some other amps. Also, I really wanted tremolo, the Brown Sugar didn't have that. The Encore sounds like a great blackface Vibrolux, but has more distortion and fullness and a bit darker character (maybe it's the Eminence Ragin Cajun 10" speakers, which do not flub out in the bass like some do. It'll do a full-bodied raunch like live Rolling Stones or Reverend Horton Heat, which I like a lot. I haven't personally tried the Hot Fudge range, I'm not sure they'd give me the headroom I sometimes need.

d. meyers · November 16th, 2005, 10:48 PM

Great recs- I had wondered about Allen. Not cheap, as you say- but if the quality is there, probably worth it. Did you feel compelled to make subs? My one complaint with Webber was the need to sub some generally low quality parts (the pilot lamp assy. comes to mind), but on the other hand those kits are amazingly affordable.

mkg · November 17th, 2005, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mad dog

...Also, have you heard the Hot Fudge w/Nuts? I'm really interested in a 15" or 2x10" speaker amp from Allen, but not sure which one is for me. FWIW, I love tweed circuits, also such usual BF suspects as the Vibrolux and SR, plus brownface Supers and Concerts.

Very satisfied owner of a HF/Nuts here, 1x12 version. I run 6L6s in mine and gig with it. We do r&b and r&r including Motown, Beatles, Stones, TFF, etc. I use an LP, Tele, and Strat and all three sound great through it.
If you're curious I posted clips here.
I used my LP and Strat, didn't have the Tele at the time.

November 15th, 2005, 01:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
d. meyers Tele-Meister Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: PDX OR Posts: 463 8 Photos	Brownface Kits- Webber? I built a Webber 5f4 kit last year which I love (thanks Rob D.), and I'm ready for a new project- this time something with trem and maby reverb, in the 40W brownface tone ballpark. I played a brown Super the other day that knocked my socks off. Anyone have recommendations for brownface kits? I'd like to build a Brown Super or Vibrolux/verb clone, (that darn Dual Pro is too loud!). Is anyone familiar with any of the newer Webber kits? Would one of those be amenable to brownfacing? I'm afraid of scratchbuilding, although that might be the way to go- the whole layout diagnostics issue is probably beyond my abilities/ test equipment. Fell free to shoot me a link if this has been discussed before- I searched and couldn't find anything.

November 15th, 2005, 07:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
Dacious Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Godzone Posts: 2,623 35 Photos	Just be warned: a Fender amp with reverb and trem is a complex beast. Doug Hoffman made a board kit. Even he said he was reticent to build them, as they are so hard to get right. __________________ My other Telecaster is a Thinline The Tele Bible, Ch 1, v 10 Love thy Telecaster, covet not thy neighbour's Strat!

November 15th, 2005, 09:40 PM	#3 (permalink)
David Barnett Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: LIttle Rock, AR Age: 52 Posts: 5,491	I think Allen Amplifiers has one or more brown-ish models.

November 15th, 2005, 10:30 PM	#4 (permalink)
Wayne Alexander Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA Posts: 1,083	I just finished an Allen Encore, and I've had a Brown Sugar and an Old Flame. The Encore is my personal favorite Allen Amp. It's got the brownface tremolo, which is deep and rich and harmonic-laden, WAY better than blackface tremolo. It has the blackface-style reverb but with 2 knobs - depth, and a tone control that determines how bright the echoey parts are. The main tonal circuitry is blackface Vibrolux, but because of the master volume and raw control and the smaller Vibrolux-type OT compared to the larger, tighter Super-type OT he puts in the Old Flame, the Encore will really sing and grind. It'll play clean up to about 4 or 5 on the dial, but it'll get into glorious Rolling Stones type blooming distortion, without flubbing out. It's got a darker voice than the Old Flame, close (but not identical) to a brownface voice. His kits are expensive and worth it, first rate parts and instructions, cabinetry and speakers, no compromises at all.

November 16th, 2005, 10:53 AM	#5 (permalink)
mad dog Tele-Holic Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 849	Wayne. How did the Brown Sugar compare to the Encore? Also, have you heard the Hot Fudge w/Nuts? I'm really interested in a 15" or 2x10" speaker amp from Allen, but not sure which one is for me. FWIW, I love tweed circuits, also such usual BF suspects as the Vibrolux and SR, plus brownface Supers and Concerts.

November 16th, 2005, 11:06 AM	#6 (permalink)
Wayne Alexander Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles, CA, USA Posts: 1,083	Mad Dog, the Brown Sugar was pretty much a Tweed Pro type of sound, but with blackface reverb and the brownface tone stack (including a treble control that is EXTREMELY wide range, goes to an active-boost treble sound at the top). Mine was a 1x15. I liked it ok, but like every tweed amp I've tried, I couldn't find my "voice" in it. I did like it at full grind, where it's got the glorious tweed raunch, but I just didn't like the clean and semidirty sounds as much as some other amps. Also, I really wanted tremolo, the Brown Sugar didn't have that. The Encore sounds like a great blackface Vibrolux, but has more distortion and fullness and a bit darker character (maybe it's the Eminence Ragin Cajun 10" speakers, which do not flub out in the bass like some do. It'll do a full-bodied raunch like live Rolling Stones or Reverend Horton Heat, which I like a lot. I haven't personally tried the Hot Fudge range, I'm not sure they'd give me the headroom I sometimes need.

November 16th, 2005, 10:48 PM	#7 (permalink)
d. meyers Tele-Meister Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: PDX OR Posts: 463 8 Photos	Great recs- I had wondered about Allen. Not cheap, as you say- but if the quality is there, probably worth it. Did you feel compelled to make subs? My one complaint with Webber was the need to sub some generally low quality parts (the pilot lamp assy. comes to mind), but on the other hand those kits are amazingly affordable.