Compare & Contrast: AC4TV / Pathfinder 15

[Rich_S]

Recently decided I need a second amp. My DIY 18 Watter clone sounds great and has been very reliable, but when it has a problem I'm the only guy who can work on it. When I'm too busy (all the time) I can go for months at a time with no amp, as I have since March.

I got the hots for an AC15C1, but I only gig once a year so spending that much on a giggable amp is pointless. I need something for home, that will be there ready to go whenever I can find a few minutes to play. I need something that will play nice with my pedalboard: delay, chorus, flanger, overdrive, distortion, tremolo, phaser. I'm an '80s guy, into Andy Summers, early U2, Pretenders, etc. Single channel amps are how I roll, guitar up for crunch, guitar down for clean, kick on a stomp box for solos.

My first thought after the AC15 was the AC4; it seemed the logical step down. I realize it lacks headroom, but I assume it can bridge the clean/crunch zone given my extremely modest volume needs. Its 10" speaker is a plus. All-tube is good. I saw a demo on YouTube with a Memory Man that did a great "Street With No Name" sound. I don't need metal levels of dirt or bass.

Then I started reading all the guys around here who love their Pathfinders. It seems a lot of people think it apes the classic Vox sound better. I assume it's 15 watts of SS power is about equal to the AC4's tube output stage in terms of practical volume. The 8" speaker is a minus. I don't fault the PF15 for being solid-state; I've found that non-modeling SS amps can sound good, and do a decent imitation of tubes. (My Vox Amp Plug Classic (Marshall) is a good example.)

So, what do you think? What else do I need to know? I'm headed to the big city (Albany, LOL) next week on business and there's a GC right down the street from my hotel, so I'll be able to try them both, but you guys have more practical experience with both amps than I'll get out a quick demo at GC. Share!

[bunny 7]

I've had both and should've kept the Pathfinder, need to pick another one up sometime.
I did a quick search on the Albany- GC and it looks like they don't stock either of the Vox amps you're interested in. Maybe give that store a call and see if they have anything to try.

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Vox,Guit...oresearch=true

[RockerDuck]

The Pathfinder R is more like 20 watts and out performs a 4 watt tube easily. There is a reason some here buy two PFR's and use them together. I've never seen a Pathfinder in a Guitar Center either.

[littlericky]

If an AC15 is the sound you're looking for a PF will get you there inexpensively. It's not the same obviously but similar.

An AC4TV s a completely different beast, at least stock. The Blue AC4 will probably be something to look at but for $100 more you can get a used AC15.

[RockerDuck]

I should mention that 8" speaker in the Pathfinder sounds alot bigger than it is. You will think it's a bigger speaker if you didn't look in the back.

[Leep Dog]

Between those 2 I'd opt for the Pathfinder too. I'm sure you'd be happy with either though.

The Pathfinder is cheaper, has tremolo and reverb and would not require any tube changes and of course they sound awesome. If I didn't have a Vox VT15, I'd get a Pathfinder for my little practice amp without a second's hesitation. I like them a lot.

[LGOberean]

You say you've been reading comments about Pathfinders here on TDPRI, so you're likely to hear some things repeated in this thread of yours.

I tried the AC4 first. Plugged into it on several occasions, in fact. I was actually wanting tubes, so the EL84 and the name Vox drew me in. I liked it okay, but as I have said elsewhere, I wasn't wowed enough by it to pull the trigger. You've already mentioned its lack of headroom.

For a long while I did not find a PF15R to try out. When I finally did, that was it. Bought it right there on the spot. This past May, I bought a second one. RockerDuck speaks the truth; the PF15R is a loud 15 watts. And that 8" Bulldog speaker will surprise you. If you go in expecting this little amp with its 15 watts and 8" speaker to sound sterile or boxy, you're in for a surprise.

And at my 4th of July gig, I did what RD just talked about; I linked both of my Pathfinders together via my ABY box, set them on either side of the staging area, and played to a 200+ crowd. The amps weren't even completely cranked: Volume was at 1 o'clock, Gain at 9 o'clock, and the Volume on my Tele wasn't dimed, I used that for adjustments/dynamics. Here's the evidence:



Well, okay, you can only see one of my Pathfinders in this pic, but trust me, the other one is on the other side. I gig my PF15Rs all the time; this 4th of July gig was the first time I'd gigged them both in tandem.

I hope you get a chance to compare and contrast these amps, as you put it, but I've never seen a Pathfinder 15R in a GC either.

[simonc]

Pathfinder is what you are after. I use mine to get the tones from the bands you mentioned ( u2, pretenders...) and more. And as others have mentioned - dont let the fact its an 8" speaker put you off. And its loud. loud enough for your band? Only you know that...but an ac4 is not loud enough for a band situ imho.

[taxer]

I have both. I agree with everyone here. I too recommend the Pathfinder. Following reasons why:

- price is an incredible deal (the AC4's price is way too steep for what it does)
- tremolo and reverb (AC4 puts out the dryest, flatest sound around and needs pedals)
- volume (AC4 can no way match the volume of a Pathfinder)

Don't worry about Vox tone from a Pathfinder. Yeah, the AC4 is the real deal tube Vox tone, but the Pathfinder really does sound like a Vox.

Where the AC4 surpasses the Pathfinder is in its perfect and pure clean Vox tone and in its amazing overdriven tone. (The Pathfinder overdrive gives that stale solid state distortion, while the AC4 gives you that glorious heated tube gurgle that is amazing). And the AC4 also wins in the better looking department.

[Rich_S]

What about that zone between clean and overdrive? Will the PF do convincing rhythm crunch on its own? I don't need full-on Brian May overdrive out of it, when I get to those levels of dirt, I use a BB Preamp or a modded DS-1.

Shame about GC not stocking these. The obvious solution would be for them to sell the AC15C1 they have for $249. LOL. I guess I'll have to investigate the other Vox dealers in the Albany area, see who has one or both in stock. Only local music store doesn't sell Vox.

[PsychedelicTrip]

For those sounds you'll need a jangler for starters. Have you considered used and or what you have lying around you don't need you can sell and afford something like 15 watt vox or even a Fender 15 watter? Trust me tubes rule for a reason but a lot of what you'll play needs some head room. This name "pathfinder" is kind of a joke corporation like to do. It was designed as a bedroom amp for Beatlemania in 1965. Vox hired the Thomas Organ Co to produce the class A amps. I think it was like less than a year and they were transistors. Those amps disappeared but were repacked fairly recently. For 1 gig I suppose the cheaper transistor will do but if you want a more organic sound that might make you play more save up and get the amp you really want. It's not that much more. Look around your house for things to sell. You'll that not me but yourself for the effort to raise the cash.

[simonc]

Originally Posted by Rich_S

What about that zone between clean and overdrive? Will the PF do convincing rhythm crunch on its own? I don't need full-on Brian May overdrive out of it, when I get to those levels of dirt, I use a BB Preamp or a modded DS-1.

Shame about GC not stocking these. The obvious solution would be for them to sell the AC15C1 they have for $249. LOL. I guess I'll have to investigate the other Vox dealers in the Albany area, see who has one or both in stock. Only local music store doesn't sell Vox.

Yes, it does the clean / almost overdriven so well that I sold several other small boutique amps, because I liked the pathfinder that much, and it freed up cash for other things ( it was swart space tone & Dr Z mini Z that I got rid of).

check out the pathfinder thread in the amp clubs page. Page 33 of that thread has some excellent demo videos. And if thats not enough to whet your appetite, youtube " norah jones jesus etc" or "feist secret heart paris". both clips are with pathfinders, and sound great, imho.

theres also this for your consideration.
good luck!

[bunny 7]

I looked up page 33 in the Pathfinders Owners Club thread, good demos on that page.
Here's a quick link for those interested.

http://www.tdpri.com/forum/amp-owner...owners-33.html

[DonMI6]

I did this comparison a few weeks ago when I went looking for a smaller amp to complement my AC15C1. Tried both the AC4TV & Pathfinder 15R & bought the Pathfinder. Tonewise (to my ears at least) it compares extremely well to the AC15. The biggest advantages to me over the AC4TV is the reverb which is decent, & as I bought it mainly for playing at home, the headphone jack. It was also very cheap :-)

Nothing wrong with the AC4TV, but to me the Pathfinder was the right amp for me.

[Controller]

Normally I wouldn't do this, but after reading all the glowing reports about the Pathfinder I ordered one without ever hearing it.

I'm glad I did, it's a great little amp.

After dumping money into my tube amps, it's a nice change to just have a grab and go amp that works.

[Chiogtr4x]

Originally Posted by Controller

Normally I wouldn't do this, but after reading all the glowing reports about the Pathfinder I ordered one without ever hearing it.

I'm glad I did, it's a great little amp.

After dumping money into my tube amps, it's a nice change to just have a grab and go amp that works.

Exactly! No fuss no muss, just great, portable tone! Gonna use the little Pathfinder on a classic country (small room) gig tonight!

edit: just did a small country gig and this amp was just perfect- it was a hot (as hell) outdoor gig and I just wanted to plug in and play- no pedals/clip-on tuner- the Pathfinder was plenty clean where needed, plenty nasty where needed, and plenty loud! Love it!

[jipp]

one thing i have learn since i started this hobbie. you can get away with one guitar,and will end up with several amps. unfortunately i went the wrong direction and ended up with a bunch of guitars to find what i like and do not like. now im onto amps.. at least guitars hang on the wall and take up little space i guess :D

chris.

[RockerDuck]

I like clean sounds and only my Marshall super lead in the 70's did every thing I needed, but loud. Finally, pedal technology came along so I don't depend on the amps distortion. The Pathfinder likes the BBPreamp as well as every pedal I tried. I put a Carl Martin Plexitone pedal into it and it sounded like a 12 inch speaker at 50 watts. That little 8" speaker held up and didn't blow. That's impressive.

[Hoodster]

I've had both--although not at the same time--and am surprised by the comments saying the PF is louder. I found the PF sounded really crappy cranked, whereas the AC4 comes into its own on the 4W setting turned up. I found the AC4 louder, or perhaps more able to produce a good sound at louder volumes. With a decent cab, the AC4 (I had the head) could hang with a mellow band.

The only way I'd buy the PF again would be for a plug-straight-in low volume bedroom amp. For that, at the price, it's pretty nice.

BTW, the Lil Night Train blows them both away--both clean and dirty--and is also incredibly loud for 2W. I used mine with a 1x12 C Rex.

.

[Hoodster]

Swapping in a new $12 JJ power tube made this a killer rig.