Old Flame question

Hucklebilly · May 15th, 2005, 10:09 AM

For you Allen Old Flame users out there:

How useful do you find the preamp voltage switch and the "mix" and "dwell" controls on the reverb. In correspondence with David Allen, he said these are pretty subtle effects, so I'm wondering if those of you who have used this amp in a real-world setting think these are crucial to the amp's sound or could you get along without them?

Rick Towne · May 15th, 2005, 11:50 AM

so useful, along with the raw control and bright swtich and subtle master volume. You can adapt your basic clean Allen Fender-derived tones to different speakers, effects, guitars, venues, etc. much easier.

migra dude · May 15th, 2005, 12:27 PM

and I have the Dwell at 8, the Reverb at 2 and the tone at 5 and that's pretty much where they stay. Sometimes I'll back off either the dwell or reverb if I'm using something with a real hot input signal or if the room doesn't require much or any reverb.

It's kind of weird. I've been using JJ6v6's and a Weber copper cap WU4G rectifier. With these tubes, at home or at our practice room, I thought I liked the preamp switch set to low. I gigged with the amp awhile back and the amp was too muddy for my tastes, and I forgot about the pre-amp switch. Probably could have cleaned it up had I remembered. It was an outside patio kind of thing with a lot of concrete and that really boogered things up.

I just bought a pair of the short bottle TAD 6L6's and put them in with a JJ GZ34 rectifier. With these tubes, so far, I prefer the preamp switch in the high voltage setting, I don't know why, but it seems there was just too much breakup on the low setting. You'd think it would be the opposite, 6V6 vs. 6L6 and all. I was really starting to like these tubes, but I've only played one practice session with them, so the verdict is not in. The TAD tubes are the real deal, I think. The voltmeter showed 34.9mv on one tube and 35.0 mv on the other after a few hours of playing. Pretty well matched, I'd say.

I really think as the volume goes up, and I'm mixing with other musicians, that switch isn't as subtle as I might have thought previously, and I have to adjust accordingly.

On the other hand I have a V-18 (sweet spot) with the 12" speaker, with one reverb knob and no preamp switch and no Master Volume and it sounds great just like it is. It's getting 95 % of my playing time. Well, actually less, I finally broke down and bought a POD for home use.

Jim.Collins · May 15th, 2005, 12:45 PM

My Old Flame is old enough that it doesn't have a voltage switch, so I can't comment on that. It does, however, have the three-control reverb.

The "mix" control corresponds to the "reverb" control on a blackface. This is the amount of reverb you want. You need this control.

The "dwell" and "tone" reverb controls are the ones that do not appear on blackface amps. In a blackface amp, these values are set in the circuit design. You might never change these controls, once you establish the values you prefer, but they do allow you to tailor the reverb the way you like it.

Hucklebilly · May 15th, 2005, 01:05 PM

Thanks for the informative replies. The reason I'm asking is that I'm trying to decide between the head versions of the Accomplice with a 40 watt transformer and the Old Flame. They are almost identical apart from the voltage switch and the three knob reverb.

One more question: so the "dwell" control is akin to setting a different length to a delay?

chriswuzhere · May 19th, 2005, 01:16 AM

My Old Flame seems muddy to me right now,, but I think it's the speaker cab that I'm play through... I previously played through the 2x10 and it seemed to cut through the mix better... I'm working on finding some better speakers.

Tremo · May 19th, 2005, 01:25 AM

I heard KBR play his Old Flame through a 2x12 cab loaded with Weber 12A150s. It was awesome.

chriswuzhere · May 19th, 2005, 03:46 PM

Was he playing it live or by itself? Also, what kind of music was he playing?

Tremo · May 19th, 2005, 04:55 PM

He was playing it live at a club gig. Blues.

May 15th, 2005, 10:09 AM	#1 (permalink)
Hucklebilly Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 821 2 Photos	Old Flame question For you Allen Old Flame users out there: How useful do you find the preamp voltage switch and the "mix" and "dwell" controls on the reverb. In correspondence with David Allen, he said these are pretty subtle effects, so I'm wondering if those of you who have used this amp in a real-world setting think these are crucial to the amp's sound or could you get along without them?

May 15th, 2005, 11:50 AM	#2 (permalink)
Rick Towne Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Woodland Hills, CA Posts: 825	They are subtle, but that's what makes the Old Flame so useful, along with the raw control and bright swtich and subtle master volume. You can adapt your basic clean Allen Fender-derived tones to different speakers, effects, guitars, venues, etc. much easier.

May 15th, 2005, 12:27 PM	#3 (permalink)
migra dude Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lynden, WA Posts: 104	I'm looking at my Old Flame right now.... and I have the Dwell at 8, the Reverb at 2 and the tone at 5 and that's pretty much where they stay. Sometimes I'll back off either the dwell or reverb if I'm using something with a real hot input signal or if the room doesn't require much or any reverb. It's kind of weird. I've been using JJ6v6's and a Weber copper cap WU4G rectifier. With these tubes, at home or at our practice room, I thought I liked the preamp switch set to low. I gigged with the amp awhile back and the amp was too muddy for my tastes, and I forgot about the pre-amp switch. Probably could have cleaned it up had I remembered. It was an outside patio kind of thing with a lot of concrete and that really boogered things up. I just bought a pair of the short bottle TAD 6L6's and put them in with a JJ GZ34 rectifier. With these tubes, so far, I prefer the preamp switch in the high voltage setting, I don't know why, but it seems there was just too much breakup on the low setting. You'd think it would be the opposite, 6V6 vs. 6L6 and all. I was really starting to like these tubes, but I've only played one practice session with them, so the verdict is not in. The TAD tubes are the real deal, I think. The voltmeter showed 34.9mv on one tube and 35.0 mv on the other after a few hours of playing. Pretty well matched, I'd say. I really think as the volume goes up, and I'm mixing with other musicians, that switch isn't as subtle as I might have thought previously, and I have to adjust accordingly. On the other hand I have a V-18 (sweet spot) with the 12" speaker, with one reverb knob and no preamp switch and no Master Volume and it sounds great just like it is. It's getting 95 % of my playing time. Well, actually less, I finally broke down and bought a POD for home use. __________________ rig: 79 Strat>RMC3 wah>Boss TU2>Klon Centaur>MI Audio Blues Pro>MI Audio Crunch Box>Allen V-18 or Old Flame.

May 15th, 2005, 01:05 PM	#5 (permalink)
Hucklebilly Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 821 2 Photos	Thanks Thanks for the informative replies. The reason I'm asking is that I'm trying to decide between the head versions of the Accomplice with a 40 watt transformer and the Old Flame. They are almost identical apart from the voltage switch and the three knob reverb. One more question: so the "dwell" control is akin to setting a different length to a delay?

May 19th, 2005, 01:16 AM	#6 (permalink)
chriswuzhere TDPRI Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Collinsville, Texas Posts: 78	My Old Flame seems muddy to me right now,, but I think it's the speaker cab that I'm play through... I previously played through the 2x10 and it seemed to cut through the mix better... I'm working on finding some better speakers. __________________ Praise The Lord!!!

May 15th, 2005, 12:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Jim.Collins Tele-Meister Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Pleasanton, CA Age: 54 Posts: 468	My Old Flame is old enough that it doesn't have a voltage switch, so I can't comment on that. It does, however, have the three-control reverb. The "mix" control corresponds to the "reverb" control on a blackface. This is the amount of reverb you want. You need this control. The "dwell" and "tone" reverb controls are the ones that do not appear on blackface amps. In a blackface amp, these values are set in the circuit design. You might never change these controls, once you establish the values you prefer, but they do allow you to tailor the reverb the way you like it.

May 19th, 2005, 01:25 AM	#7 (permalink)
Tremo Banned Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Silicon Valley, CA, USA Posts: 3,803	I heard KBR play his Old Flame through a 2x12 cab loaded with Weber 12A150s. It was awesome.

May 19th, 2005, 03:46 PM	#8 (permalink)
chriswuzhere TDPRI Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Collinsville, Texas Posts: 78	Was he playing it live or by itself? Also, what kind of music was he playing? __________________ Praise The Lord!!!

May 19th, 2005, 04:55 PM	#9 (permalink)
Tremo Banned Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Silicon Valley, CA, USA Posts: 3,803	He was playing it live at a club gig. Blues.