Why I Play Through a Half-Stack

[Ben Harmless]

After reading over four bazillion posts about how my half-stack is too big, too loud, and unnecessary, I have to admit I’m getting a little irritated by what seems to be a little bit of short-sightedness on the part of many on more boards than just the TDPRI. No one person has offended me, and I don’t mean to single anyone out here, but for now, I have prepared this simple offering, which I hope will help clarify my position, and amplifier choices:

Why I Play Through a Half-Stack
By Benjamin M. Harmless

Rock & roll is like love and cockroaches: it happens everywhere, and you can’t stop it. I have played in garages, basements, pool halls, sculpture galleries, teen centers, colleges, bars, underground squats, skateparks, hockey rinks, living rooms, breweries, cafes, churches, VFW halls, KoC halls, FOH halls, fire houses, gymnasiums, and a shack in the middle of the woods. I have played through full-fledged sound systems with six monitor mixes and a press feed, and I have played through a Yamaha powered mixer feeding two 1x12 boxes.

Why don’t I just mic the amp? Well, because I’ve played dozens of shows where we were lucky to have two Radio Shack mics for vocals running into an underpowered mixer. I can’t count on running my amp through a system that may not be sufficient to project the vocals over the drummer alone.

I’ve also played with drummers who have taught me that a JC120 doesn’t have nearly enough headroom. I’ve played through a 2x12 cab with a Reverend Hellhound 40/60 head, and been nearly drowned out. Why doesn’t that drummer just tone it down a bit? Because it’s rock and roll, and I’m lucky enough to be able to find a drummer, let alone one as talented as some whom I’ve played with. This is the real world.

I’ve played shows, with no stage, where there we so many people crammed into the space that I could barely stand, and the sound was absorbed by the first row of bodies. A combo amp with a single speaker, without a mic, will be eaten alive in that situation, and no one will hear anything more than drums – almost regardless of how reasonable your drummer may be.

Lastly, I’m a sound engineer. I mix often upwards of six different bands a week. I’m aware of how things sound in real-world applications, and I’m aware that I don’t always need to dime my 50-watt Marshall to sound good. Plenty of national acts would do better to upgrade to the tone that I get in my bedroom. I’ve got the flexibility that was the inspiration for the invention of the master volume.

Why am I willing to lug my half-stack up and down my stairs whenever I play? Because it’s worth it.

[Daddy Elmis]

Ben: it sounds like a 50watt half stack works great for you, and you've developed the talent and knowledge to make it work in a wide variety of situations. Amen, brother.

Unfortunately, my experience is that, for whatever reason, when somebody shows up with the archetypical Marshall half- or full-stack they go for 7+ regardless of the drummer or other band dynamics because "that's where their tone is." The result is usually horrendous. At every bar I've ever worked the manager cringes when someone rolls in the half-stack, because usually it results in a too loud band as everyone tries to balance with that amp.

I've also heard and played with guys using Bassman, HRDx's and Marshall DSL401's that have the same problem. At the end of the day, insensitivity to band mix and dynamics is fatal whether you've got a 1x10 or a full stack.

I think the response you've seen on the boards is simply reflective of a trend towards smaller amps for most club bands because of the desire to get power tube distortion at manageable volumes. Personally, I'd love to be in a space where I could drive a half-stack -- but it's not where I'm at. I recently sold my Bassman because at 40 watts and 4x10 I couldn't ever really crank it where it found it's voice.

At the end of the day, if it works for you, your music and your audience, it doesn't matter what you play through.

Rock that thing, man.

[halouis]

I'm with you Ben. I play loud Rock/Punk and it's not music that you should be able to talk over. My amp tech is an older guy and plays surf, blues and classic rock. He uses a hot rodded Fender SF Princeton. THats fine for his style. but it wouldn;t work for me.

A small club witth a good sound guy knows how to work with loud rock bands and 1/2 + full stacks. theres a talent to it. many sound guys just don't have the knowhow to deal with this sort of band. We're lucky here in Charlottesville to have an amazing sound guy at our local club. he "gets it".

but sometimes it can be overboard. 2 weeks ago the band RPG came to our towen and played this little burrito joint in downtown. this place was small. no stage. they came in w/ 2 full 100w marshall stacks cranked! and a full SVT bass rig. Now they were great, but even with tissue in my ears, the bass was rattling my eardrums. honestly it was too much. but i still enjoyed it.

[Marshall Thinline]

Hey Ben,

I'm happy to see that you use what works for YOU! Amps are tools, and you need to use the correct tool for the job.

I think a lot of the players on this forum are not playing the same type of music as you. They are looking for a different tone, and are playing different types of clubs than you (and me). I think a lot of players answer back with their tone referece, not what the forum poster is looking for. There is nothing better than the sound of a Marshall when they get cooking.

For me, I have been using my new Kingsnake in most situations (smaller clubs). But in a larger situation, out comes the Marshall. Maybe soon I will bring them both out to a gig. Now, that would be heaven on earth. I guess I'll have to wait for the summer outdoor shows to try that combo out.

[Hucklebilly]

Of course not as clearly as I might have if I hadn't been playing my 135 watt Twin!!!

But seriously, there are situations where you want serious horsepower. I play clean in a country band, and last spring we played a dance stage in a big tent at a local music festival--15 minutes to set up and start playing. I was so thankful to have that amp. I could dial in the sound I wanted and not wait for the over-worked soundman to get it right half way through the set. Big amps aren't right for every situation, but it's good to have one in your stable.

[Maggot]

I agree (although I no longer find myself having to use a loud amp). I played punk for a long time, and I think that the Marshall sound, as it was heard in the clubs, was distinguished by the midrange and the extent to which the sound was audible without killing your ears.

Second, Marshalls aren't THAT loud. Sure, they're loud, but quieter probably than Fenders of the same stated wattage. A 50-Watt Marshall has lots of great sounds at resonable volumes. A Silverface Twin has way more horsepower.

Finally, you can be overpowered (like I was when I used to play a Musicman HD-130) but you can't be over-speakered. A 4x12 can sound like 4 amps sometimes.

That said I usually use a 1x12 or 1x15 combo because I can get away with it.

[Aaron Schiff]

I play an Ashdown Peacemaker 40 1x12 combo with a 2x12 extention cab. I like the volume of air moved by several speakers without the pressure. I'd probably like a half stack even more, but the combo only weighs 38 pounds and the extention cab is only 45 pounds. I play clean: old country, old rock and old r&b. One place I play regularly has a great sound man and system and I only take the combo. Another regular place has terrible acoustics and I need all the help I can get. I'd probably use a full stack like in the '60s, if I didn't need a dolly and a come-along to move it these days.

[Jakedog]

I loves my half stack, and don't ever want to use anything else. 8) I don't even subscribe to the "It's supposed to be loud, it's rock and roll" philosophy, I just love the fullness that a 4X12 box gives you. I play alot of smaller places, one of them only holds about 45 people, I still use the half stack. I love it because I can run it at the same volume I would run a 30 watt 1X12 combo, but it fills up the room so much more. The low end is great, the sound is really smooth, and the amp never sounds 'strained" for lack of a better word. I use the same approach with stereo equipment: What sounds better, an 30 watt boombox on 8, or a 120 watt stereo on 2? They are both relatively the same volume, but one is MUCH more pleasing to the ear. And that my friends, is why I play a half stack.

As an addendum:

Dearest Ben and Hal,

I will confess, when I am in a stiuation where I can really let that puppy rip, it is a HELLUVA lot of fun!



Jake

[RJB]

Ben,
First off, thank you for a very articulate and well thought out point of view. The arguments and points of view are all very valid to you're situation.

Second I believe most of the comments for use a smaller amp are from the people that use a bit of a "cleaner" sound. Usually achieved by dimeing the MASTER volume and using the preamp volume to just start a bit of dirt. The result is a relatively clean sound that gets a little dirty when you dig in. A real dynamic sound that is responsive to pick attack and such. A small combo does this well. A small head into a 4x12 does it great. However I believe that if you do this with your 50W head you end up fairly loud! i.e. too loud for many small gigs.

Third a small amp miked with a GOOD mic into a GOOD PA system will yield more than acceptable results. But as you stated this isn't always what you get in the real world.

Congatulations on acheiving a sound combination that works for you. I myself am still looking.

Ron

[Dust my Broom]

Hey Ben, take it easy man. you can play through a half-stack if you want to.

[Sarge]

I love my 1/2 stack. Some amps just need to half one! Take the 5150 for instance, with a 2X12 it hangs over the edges and just don't look right. Now, with a 4X12 it just fits perfectly. Plus, it's nice to have that 120 watts and something to channel it through with out worring about blowing your speakers. And lets not forget the...THUMP. Yea, 1X12 and 2X12's are nice but a 4X12 is heaven!

[Aen]

Cause it sits next to a 600 watt bass combo.

[e-merlin]

I think the best answer is "because I darn well please."

However, I love the sound I get through a half stack. I love my Wet/Dry setup, usually with my Reverberocket or VTM-60 half stack dry and my TubeFex/ADA Microfet/stereo 412 half stack for wet.

Who cares that I only play at home? Well, except for the neighbors.

[Smokin' Joe Picante]

Thanks Ben! Articulate, and well thought out. I've found small cab's can sometimes act like a laser beam by the time you get enough volume to feel the amp. No matter WHERE you point it, SOMEBODY'S gettin' killed, but... move one foot that-a-way and the amp is gone.

I'm actually quieter running a 120 watt stereo amp with a 4X12. It gives me the bottom and breadth of sound, as well as dispersion that meets my comfort level on stage, without blowing anyone out the door. Unless, of course, that's called for. :P

IMO as far as the volume issue, It's not the cabinet, it's just how loud you chose to play with WHATEVER amp you use. As far as tone goes, with all due respect (to the breadth of Dr.Z/Bogner/THD 2X12's out there... great cabs too!), I really believe there's no substitiute for internal cabinet volume (cubic size that is... :P ) to obtain thump.

Thanks for flying the flag, Ben!!!! Three Cheers!!!!

[Aen]

Yeah, but why did you censor out the name on your teles headstock?


I smell a rat!


:P

[jhundt]

I always wished I could play on a Marshall. I have used a borrowed half-stack on a song or two (over 35 years of playing), but I never owned one. They are beautiful, and if I could live one dream, it would be to stand in front of the famous "wall of Marshalls" just once. I used to use a half-stack black Bassman or Ampeg V4 w/ generic 4x12, and that was real good. As I got older, gigs got smaller and I was less inclined to move that stuff. But I'm with you, go for it!

[Wally]

"Whatever gets you through the night is allright, alright."

My problem with sealed-back, square 4 cabs for small venues is the 'beam effect..directionality if you want...of the sound. Have you ever walked across a small club on a path perpendicular to the line of a closed-bac, 4X cab? The cab develops its sound in a reverse cone that develops its full impact about 20-30 feet on a line in front of the cab. To either side, it may be inaudible, but on that line it may knock you over. There is limited dispersion on stage..to the sides, to the back..so the other players have trouble hearing the guitar. I have seen situations where the guitarist couldn't hear his instrument and kept turning the amp up. The sound still develops on a line and somewhere 'out there' about 20-30 feet, and the player still couldn't hear what he was playing. I believe this is one major reason why layers are going to combos and open-back speaker enclosures for heads. It is a good thing to hear oneself on stage. It will keep volumes down on small stages and allows the players to hear the guitar.
Large stages and venues change all of this. The player can get away from the cab and actually hear what is going on, and the directionality is overriden by the use of the sound system to distribute the guitar sounds widely.

That said, one of the best compromises that I have seen is a mix of closed and open back cabs. I built up a 2X10 with one side sealed and one side open with a switchable input. Magnificent sound. I later learned that this is what Duane Allman did to his Marshall cabs.
And after all is said, I am glad that Ben can be happy with his gear. "Is allright"

[4mal]

Cause it sits next to a 600 watt bass combo.

Only 600 ? Get up a collection that guy and get him for a real bass amp ... only kidding but it brings the word 'detente' to mind.

We bassists actually need all that power fin reserve for clean headroom. Nothing but nothing fries bass drivers like an underpowered rig, a B string and a little extra bass boost...

[Echorec]

I use a 73 Dual Showman Reverb thru a 1x15 Fender style cab for my pedal steel rig. Much easier to lug around than a Twin. Would this be considered a half stack??

[halouis]

only ting better than a 1/2 stack is ....
.
.
.
.
.
.
... a full stack.

[JoeyV]

Anybody ever see the Stax Volt review in England video with Otis Redding ? Anyhooo...Steve Cropper is playing a plexi half stack.....gorgeous tone..best tone I had ever heard him have live on video..If I could fit a half stack in my car with my PA and all the other crap I have to bring to a gig, I would do it....I love the sound of an old Marshall set up clean...what warmth and detail....I had a JCM900 for a while back in the 90's and liked it pretty much however didnt feel it was as loud as my silver face twin...go figure...
Half stacks are cool, im just too old to lug one to a gig. So its a Princeton and a Tele for me.
J.

[genelovesjez]

I love my Marshall 1/2 stack, even at lower volumes. For me, it's all about moving some air.

[Paul in Colorado]

It all boils down to the right tools for the job. It sounds like you have the experience and knowledge to make an educated choice. As a sound guy, I've experienced too many guys with big amps in spaces where they're overkill who complain that they can't hear the vocals. It's fun to play loud, but if it detracts from the MUSIC, then what's the point?

[Marshall Thinline]

Originally Posted by Paul in Colorado

It all boils down to the right tools for the job.

Amen!!!