Tube suggestions Fender Deluxe Reverb II

[FlyingV]

I've had this amp since the mid 80's, it was made in the 70's - a Deluxe Reverb II, Rivera design as I understand. I run a EQ pedal as a boost and have a Jekyll and Hyde OD pedal. I start out with nice clean tones but after 4 or 5 tunes with the pedal it gets pretty muddy and I lose my clean sound. Is it my tubes? I want clean when I want clean. Also, any favorite tubes among you? They've never been changed since I've had the amp.

[Donnie55]

Tubes are probably a good place to start. Those are nice amps. Does it do the same thing with out the pedals? Try it without the pedals see what happens.

[FlyingV]

Thanks Donnie, I'll try to check it out without the pedals tomorrow and see...

[Dan German]

Hey, Flying V, I have the Princeton Reverb II and I have done some tube-swapping. I found EH 6V6 an improvement over stock, though I am sure there are some better tubes to be found. As far as pre-amp tubes, you can play around with different gain tubes to find the best tone for you; a big improvement is to be had by putting a good 12AT7 in V2 (I used Mullard NOS). It makes the reverb much more usable and improves the boosted tone. (PRII uses half of that tube for the boost channel; don't know about the DRII). The EH 12AT7 was awful, and the EH 12AX7s were so-so.

[FlyingV]

Thanks Dan, I appreciate the info.

[Wally]

The Rivera/Jahns FEnders were produced from '82-'85.
The 12AT7 in the DRII is the reverb tube with no other function. IN the Princeton REverb II and the Super Champ II, that 12AT7 in V2 is the reverb tube, and when the 'lead' function is chosen this tube's output is used as the gain stage for that funciton. That explains how the reverb signal is almost completely defeated when the 'lead' function is operative in these two amps.

[FlyingV]

Well, at Donnie's suggestion I cranked it up without pedals for a good while this afternoon (after the wife left the house) and it didn't muddy up as it has in times past, so where does that leave me? I'll gig with it tomorrow night in my usual fashion - we'll see how it does - of course with the pedals. Perhaps I should plan to change tubes anyway, so any suggestions for tubes and their characteristics would be appreciated.

[Thin69]

Hi,

If you have had this amp since the mid eighties it is very important to change all the electrolytic capacitors. If the electrolytic are indeed 25 years old or older you are skating on thin ice at this point. Electrolytes typically short out as they dry out and depending where they are in the power supply can take out a lot of expensive components.

I would take care of the electrolytics before doing anything else to the amp if not already taken care of.

Good Luck :)

[Wally]

Flying V, ime that amp has a huge variety of gain levels available. IT will do BF Fender reverb sonics, it will do tweed sonics, and it will do high gain sonics...all in the tube domain and without pedals.
The electrolytics in these amsp are getting to the point where one might have cause for concern at some point. Ime, they are not quite at the end of their useful life.....that is, I doubt if they are exhibiting sings of weakness. Within the next 5 years or so I would expect that they might show some signs. AND I am a bit fanatical about electrolytics...

[FlyingV]

Wally, could you elaborate on what you said about the gain levels. Also, as far as changing tubes, what's your choices and why?

[Dan German]

Well, my 12AT7 suggestion is irrelevant for your boost (thanks for the clarification, Wally) but I found that it also made the reverb much more usable. Not that you mentioned any dissatisfaction with it on your DRII.

[Wally]

Flying V, these Rivera/Jahns Fenders have a preamp gain control, a Lead function with Lead Master volume and a Master volume. I forget if the DRII has a Mid boost pull switch, but I am thinking that it does.
With the preamp in the lower range, these amps can yield very good BF FEnder reverb sonics....even do surf well. IF you defeat the reverb, pump up the preamp gain and pull the Mid boost, you will find yourself in Tweed FEnder territory.
IF you switch in the Lead funciton, you will enter high-gain territory. 10 on the preamp gain with the Lead fucntion switched 'on' will yield all-tube, hi-gain sonics. Imho, far better than any SS pedal. Just my experience and my preferences. The pedal would make this switching easier, but it is all accessable with pull switches on the front panel.
I find these amps to be the most versatile that Fender ever built. BEing handwired tagboards, they would be very costly to buy new IF anyone were building something like them. Rivera offers amps that have this versatility. They are made relatively affordable by using PCB construction methods.

[FlyingV]

Thanks to all for the info. Where can I get a footswitch, I understand they can be costly. Also, I've pulled the original speaker and put in a Vox 12" out of a Super Beatle cab I used to have, much heavier than the original, but what effect would this have - it sounds fine, but could this cause the amp to muddy up after it's been driven hard?

[Wally]

V, google 'footswtich for Rivera Fender amps' or something like that....IIRC seomone is building them up for about $45.
Speaker.....if that Celestion out of that Vox is silver and has the picture of a Bulldog on the magnet cover, you have a very nice speaker there. IT is a Celestion Alnico G12....very desirable and quite valuable as far as speakers go. I don't know if I would risk it in that amp. The wattage capacity of that speaker might be less than the DRII puts out...or it could be somewhere near the output. I like to run speakers that have a bit more capacity than the amp has output. You might make note of the codes on the speaker cone and such. That is of interest.
Regarding speakers, I like the sound of a good Alnico in these amps. The Alnico magnet smooths out the highs especially in the distorion modes. I run Eminence Alnico's in my Super Champs. Weber builds a great Alnico speaker, also.

[FlyingV]

Wally, yea it's the silver speaker with the dog on the label - I've got 4 of them. I'll check the codes. $45 sounds good for that switch if I can locate one - thanks.

[Wally]

Flying V, that is a great speaker.

[Dan German]

voodooman makes nice sturdy footswitches for that amp. I paid about $45 for mine, but when I looked them up the other day the prices appeared higher. I bought on ebay but direct from voodooman. Here's the switch you want:

http://tinyurl.com/yftv7xy

edit: Mine didn't come with cables. In the long run, this is cheaper (I don't know what the 7 pin cable is for...)

[FlyingV]

Thanks for the tip on the switch, Dan. Wally, I also have the horns that came in that cab, I wonder about building a cabinet with a 2-12 /1 horn configuation using the extra vox speakers - of course I'd have to pick up a head of some type... Don't know if the horn would be desirable

[Wally]

HOrns are good for full-frequency sytems....keyboards and PA's. I don't particularly enjoy them for guitar. YMMV.

[FlyingV]

I did a little gig with the DRII last night (about an hour), using pedals for leeds, ran at 6; it seemed the little jewel got louder, definitely more distorted, half way into the gig - I'm talking just the straight amp - pedals off. Is that possible, if so what made it do that?

[Wally]

Take all pedals out of the chain and run the amp for an extended time to see if it repeats that symptom. I never trust or make any analysis of a problem until there is nothing between the guitar and the amp except one cable. IF the problem is in the amp, it could be any number of things....tubes, resistor, cap... ONe might wonder if the voltage supply at the wall 'shifted', even.

[FlyingV]

Thanks Wally, I'll check it out.