Not a Bassman Man

[Mik]

I've concluded I'm not a tweed Bassman man.

I've auditioned narrow panel tweed Bassman's over the years, vintage real ones and reissues.

None of them did much for me. Of course if they could talk they'd say the same about my playing.

Anyway I checked out a Fender RI yesterday, low asking price-it was a conversion to head and cab with the 4 old oem blue frame alnico speakers-the sonic results were similar to all the other Bassmans I've played, including a '56 Bassman I nearly bought last year.

Kinda like how a friend described Kubrick's last flick Eyes Wide Shut-not commerical enough, not artistic enough. Doesn't quite work as a popular commercial film or art film.

I'm thinking Deluxe or Champ when I'm thinking tweed. Bassman is nowhere near those kinds of amps. Doesn't have the clarity of a narrow panel Deluxe
at low volume, or the feral growl and anarchic roar of a Deluxe at high volume. No sag and bloom with the Bassman's GZ34 rectifier either.

Just not very dynamic amps. Dull sounding at low and medium volumes, farty bass and muddy at high volume. Yes I adjusted tone controls including the mid.

None of the sparkle and punch of a blackface Super Reverb, a BFSR has the
3D magic that fills a room at any volume.

I'm glad that Fender moved on to AB763 circuitry, just a few years after Fender discontinued the tweed Bassman. I doubt if anyone in the 60s was crying about the end of the tweed amp era, anyway.

[imsilly]

I have had the same experiences with vintage bassman amp, but I put it down to not finding the right one.

I have had more luck with Deluxes and their clones.

[stantheman]

I came to the conclusion that what really makes bigger Tweed Amps and their Marshall cousins "legendary" is/was their ability to assimilate with Stomp Boxes.

Your thread has also defined - to me at least - that the Marshall 1974x is "Marshall's Tweed Deluxe", so Thank You.

[backalleyblues]

Hmm, always liked my '59 Bassman (when I had it!) just it was too danged loud for the kind of gigs I was playing (not to mention a real pain to take on the bus! ) Different strokes and all, I guess...

Played through a Marshall 1974x this past weekend-not my cuppa either (too much mids, no bass for my taste) but I can see why people like them so much... I liked it a lot better than any other Marshall I've plugged into...

Franc Robert

[Jakedog]

Originally Posted by Mik

I've concluded I'm not a tweed Bassman man.

I've auditioned narrow panel tweed Bassman's over the years, vintage real ones and reissues.

None of them did much for me. Of course if they could talk they'd say the same about my playing.

Anyway I checked out a Fender RI yesterday, low asking price-it was a conversion to head and cab with the 4 old oem blue frame alnico speakers-the sonic results were similar to all the other Bassmans I've played, including a '56 Bassman I nearly bought last year.

Kinda like how a friend described Kubrick's last flick Eyes Wide Shut-not commerical enough, not artistic enough. Doesn't quite work as a popular commercial film or art film.

I'm thinking Deluxe or Champ when I'm thinking tweed. Bassman is nowhere near those kinds of amps. Doesn't have the clarity of a narrow panel Deluxe
at low volume, or the feral growl and anarchic roar of a Deluxe at high volume. No sag and bloom with the Bassman's GZ34 rectifier either.

Just not very dynamic amps. Dull sounding at low and medium volumes, farty bass and muddy at high volume. Yes I adjusted tone controls including the mid.

None of the sparkle and punch of a blackface Super Reverb, a BFSR has the
3D magic that fills a room at any volume.

I'm glad that Fender moved on to AB763 circuitry, just a few years after Fender discontinued the tweed Bassman. I doubt if anyone in the 60s was crying about the end of the tweed amp era, anyway.

THANK YOU! You've just described every experience I've ever had trying to play through a Bassman. People call me crazy for not liking these amps, but I swear, they just don't sound good.

[Teleglide]

In my experience they vary a lot. I have a 1957 dual rectifier Bassman with 4 Kendrick 10's that sounds fantastic (I'm not the only one who thinks so) but it's loud. I prefer to use my BFDR in general.

The newer Bassmans (Bassmen?) sound more sterile to me, although I've never tried a Victoria, which I've heard is great.

My '57 seems to have a sweet spot with the volume on about 3 - any lower and it's not cookin', higher and it gets mushy. It's loud on three!

[tazzboy]

What guitar are you play through the bassman?

[OaklandA]

different strokes and all that. I'm sure Fender will still do all right selling them. Somebody sure likes them.

I'm pretty much off the tweed sound altogether after a roller coaster romance with Champs, Deluxes, etc. I've decided as far as Fenders go, I'm pretty much either a Blonde or Blackface guy.

[Mik]

Originally Posted by tazzboy

What guitar are you play through the bassman?

Tele, Strat. Single coil.

[stevieboy]

Seems to be the go to harmonica amp, at least around these parts.

[Ben Harmless]

Being a Bassman Man, I can still totally see it.

The Bassman is one of those amps that requires you to play the amp a lot. I don't mean to say that people who don't like them aren't fine players, just that playing a Telecaster through a Bassman is like sticking your thumb over the nozzle of a garden hose - it's gonna get crazy, you've got to concentrate on something a little different, and in the end, you're probably just going to end up soaking wet.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's kind of a beast of it's own, and I can totally see how some folks wouldn't feel compelled to tame it. I mean, if you train an elephant, you then have to take care of an elephant. It might not be quite what you were imagining when you went to circus school.

I'm probably the opposite. Blackface Fenders hold my attention for about 30 seconds. They're just way too controllable.

Of course, I still don't own one, but every time I've had the opportunity to crank one up, I've grinned and had to go home and make sure I still like my Marshalls.

[3 Chord]

We all like different stuff. I sold an original 1965 BF Vibrolux in excellent condition (really it was) and replaced it with my PV C30 in 1993. Never once missed the Vibrolux.

For some the amp I sold would be the end-all.

p.s., I think bassman RI's are pretty cool.

[Bob Arbogast]

After trying out a friend's reissue, I've started to like, and maybe even get the hang of, the 5F6-A Bassman. Good thing, because I just finished one of my own. (It still needs a few tweaks.) I've been plugging my Strat straight into the Normal channel. Volume: 8-9, Treble: 1 (=off), Bass: 4, Midrange: 7, Presence: 4. Monday night, I'll get to try it live at the local blues jam.

Bob

[tazzboy]

I had an early reissue and wasn't in the last bit impress with it at all. It practically stay clean even when I crank it up. I try one original and it was OK but I stay went with current amp the Vox Night Train.

[tomfarnan]

When I bought my 52 RI tele I played it through a 57 bassman RI. I thought it should have been a match made in heaven - it just sounded dead and dull to me. To date the amps that I've loved playing through have been a 67 BFDR (mine :)) and a 65 BF Princeton Reverb - hopefully I'll have one of these soon. A low powered tweed twin was a nice thing to run but too powerful for the room I was in by far. Sounded awesome at lowish volumes for country picking though. It had heaps more warmth than any of the bassman RI's I've tried. Buuuuut ... the Victoria clip of a Bassman on their ws is still my favourite Victoria clip - if I could get that chicken pickin' tele sound I'd be happy! http://victoriaamp.com/amps.html?model=45410

[T Prior]

I certainly would not argue that the 4x10 Bassman amps are different,they are and they are loud. That being said they are not for everyone. The lower wattage single 12 amps can really attract a bigger crowd and are much easier to tame on the bandstand. BUT, I still think in the long run, getting to know the Bassman and your axe on weekly gigs, you will find your way. I don't think it's possible to plug into one at GC and be thrilled for life . For me, the 4x10 configuration at around 40/60 watts is the "one" amp solution if you can only own one amp. But I don't own one, I think they are way overpriced, that's my beef !

[Doc]

Hum ... to each there own. I am a tweed fan, and like my Deluxe and Bassman LTD. I have not found it lifeless. It is a different amp in how it plays and in design than the Deluxe. But, you need the setting to play the Bassman like a Deluxe. Someplace where loud if acceptable. For me my small Gretsch 6150 (rehoused in a 1x12) for the tweedy style 5w, the Deluxe and the Bassman LTD and finally the Traynor Bass Master II (90w) all in same family really cover about everything I want these days. These and my pedal board and I am ready for nearly anything.

[Ricky D.]

Originally Posted by Bob Arbogast

After trying out a friend's reissue, I've started to like, and maybe even get the hang of, the 5F6-A Bassman. Good thing, because I just finished one of my own. (It still needs a few tweaks.) I've been plugging my Strat straight into the Normal channel. Volume: 8-9, Treble: 1 (=off), Bass: 4, Midrange: 7, Presence: 4. Monday night, I'll get to try it live at the local blues jam.

Bob

That's some nice work there, Bob. Let us know what you think after your jam.

[Justinvs]

I used to play bass through a bassman head. Loved the tone I got. Never really had a chance to play a 6-stringer through it, though. It belonged to the guitar player and I only used it at gigs.

Justin

[Ricky D.]

Bob, how did it go at the jam?

[stantheman]

Originally Posted by Justinvs

I used to play bass through a bassman head. Loved the tone I got. Never really had a chance to play a 6-stringer through it, though. It belonged to the guitar player and I only used it at gigs.

Justin

Two completely different critters Sir.

I've been thinking about changing The Baffle on my first year Reissue to a single 15" because it might work well with the Re-Issue's "crispness" but there's a serious problem; "the Committee" kept the ONE absolutely Universally reviled feature of the Narrow Panel '59 - they kept the 4 RCA Plugs for the Speakers instead of using the much more sane 1/4" socket.
One thing about "Design Committees" whether it's Automobiles, Amplifiers, or Guitars - there are always concessions to the egos of the members and so everything ends up in a state of mediocrity.
Coldly Biased...yeah right...something like that.

[Pepi]

I really don't like a Bassman either. I will say they sound better in a mix than the "Home alone" playing.

[EunosFD]

I happen to really dig the sound of my early BMRI, but it's tough to get it cooking without blowing the windows (and my eardrums) out. I've had mine running with JJ's 6v6's & a 5u4 rectifier for about 2yrs now and while it's only around 20w (give or take) it's still quite loud. I'm heavily contemplating swapping it for a Vox AC4TV head/cab though.

[07 road house]

I believe that the Bassman amp has the best tone that I have ever heard. But that is my opinion.

[stratohiker]

Played a stock RI at a country/southern rock gig a couple months back with a Texas Tele and a Strat w/HBs..........great sound.....had a TS Turbo for dirt....jumped the channels, plugged into the normal 1 jack......had a blast....
Amp seemed very responsive and lively.....you definitely had to "control" it.
I played it at length at the house with no pedals in front and loved it there as well. At the country gig, the main singer/other guitar player was using a SF 68 Super w/Emi drivers........The Tweed BM was a nice compliment.....
Also played another gig a week later......power trio, classic rock, etc....
Also, good results......just not quite enuff gain available for some tunes with the TS Turbo.......probably cuz, I wasn't able to turn the BM up enuff to get that TS/Amp distorted thing goin' to the full degree.....

[stratohiker]

Might I add that since Marshalls evolved from this circuit, and many of you guys tout the virtues of BF (luv them myself ;-) , maybe it's only natural you wouldn't care for this Bassman circuit...........and, as has been said, the other Tweeds are different than the Tweed BM in question.......
Just sayin'...........

[Wally]

I have heard 5F6A circuits that were magnificent and I have heard the same circuit sound worse than the worst Ss amp that you could imagine. IF an amp is not set-up well, it won't yield good sonics. IT takes no time at all to make some adjustments that will make a good sounding amp into a bad sounding one.

Stantheman, one other problem with going to a 15" woud be the impedance matching.
You coudl order a 4 ohm 15" and that mismatch might work, but I wouldn't put and 8 ohm load on an OT designed for the 2 ohm load of a tweed BAssman circuit.

Bob Arbogast, nice looking work.

[Bob Arbogast]

I took my new-built Bassman out to the local blues jam on Monday night. It kept me smiling. The rig was Fralin-equipped Strat ---> Silver LTD ---> amp. I plugged into Normal input #1; Volume at 9-10, Treble at 1 (off), Bass at 4, Midrange at 8, Presence at 4. LTD: Volume at 12:00, Tone at 10:00, Gain at 9:00. I toggled the LTD on and off. Does that sound loud? Well, bear in mind that, unlike the stock Bassman RI and many other 5F6-A clones, I am running a 12AY7 in V1, not a 5751 or a 12AX7. Also unlike the Bassman RI, I am running 5881 rather than 6L6GC output tubes. And unlike the Bassman RI, I have voltage-adjusted power transformer for B+=450Vdc rather than the RI's 490Vdc!

The basic sound was punchy and clean, with just the beginning of break-up. With the LTD engaged I had a nice overdrive. With this rig, I was able to sit well in the mix and then come out on top for solos -- without going over the top! And my Strat sounded ever so Strat-like (FYI, I have a 3-position pickup selector; in-between positions need not apply!).

I'm ready to give it another spin next Monday.

Thanks for asking . . .

Bob Arbogast

[tazzboy]

Originally Posted by Bob Arbogast

I took my new-built Bassman out to the local blues jam on Monday night. It kept me smiling. The rig was Fralin-equipped Strat ---> Silver LTD ---> amp. I plugged into Normal input #1; Volume at 9-10, Treble at 1 (off), Bass at 4, Midrange at 8, Presence at 4. LTD: Volume at 12:00, Tone at 10:00, Gain at 9:00. I toggled the LTD on and off. Does that sound loud? Well, bear in mind that, unlike the stock Bassman RI and many other 5F6-A clones, I am running a 12AY7 in V1, not a 5751 or a 12AX7. Also unlike the Bassman RI, I am running 5881 rather than 6L6GC output tubes. And unlike the Bassman RI, I have voltage-adjusted power transformer for B+=450Vdc rather than the RI's 490Vdc!

The basic sound was punchy and clean, with just the beginning of break-up. With the LTD engaged I had a nice overdrive. With this rig, I was able to sit well in the mix and then come out on top for solos -- without going over the top! And my Strat sounded ever so Strat-like (FYI, I have a 3-position pickup selector; in-between positions need not apply!).

I'm ready to give it another spin next Monday.

Thanks for asking . . .

Bob Arbogast

Hey Bob

what rectifier are you using in your bassman 5U4 or a GZ34?

[Bob Arbogast]

Originally Posted by tazzboy

Hey Bob

what rectifier are you using in your bassman 5U4 or a GZ34?

Sovtek 5AR4 (GZ34).

[tazzboy]

I'm surprise that you got the amp to distort some.

[Wally]

Originally Posted by tazzboy

I'm surprise that you got the amp to distort some.

Why is that, Tazz?

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Originally Posted by 07 road house

I believe that the Bassman amp has the best tone that I have ever heard. But that is my opinion.

I have to agree w you on that one.

I LOVE a cranked to " 10 " Bassman, both the Tweed family of Bassman, aswell as the AB165 model

Everyone elses MMV

[SirJackdeFuzz]

http://www.soundclick.com/player/sin...&q=hi&newref=1

SG -->Bassman

(Rat used for leads)

Bassman sounds pretty good to me !

[giginthesky]

sirjack, i assume you were in the middle of a wide open field to get that sound. me likes.

[tazzboy]

Originally Posted by Wally

Why is that, Tazz?

Cause I have read http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinti...ectifiers.html

[SirJackdeFuzz]

Originally Posted by giginthesky

sirjack, i assume you were in the middle of a wide open field to get that sound. me likes.

Funny that you should say that !

I do not gig, but we do jam every weekend on a farm, and the old workshop (airplane hanger) is far away from the farm house.

Sadly, that clip is not mine

. . . but i get the same tone on my Bassman now

[Wally]

Originally Posted by tazzboy

Cause I have read http://www.guitaramplifierblueprinti...ectifiers.html

Tazz, nowhere in there do I read anything that would lead me to come to the conclusion that the use of a GZ34 would preclude the possibility of an amp distorting. THe article does note that even the GZ34, with the least voltage drop of the tube recitifers, would yield more compression and sag and therefore smoother distortion than the same circuit with solid state rectification.
IF you are comparing the 5U4 to the GZ34 (you asked Bob which he was using), then the 5U4 will compress and sag to a greater degree than the GZ34. I don't think the point of distortion would be any different as long as the current draw/bias settings were simular. THe same goes when comparing the SS to the GZ34....the GZ34 will compress a bit more WHEN the distortion does occur...but the distortion will occur.
The one aspect of the amp that would be affected would be the voltage to the preamp tubes, and that voltage affects the bias of those tubes, which are cathode biased. Higher voltages there do cause later break up, but we might be talking a few volts and the effect might be very small.
IME, a 5F6A set up as Bob has set his up will distort with the volume at 9-10 on the dial.....and distort very well depending on what guitar one has running through it. A good humbucker will get it singing for sure ime. We might take note that Bob is running a voltage adjusted PT, which takes todays higher voltage out of the wall and provides voltages that are akin to those of the vintage PT's on the lower wall voltages that were prevalent back then. Those voltages will affect distortion points as well. 'brown sound'....indeed.

By the way, ???9-10??? IF we are reading a 'clock' here instead of the numbers that Leo used, then that is way too low for me. LOL I like to hear a TWeed turned up. Then I know it will distort, and I can use my guitar's volume pot and my pick attack more fully. This yields a wider range of dynamic response, imho, with richer harmonics when the player uses a lighter touch and/or lower guitar output. This also exhibits one thing I like about tube rectifiers. Tehy compress and keep an amp from creating those sharp peaks of volume....clean tones and distorted tones are more nearly the same volume in effect.

[Bob Arbogast]

Good post, Wally. By the way, when I say 9-10, I don't mean "o'clock"; I mean 9-10 out of the 1-12 on the dial!

Two other notes on this amp:

My first reaction was that the amp is very bright, almost excessively so. Hence the Treble control turned off. But fooling around with the four different tone knobs, I have found lots of great sounds with those knobs at many different settings. The Midrange setting has a significant effect on the brightness of the amp.

And this: I am really happy with the new Jensen C10Q speakers. To my ears they have a great, Jensen-y tone. I understand they take a good while to break in, so perhaps I'll be hearing even better things in a few months. But so far I like them a lot.

Bob Arbogast

[Wally]

Bob, you are a man who wants to hear that amp! Kudos.