Fender vs. Marshall

[Justinvs]

No, this isn't one of those 'let's pick a bar fight' sort of question, just pure curiosity. I've been bit by the Marshall bug, (never had one, always wanted one) and I've been giving some serious thought to selling my old Super Reverb and buying a stack.

Part of the reason is I worry about gigging on a vintage amp and wrecking it, especially as it's already worth more than I could afford to replace, so buying a newer amp, less collectable amp would make sense. But the down side is I love the way the old beast sounds. And, sadly, keeping both isn't really in the budget, (at least according to my wife. She thinks food and bills and such takes precedence over guitars. Hmmmph!)

So, objectively, how do all of you feel the 100 watt Marshall compares to the SR? I generally play classic rock and country/blues kind of stuff. Any opinions greatly welcome.

[Hecks]

If it's a vintage SR don't try and sell it now. The market is really awful for sellers. Gigging a vintage is fine as long as the thing isn't a museum piece. I'd say stick with the SR. Especially if your playing country or blues.

Why do you think you'd need a 100w Marshall? Is the SR not keeping up?

[Justinvs]

Oh, I don't _need_ a Marshall, just a case of wanting one. You know how it is, every so often a person gets the itch to try something different. I've played the same SR for more than twenty years, and always wanted to own a stack.

Thanks for the tip about the market!

[wierdOne]

Stick with the Super Reverb.... hand wired... awesome amps.... EASY for a tech to repair...

IF you're looking into getting into the marshall sound... Try a vintage bassman head... you'd be surprised how great they are... and cheap... The original marshall circuit was based off of the Bassman circuit (if i remember correctly)...

oh... the best "marshall" type amp i ever played was an 18 watt Reinhart head..... awesome... VERY awesome amp..... try one of those out...

but... 100 watts isn't necessarily going to be that much louder than your 40 watt Super Reverb....... it's just going to respond differently.... but, try a bassman out.... still get the great fender clean channel, with the marshall like high gain channel...... of course.. you won't get eddie van halen with a bassman... but it's kind of a best of both worlds type thing....

or... you can look into modding your super reverb's high gain circuit... there's a ton of options....

I'm not a fender snob by any stretch of the imagination... in fact... I think the two amps that every guitar player should have are not produced by fender at all...

[KC]

I ask myself, Self, where does a 46-year-old guy from Montana get to play a 100-watt marshall with the master volume set anywhere past .005? That's an awful lot of amp for the clubs I play. That's also an awful lot of amp to tote around (on the ice, in cowboy boots, in February).

I'd hold on to the Super and get your Marshall fix some other way. I had a 50-watt 2x12 combo that I let go for pretty cheap a while ago -- they're out there if you look. If it was me, I'd get a Ceriatone 18-watt clone and a 2x12 from Avatar or someplace -- but maybe you really do need all that power. Why?

[Durtdog]

I'd keep the Super, you may regret selling it some day.

Can't comment on the 100-watt Marshall, but I had a Bluesbreaker (Marshall, not a clone) that I used for several years with a band. I played a lot of small clubs, and I could turn it up pretty far...not enough to completely overdrive it, but it gave absolutely stunningly good-sounding cleans, which is mostly how I play anyway. You can jump the channels and get some grit out of it if you want. One of the best sounding amps I've ever used, and I've been a lifelong Fender amp user.

[ThermionicScott]

I'll second the 18-watt. Won't sound exactly like a wound-up Super Lead, but they do make some good Marshall sounds!

- Scott

[charlie cash]

But the down side is I love the way the old beast sounds.

I think you answered your own question. You will regret selling the SR.

[ehren]

The Vintage Modern series are the most "useable" Marshall's I've come across. The 50w head is the most forgiving as far as giving up the goods at reasonable volume. It has two different voiced gain stages, one gives you classic vintage Plexi tones and the other gives a 70s hot-rod Marshall tone. Runs on kt66s and you can get lots, and lots of different classic Marshall tones out of it.

[OaklandA]

Where do you play that you'll need a 100 watt anything? A 100 watt Marshall is freaking, insanely loud.

The 18 watt suggestions are right on point, or if you are palying larger venues a Bluesbreaker would do it too, or another JTM-45 type amp.

I suggest a Winfield which isn't a clone but gets you in the exact same territory, but there are a lot of good clones out there.

[Wally]

weird one wrote: "IF you're looking into getting into the marshall sound... Try a vintage bassman head... you'd be surprised how great they are... and cheap... The original marshall circuit was based off of the Bassman circuit (if i remember correctly."

Just to keep things on the straight and narrow...
There is only one BAssman head that is related to the classic...first...Marshall.
And...that one amp is probably the rarest FEnder amp ever built. It is a 5F6A chassis in a head and cabinet form...built as a custom order. The ASpen Pittman books have it pictured in their gallery. You can't miss it. IT is the only tweed head/cabinet ever built.
The 6g66G6A, 6G6B Bassman amps and the Bf BAssmans that followed do not have a lot in common with the 5F6a Bassman. The 5F6A 4X10 Combo tweed amp is the blueprint for the first Marshall amps.
I suggest keeping the SR. You can modify either channel to yield a gainer and middier sounding amp. Use and A/B pedal and have a swticher.

[Rocks]

I would say before you even think about selling an amp you already know you love, why not rent a Marshall for a weekend? Also, 100 watts of Marshall sound can kill small animals and injure children at up to 100 yards. A full Marshall stack is way too loud by the time you hit that sweet spot. Even a 50 watt half stack is very loud at the sweet spot.

[Telarkaster]

Apples and Oranges, like the Fender vs Gibson debate.

Personally, the Super Reverb is one of my Holy Grail amps. I'm sure you're bored with it but I don't think you know how lucky you are to have and play through one. One of the best clean sounds ever. That and a Twin.

Marshalls are awesome. Too bad you can't have both. I play a Super Lead at the practice studio and I always leave smiling. Stunned, but smiling. Life is short, you should at least try one for a while. Good idea by Rocks to rent one. If you show your wife how much you love it she might let you keep it! If you play classic rock then it should be up your alley, either 50w or 100w.

If you can carry a Super Reverb, then you can handle a 100w head and cab.

[Justinvs]

Originally Posted by KC

I ask myself, Self, where does a 46-year-old guy from Montana get to play a 100-watt marshall with the master volume set anywhere past .005? That's an awful lot of amp for the clubs I play. That's also an awful lot of amp to tote around (on the ice, in cowboy boots, in February). ?

Sounds like we've played the same clubs. Especially the part of slipping around on the ice in February! :)

In all honesty, volume has never been a problem with the SR, in fact just the opposite. If I've ever had a complaint about the amp it's that it sounds thin at low volumes, which unfortunately is where I have to set it to keep from blowing the rest of the instruments out. It would be nice to have something with a master volume/gain control, but beyond that, you're right. The SR has always been way more than I need as far as output goes.

justin

[Tim Armstrong]

Originally Posted by Justinvs

Sounds like we've played the same clubs. Especially the part of slipping around on the ice in February! :)

In all honesty, volume has never been a problem with the SR, in fact just the opposite. If I've ever had a complaint about the amp it's that it sounds thin at low volumes, which unfortunately is where I have to set it to keep from blowing the rest of the instruments out. It would be nice to have something with a master volume/gain control, but beyond that, you're right. The SR has always been way more than I need as far as output goes.

justin

Well, there you go. Forget about getting an actual 100-watt Marshall stack!

But that doesn't mean you have to forget about getting an amp that gets those kinds of tones at more sane volume levels (with the added advantage of being easier to load-in/load out!). Amps based on the 18-watt Marshall are particularly good, that way, but there are plenty of cool amps that cop that vibe...

I wouldn't sell the SR, though. There are ways of saving up gear money, one effective thing that I'm doing is taking any ones and fives left in my wallet at the end of the day and putting them aside to go into my savings account. Another way to accumulate money for me: I never, ever use coins, and all the coins I get in change go into the big pretzel jar, which goes into my savings account whenever it gets full.

You have to be creative!

Cheers, Tim

[Guitar_Ninja]

How dare you want to purchase a 100W amp. You should turn yourself into police so you can be properly prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

[Rocks]

Originally Posted by Justinvs

Sounds like we've played the same clubs. Especially the part of slipping around on the ice in February! :)

In all honesty, volume has never been a problem with the SR, in fact just the opposite. If I've ever had a complaint about the amp it's that it sounds thin at low volumes, which unfortunately is where I have to set it to keep from blowing the rest of the instruments out. It would be nice to have something with a master volume/gain control, but beyond that, you're right. The SR has always been way more than I need as far as output goes.

justin

Right there is why you shouldn't even think about 100 watts, even the 50 would give you the same issues playing out. An 18 watter is exactly what you should try out. Also, I might get flamed for this but I don't like master volumes. They only help with more preamp over drive and you miss out on the rich harmonics of overdriven power amps tubes and the sag of the rectifier. One more reason to look at the 18 watter. Like I said before, see if you can rent or borrow one for a weekend before you even think about selling the fender. It would suck to sell it and realize it was a mistake.

Rocks

[evol04gt]

i keep my jcm 900 set at the 50 watt setting and i RARELY have the volume above 2. the jcm900 1960 cab i think provides great tone. same reason the fender bassman amps and super six and twin amps get such good tone.. big warm speakers. i ran my ad30vt through the mashall cab and oh my god a world of difference.

the jcm is a really really bright amp and the gain is insane on the overdrive channel-a good bluesy rock tone is about 7 of 20 with a single coil guitar.

i really really want to get my hands on a super reverb- i could have, but i bought my g400 and digital 8track instead... sigh.

[tele0053]

I've had lotsa' fenders and marshalls if your really jonesin' for a marshall, try a jcm 800 50 watt head with the reverb channel, and master volume. they made those back in the mid to early '80's and when you use 'em with a sealed back 4x10 marshall type cab with celestions these are real pleasin' to fender lovers looking for the sound with more grit and honky midrange sustain (bluesbreaker claptonish) than a super and a lot of fun ta' boot, the 4x12 cabs don't work at all for me, but the 4x10 cabs are a whole different animal IMHO. I highly recommend that setup, not real good for the tight clean fender sound... but great for what it sounds your hankerin' for.
good luck

[Durtdog]

Originally Posted by Rocks

Right there is why you shouldn't even think about 100 watts, even the 50 would give you the same issues playing out. An 18 watter is exactly what you should try out.

I have an 18-watter now that I use for some gigs. It is not similar to the Bluesbreaker I had before. The 18 has very little head room, and is not capable of any clean tones with a full band.

These threads always go the same way, "You don't need and shouldn't have anything over 12-15 watts, that would be ridiculous. No one can play a bigger amp cuz it's too loud." Well, my car will go 140 mph, but that doesn't mean I drive it that fast.

People around here will hint pretty strongly that you're an immature idiot if you want anything more. I sometimes feel like a fish swimming upstream, but if you want any clean head room, you need more watts. If you just want to dime it and play creamy overdrive, get a low wattage amp, an 18 watter will do Marshall cream very well...but not much else.