Kit Kwality Kwestions

[bradpdx]

The current crop of kit amps/parts is very tempting. It is now possible to get all those "hard to find" parts like steel chassises and good cabinets at very reasonable prices, which means that one no longer has to butcher older amps in order to put together a new one.

Thus inspired, I am looking to build some new amps this summer. I have several designs of my own I wish to use, as well as a jones for a straight out 5E3. For my own designs a "generic" BF Princeton chassis would be just fine, I can do the rest.

My question for TDPRI is: what is the assessment of parts quality among these various kit providers? Weber looks inexpensive but very flexible (many a la carte options) and there are kits from Mission, Allen, Torres and others.

Who here has built kits from these suppliers? Opinions, raves and rants accepted.

[RomanS]

I only have experience with Weber, built the 6M45 (a JTM45 clone):

-) Weber kits are not exact clones down to the finest details of the models they are based upon.

-) Weber kits don't come with any instructions, you'll only find the layout and schematic on their webpage.

-) They have a GREAT online forum with many knowledgeable and helpful people that will really try to help you if you run into problems when building. Ted Weber himself is also pretty quick when it comes to answering questions sent to him via e-mail.

-) A lot of parts on their kits are used across various models - with the result that sometimes you'll have to make them fit - e.g I had to slightly cut down the edge of the main board on my 6M45, because it simply wouldn't fit besides the filter cap board, had to drill different mounting holes for the choke, small stuff like that; nothing that couldn't be solved with a bit of thinking and some tools, but if you want something to be perfect right out of the box, you might not be 100% happy with a Weber kit.

-) The pots that came with the kit felt really cheap, I replaced them with better ones.

-) All in all, after some tweaking to fit my personal taste, this Weber JTM45-clone is the best-sounding amp I've ever played (for reference purposes: I have no experience with expensive "boutique" amps - just with the average stuff like contemporary Fender reissue tube amps, Peavey Classic 30, Carvin, Vox AC30CC, mainstream stuff like that; it also sound s better than the '90s Marshall Bluesbreaker reissue combo a friend of mine owns - he's of the same opinion, BTW).

[bradpdx]

Roman, thanks. I am not at all worried about "exact clones", but rather having some quality parts to work with.

I am an electronics sort of guy, so design and building is just fun. But in the past the challenge has often been to get/make the things I cannot do my myself, mainly involving metal and woodwork. I can solder all day long, but I cannot fabricate a chassis or build a good pine cabinet. Nor do I wish to do so.

It sounds like your experience was overall good, and the adjustments you made reasonable for the price.

[jh45gun]

I never bought a kit but the parts I ordered from Weber to save some money as they were cheaper in price and Weber had the choke I needed for my tweed build so I figure I saved on shipping too since I would not have to order from two places. Well I suppose this is going to sound like a broken record as I have stated this before but the pots had cheap nuts they broke when tightend down and I do not mean torked down either. Plus the pots did not all come close on the meter either so they were not well matched. The knobs were cracked and I complained and they sent out two more right away so I cannot complain about their service but them knobs were cracked too. :( I only hope their choke is good and since I am having problems with my build I am not sure about that. One cap blew that was connected to the choke and I saw one of my ground wires from the cap was touching the input jack as my board is in a not for a 5f4 chasssis but some guys at the gear page said having the ground wire touch the jack should not blow the cap so I do not know what my issues are but I hope it is not the choke as that is in the circuit.

[Lance]

Everything in my Mission kit was really nice, well packaged and laid out. The wiring was the plastic coated stuff in colors to match the diagram....not cloth covered. In reality, as this was my first kit, having colored wires, instead of cloth, made the assembly and checking much easier. Anyway, I highly recommend Mission.

[getbent]

I built a weber 5f2a kit. I intentionally left it completely stock... didn't add anything nor subtract any part. I built it as shipped and it is a great amp.

everyone's points about flimsiness etc are true. I don't gig this amp, but it is my main bench amp and it has taken a lickin' and kept on tickin'.

[Scott S]

I built my 5E7 clone from a Weber kit, and it has been solid enough, and worked fine* with all of the Chinese components. I didn't like the feel of the tube sockets, though. The rough casting and thin metal for the contacts were turnoffs -- I'll probably replace them with good old American ones eventually. One of the octal tube clips snapped, but that was my fault...

- Scott

* Even after double-checking my wiring, the Presence control doesn't seem to do much. But I'm told the real ones didn't either.

[tele-martini]

Built a 5E3 clone from a Marsh kit recently. Quality of cabinet,components was good. Price was fair. Documentation was terrible IMO. Layout drawing was just plain wrong in a few instances. Instruction booklet was hard to follow and had blurry photos. Just my $.02
Gene

[bradpdx]

Thanks for all the information thus far. Very useful.

Parts quality is my main concern. I want to use whatever I build as a small stage amp, and so while some things don't matter (e.g., plastic vs. cloth insulation on wires) others really do (good pots, transformers, etc.)

I have enough experience that I don't need a wiring diagram from something as simple as a 5E3 - I can do that as I go without a problem.

Thanks again, I am taking notes... never heard of Marsh amps before, now I am looking at their website...

[TelZilla]

That's what I've used (mainly) for my two builds. I got some replacement CTS pots, but the switches with my Weber were Carling.

In My experience, the big money is in:

• Cabs: Weber's are great
• Speakers: Weber's are great
• Trannies: This is where the Weber brand ones are maybe a little lower quality. I use them and I love the way my amps sound, but that's really sort of a personal choice.
• Tubes- I didn't use the Weber's. A mix of JJs, Tung sols, and a coupla NOS 5Y3s. I think you can do pretty well (especially if you're into 6V6s, like me, with new production glass

Most of the other stuff doesn't cost much, even if you order the best. I like to use Hoffman Amps for components, partly bnecause he's got good stuff, but mainly to reward him for his excellent shipping time. He's lighning fast.

[maiga]

Hiya, my 2p-worth...

I built a kit from STF Electronics. I was thinking of getting a little valve amp anyway 'cos my 12W Marshall tranny amp sounds okay, but not inspiring. In the end I decided to build something based on a Tweed Champ. Not that I'd played one before (SF but not Tweed), but I thought it was a simple enough little project.

I actually found this forum on my search for info when I was trying to decide whether to build or not!

STF's Champ Head kit comes with a big instruction book, split into neat chapters (a couple of careful hours' work each), and with individual tasks. It was fine for me but I read the whole thing through before starting anything, and re-read each chapter before working through the stages. I didn't know squat about valve amps, but am quite experienced with a soldering iron.

Chassis had the big holes for the valves pre-punched. I used CAD to set up the holes for everything else, and taped a printout as a drilling guide. Again, this might be a step too far for some folks- I'm lousy at building things but happen to be a CAD draughtsman of 10 yrs experience so that I *CAN* do.

Putting it together was a joy! I had so much fun! Everything required was in the box, STF's "first run" procedure was comprehensive and safety-first. And it worked pretty much first shot. It's not the most flexible amp in the world, but it sounds GORGEOUS. Really bright and airy, haven't tried with another guitar but suits my Squier Std. Tele to a 'T'. First amp I've ever used that has NO NEED for reverb. At all.

I've made a really shoddy speaker cab with a Jensen Ceramic 8"- see pic.

In short, I'm really happy- STF are cheaper than some, as well...components are fine- ElectroHarmonix power- and pre-amp tubes and a SovTek rectifier, and Hammond trannies.

Hope this is helpful.

[DavidP]

My very first build was a Mission 5E3--top notch chassis, cab and parts, and excellent support (critical IMHO on a first build). Since then I've built a Weber Revibe, 5E5a, and 5F1, with some minor substitutions--mainly jacks and switches (one was DOA) , and used my own tubes. I'm planning on doing a brownface deluxe when Ted gets that model out. So, If you're a first time builder, I'd recommend Bruce.

[stevedenver]

Originally Posted by DavidP

My very first build was a Mission 5E3--top notch chassis, cab and parts, and excellent support (critical IMHO on a first build). Since then I've built a Weber Revibe, 5E5a, and 5F1, with some minor substitutions--mainly jacks and switches (one was DOA) , and used my own tubes. I'm planning on doing a brownface deluxe when Ted gets that model out. So, If you're a first time builder, I'd recommend Bruce.

me too mission is great and provides good nos tubes where it counts-and upgrades-especially upgrade the speaker top a weber blue dog imho-mission puts out a quality product akin to vic or clark for a good deal less