5F1- AC Main, fuse, and switch wiring

TelZilla · April 10th, 2008, 11:42 AM

Hey there. Still troubleshooting my current 5F1 build (from my desk at work...)

In comparing the Weber 5F1 Schematic

to the Weber 5F1 layout

,
I have some questions about the "order" of the wiring for the fuse and the switch.

The scemo shows the brown AC Mains wire going to the 2A fuse, then to the switch. The layout shows the brown AC mains wire going to the switch, then on to the fuse. Does it matter where in this order the fuse is?
On the Schemo, shouldn't the wire labeled black which runs from the PT (T1) to the switch (S1) be either blue for 125V or Brown for 120V?

One other thing- is the color coding of a three pronged plug standard? I'm reusing a cord from an old PC. I know the green wire is the round plug (the ground), but I'm not sure which of the two "blade" plugs the Blue and Brown wires connect to. I followed the color convention on the layout, and soldered the brown mains wire to the switch and connected the blue one to the black PT wire with a wire nut. Is it possible that the orientation of my power cord is reversed from the stock Weber one? Would it matter if it was?

Thanks.

z8894 · April 11th, 2008, 08:34 AM

"The scemo shows the brown AC Mains wire going to the 2A fuse, then to the switch. The layout shows the brown AC mains wire going to the switch, then on to the fuse. Does it matter where in this order the fuse is? "

No

"On the Schemo, shouldn't the wire labeled black which runs from the PT (T1) to the switch (S1) be either blue for 125V or Brown for 120V?"

Yes, the schematic doesn't show the same transfomer as the layout.

"One other thing- is the color coding of a three pronged plug standard? I'm reusing a cord from an old PC. I know the green wire is the round plug (the ground), but I'm not sure which of the two "blade" plugs the Blue and Brown wires connect to. I followed the color convention on the layout, and soldered the brown mains wire to the switch and connected the blue one to the black PT wire with a wire nut. Is it possible that the orientation of my power cord is reversed from the stock Weber one? Would it matter if it was? "

There is a standard but you've got a DMM, check for yourself. Learn to use the meter, it's very important to be good with it.

TelZilla · April 11th, 2008, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z8894

"The scemo shows the brown AC Mains wire going to the 2A fuse, then to the switch. The layout shows the brown AC mains wire going to the switch, then on to the fuse. Does it matter where in this order the fuse is? "

No

"On the Schemo, shouldn't the wire labeled black which runs from the PT (T1) to the switch (S1) be either blue for 125V or Brown for 120V?"

Yes, the schematic doesn't show the same transfomer as the layout.

"One other thing- is the color coding of a three pronged plug standard? I'm reusing a cord from an old PC. I know the green wire is the round plug (the ground), but I'm not sure which of the two "blade" plugs the Blue and Brown wires connect to. I followed the color convention on the layout, and soldered the brown mains wire to the switch and connected the blue one to the black PT wire with a wire nut. Is it possible that the orientation of my power cord is reversed from the stock Weber one? Would it matter if it was? "

There is a standard but you've got a DMM, check for yourself. Learn to use the meter, it's very important to be good with it.

Are you a librarian? Cuz you are awsome at scolding.

EMan · April 11th, 2008, 09:31 AM

I can't remember the blue/brown deal either, but the widest blade is COMMON, and you can use your DMM to trace which color goes to what.

Basically, the route is - COMMON (what would be white normally) to one of the PT primary leads.

The HOT goes to the fuse TIP - Fuse RING goes to power switch - other side of power switch goes to other PT primary lead.

GREEN wire from power cord to chassis. I usually use a PT mounting fastener for that.

mojo2001 · April 11th, 2008, 09:49 AM

You should DEFINITELY put the fuse before anything else in the chassis.

What would happen in the unlikely scenario that the switch shorted out to ground somehow and it was placed before the fuse?

Fire and smoke, that's what.

I used to review hi-fi gear. One time I was reviewing a tube amp that cost too much money for the junk that it was. When I flipped the toggle switch, the toggle came unhinged and fell into the switch. Sparks and fire flew. The lights in the room dimmed. Had to yank the power cord. The toggle ended up welded in at a weird angle.

After that incident, I would not trust a switch before the fuse, particularly a Chinese-made cheapo switch.

That amp did not get a review. it went back into the box and off to the huckster who made it.

Scott S · April 11th, 2008, 11:55 AM

Note the first item on the "kit info" page: https://taweber.powweb.com/store/kitinfo.htm

TelZilla · April 11th, 2008, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott S

Note the first item on the "kit info" page: https://taweber.powweb.com/store/kitinfo.htm

I didn't use a Weber cord, I took one from an old computer. Solved this problem with the help of my DMM.

z8894 · April 11th, 2008, 12:03 PM

"Are you a librarian? Cuz you are awsome at scolding."

I wasn't scolding I was hoping to help. Get in the habit of using the DMM to test connections, check wiring, check components, etc.. Seriously, the DMM is your friend. When in doubt, put a meter on it and prove it right or wrong.
The 5f1 is pretty simple, it may not seem that way to you right now but it will one day. It's possible to put one together and have it work without knowing any electronics but it doesn't always go that way. The positive side of the problems you are having right now is, you are going to learn more than if it had worked first time.
Good luck and please keep asking questions. The amp will sound great and if it ever does have a problem, you will know how to troubleshoot it and fix it yourself. What you need to be concerned about is the urge to build another amp as soon as you finish this one.

Scott S · April 11th, 2008, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TelZilla

I didn't use a Weber cord, I took one from an old computer. Solved this problem with the help of my DMM.

Yeah, I caught that, but I offered it in case it described the color coding of your PC cable. Glad you got it worked out!

- Scott

Wally · April 11th, 2008, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TelZilla

I didn't use a Weber cord, I took one from an old computer. Solved this problem with the help of my DMM.

So, Telzilla, could you share what you found with your computer cord....brown to hot? blue to common?

TelZilla · April 11th, 2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

So, Telzilla, could you share what you found with your computer cord....brown to hot? blue to common?

Yeah, that was it. But I'd check if you're doing the same thing someday.

I do think the setup of the plug itself is standard (at least in the US)- starting from the ground going clockwise, if the blades and plug are pointing at you, is Ground, Hot, Earth. Of course, that doesn't help if you can't see what color wire connects to what.

Wally · April 11th, 2008, 02:57 PM

I have always used the relationship of colors....blue is closer to white and brown is closer to black....but thanks to Eman I now have a way to make sure....big blade=common. Thanks, guys.

TelZilla · April 11th, 2008, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z8894

"Are you a librarian? Cuz you are awsome at scolding."

I wasn't scolding I was hoping to help. Get in the habit of using the DMM to test connections, check wiring, check components, etc.. Seriously, the DMM is your friend. When in doubt, put a meter on it and prove it right or wrong.
The 5f1 is pretty simple, it may not seem that way to you right now but it will one day. It's possible to put one together and have it work without knowing any electronics but it doesn't always go that way. The positive side of the problems you are having right now is, you are going to learn more than if it had worked first time.
Good luck and please keep asking questions. The amp will sound great and if it ever does have a problem, you will know how to troubleshoot it and fix it yourself. What you need to be concerned about is the urge to build another amp as soon as you finish this one.

It was a joke. And I know how to use my DMM. But thanks for the concern.

Maybe it's me, and certainly it's hard to intuit intent from an internet post, but you've posted a couple of replies to my posts that just read a little schoolmarmish/ talking-downish to me.

I know the 5F1 is simple, and I'm not a bit worried about the amp working. It's certainly more simple than the 6G16 I built last fall. The problem is that I am simple too.

Guitarslinger1 · April 11th, 2008, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

but thanks to Eman I now have a way to make sure....big blade=common. Thanks, guys.

That does sort of cut to the chase doesn't it?

z8894 · April 12th, 2008, 08:09 AM

In the first post of yours I read, the amp blew a 2A fuse then you put in a 3A fuse. That's what sent me in the schoolmarmish direction. Glad you got it working. What will you build next?

TelZilla · April 13th, 2008, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by z8894

In the first post of yours I read, the amp blew a 2A fuse then you put in a 3A fuse. That's what sent me in the schoolmarmish direction. Glad you got it working. What will you build next?

I think I'm going to 5e3ify my brown vibroverb kit and use the vibro and reverb stuff (plus some additional pieces) to build an outboard tube reverb/ harmonic vibrato.

But for now, I still have to tweed out my 5F1 (I used an old harvard reverb- the SS one from the 80's, and I stripped the black tolex).

April 10th, 2008, 11:42 AM	#1 (permalink)
TelZilla Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Cleveburg, USA Age: 38 Posts: 1,579 6 Photos	5F1- AC Main, fuse, and switch wiring Hey there. Still troubleshooting my current 5F1 build (from my desk at work...) In comparing the Weber 5F1 Schematic to the Weber 5F1 layout , I have some questions about the "order" of the wiring for the fuse and the switch. The scemo shows the brown AC Mains wire going to the 2A fuse, then to the switch. The layout shows the brown AC mains wire going to the switch, then on to the fuse. Does it matter where in this order the fuse is? On the Schemo, shouldn't the wire labeled black which runs from the PT (T1) to the switch (S1) be either blue for 125V or Brown for 120V? One other thing- is the color coding of a three pronged plug standard? I'm reusing a cord from an old PC. I know the green wire is the round plug (the ground), but I'm not sure which of the two "blade" plugs the Blue and Brown wires connect to. I followed the color convention on the layout, and soldered the brown mains wire to the switch and connected the blue one to the black PT wire with a wire nut. Is it possible that the orientation of my power cord is reversed from the stock Weber one? Would it matter if it was? Thanks. __________________ Thanks,Nick Witless and Affected. Always.

April 11th, 2008, 12:03 PM	#8 (permalink)
z8894 Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alpharetta, Ga. Age: 42 Posts: 106	Sorry "Are you a librarian? Cuz you are awsome at scolding." I wasn't scolding I was hoping to help. Get in the habit of using the DMM to test connections, check wiring, check components, etc.. Seriously, the DMM is your friend. When in doubt, put a meter on it and prove it right or wrong. The 5f1 is pretty simple, it may not seem that way to you right now but it will one day. It's possible to put one together and have it work without knowing any electronics but it doesn't always go that way. The positive side of the problems you are having right now is, you are going to learn more than if it had worked first time. Good luck and please keep asking questions. The amp will sound great and if it ever does have a problem, you will know how to troubleshoot it and fix it yourself. What you need to be concerned about is the urge to build another amp as soon as you finish this one.

April 12th, 2008, 08:09 AM	#15 (permalink)
z8894 Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alpharetta, Ga. Age: 42 Posts: 106	schoolmarm In the first post of yours I read, the amp blew a 2A fuse then you put in a 3A fuse. That's what sent me in the schoolmarmish direction. Glad you got it working. What will you build next?

April 11th, 2008, 08:34 AM	#2 (permalink)
z8894 Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alpharetta, Ga. Age: 42 Posts: 106	"The scemo shows the brown AC Mains wire going to the 2A fuse, then to the switch. The layout shows the brown AC mains wire going to the switch, then on to the fuse. Does it matter where in this order the fuse is? " No "On the Schemo, shouldn't the wire labeled black which runs from the PT (T1) to the switch (S1) be either blue for 125V or Brown for 120V?" Yes, the schematic doesn't show the same transfomer as the layout. "One other thing- is the color coding of a three pronged plug standard? I'm reusing a cord from an old PC. I know the green wire is the round plug (the ground), but I'm not sure which of the two "blade" plugs the Blue and Brown wires connect to. I followed the color convention on the layout, and soldered the brown mains wire to the switch and connected the blue one to the black PT wire with a wire nut. Is it possible that the orientation of my power cord is reversed from the stock Weber one? Would it matter if it was? " There is a standard but you've got a DMM, check for yourself. Learn to use the meter, it's very important to be good with it.

April 11th, 2008, 09:31 AM	#4 (permalink)
EMan Tele-Holic Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 939	I can't remember the blue/brown deal either, but the widest blade is COMMON, and you can use your DMM to trace which color goes to what. Basically, the route is - COMMON (what would be white normally) to one of the PT primary leads. The HOT goes to the fuse TIP - Fuse RING goes to power switch - other side of power switch goes to other PT primary lead. GREEN wire from power cord to chassis. I usually use a PT mounting fastener for that.

April 11th, 2008, 09:49 AM	#5 (permalink)
mojo2001 Tele-Meister Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Colonial Virginia Age: 48 Posts: 176	You should DEFINITELY put the fuse before anything else in the chassis. What would happen in the unlikely scenario that the switch shorted out to ground somehow and it was placed before the fuse? Fire and smoke, that's what. I used to review hi-fi gear. One time I was reviewing a tube amp that cost too much money for the junk that it was. When I flipped the toggle switch, the toggle came unhinged and fell into the switch. Sparks and fire flew. The lights in the room dimmed. Had to yank the power cord. The toggle ended up welded in at a weird angle. After that incident, I would not trust a switch before the fuse, particularly a Chinese-made cheapo switch. That amp did not get a review. it went back into the box and off to the huckster who made it.

April 11th, 2008, 11:55 AM	#6 (permalink)
Scott S Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: SW CR IA US NA PE Age: 27 Posts: 1,210	Note the first item on the "kit info" page: https://taweber.powweb.com/store/kitinfo.htm

April 11th, 2008, 02:57 PM	#12 (permalink)
Wally Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 3,530	I have always used the relationship of colors....blue is closer to white and brown is closer to black....but thanks to Eman I now have a way to make sure....big blade=common. Thanks, guys.