POLL: ceramic or alnico?

[11 Gauge]

So - which of the two, and why?

Don't resort to actual speaker models, if possible, since this adds other elements to the mix - cone/voice coil/cone treatment/doping/spider/dust cap etc.

I'm curious as to why one is favored over the other. There are the obvious reasons, but I think that there's more to it than the obvious.

And yes, you must pick ONE. I know that certain types work better for certain applications, so pick your favorite or dominant application.

[trag-o-caster]

Well I CERTAINLY couldn't pick just one - but you forced me, so I picked ceramic. Most of my speakers over the years have been ceramic, and my current collection of amps all have ceramic speakers, except the B1uesboy 5F1.
Isn't the whole point behind using alnico supposed to be that you drive the speaker to the point to where it's distorting as well? I once had asked Ted Weber about using a particular alnico speaker in my DR, and he talked me out of it by telling me that the DR doesn't have enough watts to drive the speaker hard enough to make the alnico magnet come into play tone-wise... i.e. it being alnico with low wattage would make the alnico inconsequential.

I've not really experimented with the low watt, speaker distortion tones that some people rave about. I've always enjoyed using high powered speakers and just hearing the amp sing on it's own.

There's also a tendency to think of ceramic as being slightly hollow in the midrange vs. alnico, thus making it very blackface friendly, while alnico is more tweed-era friendly.

I dunno - I should experiment more, but I'm happy where I'm at.

[WrapAround]

"Ceramic or AlNiCo?".... Well, it depends on the amp. It's not so black-and-white issue for me.

[11 Gauge]

Originally Posted by WrapAround

Well, it depends on the amp.

And I stated such.

So - going with your favorite amp or dominant application, which would it be?

This isn't intended to pin anyone down - just more of a light discussion.

[Tim Swartz]

I enjoy both and really can't pick one over the other. Sorry to break the rules, but I think model is more sonically relavent than magnet type... I've got SROs (alnico) in various cabs and combos and to me those are "it" for high power single speaker applications, but I also like Vintage 30s (ceramic), especially in sealed cabs. My TV front Deluxe was a test-bed for many speakers (you name it, it was probably tried) while trying to wake it up a bit as it is really dark by nature... the magic combination turned out to be an early '70s 30w 75hz Celestion (ceramic)...which is also one of the brightest speakers I've ever come across, but in that amp it is just buttery and rich. I also have an old grey Celestion (alnico) in a sealed single 12 bottom that mates very nicely with a Marshall 20w head. I have a Vibro Champ that on one boring winter Saturday got frankensteined to a blistering 45w. It was a 10" speaker murderer killing several ceramics including Eminence, Celestion and EV. It has sported a JBL E110 (alnico) for several years now and it has been holding fine...(knocks on wood).

[petebradt]

Because Alnico sounds like I want it to sound. I play Tweed clones and that's what they used originally. I want it to sound like that.

[trag-o-caster]

Originally Posted by Tim Swartz

I have a Vibro Champ that on one boring winter Saturday got frankensteined to a blistering 45w. It was a 10" speaker murderer killing several ceramics including Eminence, Celestion and EV.

I LOVE IT!!!

Ya GOTTA let me try that the next time I drop by!

[reverberocket2]

In general I like the punch of ceramic

The exception for me are the old JBL alnicos

[Jaybird]

I would say that the ceramic most always gives me the sound I am looking for while playing harp. Fuller and more body. (almost sounds like a shampoo ad)..Ha.

[11 Gauge]

Originally Posted by Tim Swartz

I have a Vibro Champ that on one boring winter Saturday got frankensteined to a blistering 45w. It was a 10" speaker murderer killing several ceramics including Eminence, Celestion and EV. It has sported a JBL E110 (alnico) for several years now and it has been holding fine...(knocks on wood).

Getting off topic, but I can relate to that, completely.

Some years ago, I cobbled together what was essentially a JTM50 crammed into a Princeton Reverb-ish sized cabinet. I killed quite a few 10's, including a very sweet Mojo alnico 10. The only one that was left standing was a Weber Cali 10 ceramic. I actually still have that 10 to this day, and have even pounded it with EL34 amps, and the thing refuses to throw in the towel.

[Tim73]

Ceramic - due to the advise I got from the Specialist shop. I just went with what they recommended for my amp.

[Beatbx]

My tone in general tends toward brightness (mostly single coils into a couple fender amps,) and I've generally found that alnicos benefit my sound by rounding off the high end a bit while providing a nice mid content. That said, I like the louder, deeper tone of my ceramic 1x12 too, just not as much and not as often. I think one should have a varied quiver :)

[4 Strings]

Alnicos since they are the by-the-book speakers for tweeds amps.

But I must admit I have not subjected my tweeds to ceramics yet so perhaps I will change my mind in the future. However I just bought two 10A125's and one 10A125-O for my 5E7 build, so I hope that I won't change my mind too $oon!

Off topic, but I just have to mention this: I had a problem with the 10A125-O sounding crappy. Not crappy as in "I don't think I like the character of this speaker" but rather as in "now wait, there is definitely something's gone south in this 'ere speaker". So I got back to Weber, and right away and without a hassle they promised to replace the speaker with a new one.

That's the kind of customer support you should be able take for granted from any mail order vendor of expensive gear. But I have learned not to, and therefore I appreciate it so much more when companies don't try to f--k with you when you get back to them.

Also, that is the way to turn a customer's potentially very disappointing experience into an equally happy one. This is something far too few companies seem to have understood, counting quick nickels at the expense of slow dimes and sticking their heads up their rectifier in the process.

[JohnnyCrash]

Depends on the amp, the speaker, and the intended use.

To put an AlNiCo in a tweed, just because it's a tweed, or even just because it's historically accurate is fine, but being historically accurate isn't as important as getting the sound YOU want.

Just ask Neil Young with his favorite '59 5E3 Deluxe with it's Ceramic Jensen (C12Q?).

I've put British ceramics in American circuits, and American AlNiCos in British circuits... the Jensen P15N goes great with just about any circuit (even with a Bass) and the ceramic V30 is great for modern sounds. I guess it just depends on personal taste and opinion.

FYI
CEDist is having a C12N blowout for wholesalers/dealers this week... $40 (retail is $71!!!). I had to buy one at that price, should be here in a few days and my 5E3 will be done by next week, so I can let you know how it sounds if you want.

[Tim Swartz]

I really like the reissue C12N. A bit of a break-in required to smooth out the top, but it is very good cheapy 12.

[tazzboy]

Actually Neil Youngs is C12N at least that is what Larry Cragg said in an interview with Tone quest magazine.

[richon]

i just love TWEEDS deluxes....

so I build my first with Eminence Legend GB12... sounds super!!

later another Deluxe for a friend with Celestion GreenBack.... sounds good, but the eminences sounded better

then the almoust "bad" head deluxe for me, with Weber Alnico 2x12" ... i really love it... more than any other speaker so far....

so ALNICOS.

[boris bubbanov]

My Weber Blue Dogs are ceramic because this was the right choice in this situation. (Peavey Classic 50 2 x 12)
The next amp may require alnicos, and I'm open to that.

[Larry F]

I have a Champ that had an 8" Weber ceramic. I replaced it with a Weber alnico and suddenly I could hear all the details in the attack, bend motion, and release. I was shocked at the difference. Wow. These amps and their components are very sensitive.

[Dan German]

My primary amp is a PRII with an Eminence Cannabis Rex 12" speaker (ceramic). I didn't buy the speaker for the magnet, but for the sound. I had heard good things about this speaker, and they were all true. I love the way it sounds in this amp.