2009 TDPRI Giveaway Winners List is available HERE

enalnitram · March 11th, 2009, 11:22 AM

What can I say? Rich's dread thread inspired me to get going on something I've been wanting to do for over 10 years.

I started just after thanksgiving last year, and here's what I've got done so far:

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...662590&l=20f2b

Feedback and pointers are welcome!

studio1087 · March 12th, 2009, 12:14 AM

That's fantastic. I respect anyone with the patience and talent to built an acoustic. Is that a Stew Mack kit? The neck has a volute.....nice. I've built one Tele and it was a humbling experience.

000's are my favorite guitars. I have a Martin, Larrivee, Taylor and Rainsong 000. They are comfy and great sounding guitars. Keep posting the pictures. Very interesting. Hats off to you......if I tried to do what you are doing it would be a real train wreck. I have a hard time taking my time.

Great work!

John

RickG501 · March 12th, 2009, 12:58 PM

What Studio said.

You do know you're gonna have to do a thread, with PICTURES, on this don't you?

You're a bettter man than me, Gunga Din. I've got enough on my hands just playin' a store bought one.

Edit to add: Man that back is gorgeous. Short scale, scalloped bracing...sweet.

jkingma · March 12th, 2009, 01:11 PM

I've been wanting to try a Stew-Mac kit. So I am curious for more detail.

Jerry J · March 12th, 2009, 01:22 PM

I believe you can buy a Martin kit directly from Martin, so you can have the real McCoy.

enalnitram · March 12th, 2009, 02:36 PM

Thanks guys, I really do appreciate the feedback. Here in the eye of the hurricane, it feels like I'm doing nothing more than creating a $400 pile of firewood, sometimes.

For example, I'm currently completely worried that the neck block isn't set up properly to give me the right neck angle. I thought I had it set up right, but after I glued it, it looked different and was flush to the level of the sides, rather than rising slightly above them as it pointed to the center of the top. I'm going to have a local luthier look at it before I glue on the back, and give me some pointers soon. Hopefully, I'm not hosed.

This is a Martin kit With 100% Martin parts, but I didn't buy it from Martin. A guy named Steve Kovacik sells these kits on his website and thru ebay auctions. His website is http://www.guitar-repair.com/ and his ebay handle is "asaa." He seems to have a relationship with Martin and gets some very cool stuff and can send pictures of the pieces to you before you purchase from him. I asked him for something like a 000-28, and that's exactly what he was able to put together for me. I specified what woods I wanted, and type of binding, etc. He's a very nice and accomodating guy.

I don't know much about the stew-mac kits, but I have heard nothing but good things about them. Rich Rice's build was a stew mac kit. I really like seeing what I'm going to buy, before I get it, though, which is why I went with Steve.

ecwannabe · March 12th, 2009, 05:02 PM

Good luck with the project. A couple of years ago I thought I'd like to try something like this so I bought a Stew-Mack 000 Kit. After seeing how nice the parts were I decided I was to much of a hack and I'd just mess the whole thing up so I enlisted the help of a friend who did lutherie as a hoby. It took him several months but it turned out to be a beautiful instrument. I've had more than one good musician (I'm a hack at playing also) tell me that it's the nicest playind and sounding small bodied guitar they've ever played. Please keep us up dated on your progress. I think you'll get lots of satisfaction from it.

RodeoTex · March 12th, 2009, 06:17 PM

Good luck to you Enal. I built a D18 copy from a kit 4-5 years ago. Seems the brochure makes you think that you glue it together one day, paint it the next day and play it the next. WAY off.
Luckily I had a lot of the specialize tools and some skills from building electrics. It still wasn't easy and I was amazed at how much tension was forced into the body. I kinda expected it to explode when I first strung it up.
I got the neck set in a bit too low so the action is a little high and I need to replace the nut soit will stay in tune though.
There were many times in the process where I wanted to give up and make it into a Kleenex dispenser or something.
It resides in my closet nowadays and get zero playing.
Hope your project turns out better. And yes, pictures are required.

Brewboy · March 13th, 2009, 04:25 PM

I just ordered this book to start my research(no affiliation):
http://www.nichebooks.com/kgm/bkag.html
I may start with a Stew Mac Ukelele, so if I mess up, I'm not out a buch of money.

enalnitram · March 13th, 2009, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brewboy

I just ordered this book to start my research(no affiliation):
http://www.nichebooks.com/kgm/bkag.html
I may start with a Stew Mac Ukelele, so if I mess up, I'm not out a buch of money.

that's great! I'm actually using Bill's other book as a guide while I build my 000.

He's a talented author and his presentation is very clear and easy to follow, without being too patronizing.

And I'm a member at Bill's forum, too.

enalnitram · March 15th, 2009, 12:49 AM

I had a really exciting night a few nights ago, because I was able to show my assembled rim (with the top glued to it) to a really fine local luthier, and he gave me some pointers.

So here's my top before I glued it to the rim...

Perhaps the most interesting things he said, were some comments he made about what he would've done to the top, if this were his project.

he said he would've:

* left out the popsicle brace
* cut the cantilever off of the neck block
* shaved off much of the bridge plate
* made the x braces thinner
* brought the middle of the scallops on the x braces shallower
* only put in one of the side tone bars on each side
* trimmed away the top and bottom of the end block at an angle, so it didn't touch the top, except near the kerfed lining.

it would've been a much lighter guitar. but I think I feel safer going a little heavier on my first time. I have no idea what to expect. I just hope it's good. He thinks it will be, and he sounds sincere. So that was encouraging.

I did trim the x braces in two places the treble side like he suggested. here's what happened there:

I made the "scallop" a little shallower near the lower bout, and I made the slope start a little farther up the brace, on the one near the soundhole.

He also suggested gluing on a piece of spruce right over top of my x-brace linen patch, along the brace that goes underneath the other one, and sanding it down smooth, for a little more stability there.

Now I think I'm ready to glue the back on. Tonight I did a dry run. And I found that it isn't going to work, because the curvature of the back is too great. I need more clamps. Or maybe some very long, thick, rubber bands....

... more soon.

blue metalflake · March 15th, 2009, 08:03 AM

Good to know you've got started. It's something I'd love to do, but I know I'd be too ham-fisted to get it right.

Keep up the good work & keep the pics flowing.

RickG501 · March 15th, 2009, 01:42 PM

I thought the bracing looked ok to me.

Question on the clamps. Do you need to go all the way across the back with the clamp blocks or can you use smaller ones just on the edge you are glueing and avoid the bow in the back all together?

I love these threads. Thanks for sharing your project.

enalnitram · March 15th, 2009, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickG501

Do you need to go all the way across the back with the clamp blocks or can you use smaller ones just on the edge you are glueing and avoid the bow in the back all together?

I think it could go either way. please note that my wood pieces that go all the way across the back are arched to match the radius. I wouldn't put them on there if they weren't. I need to come up with something else though because I don't have enough clamps to get the edge down, all the way around. I borrowed some stretchy straps from my father in law this morning, so I'll soon see if that will work.

enalnitram · March 17th, 2009, 10:30 AM

This project is turning out like most of mine do, regardless of what it is: a song, a guitar, etc. When I show it to knowledgeable people, they might say, "oh, looks good, but you've got a couple of small problems here." and when I show it to unknowledgable people, they're blown away.

the beginner still has dreams of greatness. but reality has a way of asserting itself. and I have to just keep telling myself that with the kind of money I'm putting into the project, I just couldn't buy the kinds of materials I'm getting in this guitar at guitar center. I just have to do my best.

anyhow, I finally got to glue the back on last night, but I had a couple of problems.

I used this method to do it:
http://www.kennethmichaelguitars.com/attachback.html

After spreading glue on my kerfed lining, I attached the back, and started putting clamps on my mold, so that the rubber bands wouldn't pull the mold upward. then, I started putting the rubber bands over the top. after getting them all on, I noticed that one of my clamps was cracking my top! it was on the edge, where a small piece of wood had got too near the top. the crack mostly is on the edge of the top that will be trimmed off, and it occurs over top of the end block.

so after I noticed this, i quickly took everything apart and then put it all together again. I layed awake last night hoping the glue would hold, and worrying about the crack. this morning, everything looked ok, but the crack was still there. it is pretty small, but still a drag, of course.

I'll have the opportunity to show the guitar to the luthier again this week. we're going to use his router table to trim the overhang off the back and sides.

I ordered some maple binding from luthier's mercantile, which arrived yesterday. I hear that a ladies curling iron makes an ideal bending tool for maple binding. I also have ivoroid binding, which came with the kit. I haven't decided which to go with. the ivoroid would be much easier. I'm all for avoiding mishaps at this point, and doing what I can to insure a clean look. but the maple binding would look sharp if I can do it right. hmmm.

Yman · March 17th, 2009, 11:05 AM

Keep it up man. The fact that you are trying inspires the rest of us to build!

You could at least practice bending the ivoroid, and if you feel confident go for the maple. Your right though, the maple would look great. And this might be your only chance for a while to use it!

westex93 · March 17th, 2009, 11:28 AM

Looking good, Martin. Building an acoustic guitar is quite an undertaking, but not outside the scope of someone who has the right "want-to" about them. Looks like you're off to a good start!

It's good that you you have someone like Mark around to help you out. Take good advantage of that! There's also a local luthier group in Michigan that he may have told you about:

http://kragenbrinkguitars.com/MGL/mi...f_luthiers.htm

And check out the Official Luthiers Forum. Great bunch of guys there that run from absolute newbies working on their first build to some of the best veteran builders in the luthierie community.

www.luthiersforum.com

And don't sweat the small stuff. Mark's suggestions were good ones, and things to think about on your next build (there will be a next, right?), but there's no reason you won't be able to come out with a very good guitar with the start you have. Just take what you learn from this one and move forward!

Re: the curling iron method. I have heard about using a curling iron on tight bends (such as an F5 mandolin) but I think you'll be better served with a hot pipe or a bending form. Were the sides already bent with the kit or did you bend them yourself?

enalnitram · March 17th, 2009, 11:54 AM

thanks, guys! there probably will be a next one, eventually.

my sides came pre-bent. but the binding isn't.

RickG501 · March 17th, 2009, 02:16 PM

I'd say at this stage the small crack shouldn't be a big issue, it's after the finish is on and several years down the road it is a big deal. At this stage you can use a little filler and go on down the road.

Don't let it worry you, ( I know...easy for me to say).

enalnitram · March 18th, 2009, 07:55 PM

here's the crack in the top. nearly all of it will be trimmed off when I cut the top flush with the sides.

but that's really the least of my worries. I'm no Rich Rice. after looking everything over yesterday, I realized that my center strip inside the guitar is resting underneath my neck block! It's only about 1/32". but enough to screw everything up.

I'm going to take the back off, and reglue it. I can't believe it. It's all because I was in a hurry to get everything put back together after discovering the crack that happened while gluing the back.

It was looking so nice, too.

enalnitram · March 21st, 2009, 12:54 AM

don't try this at home:

after an hour of knifing and ironing, the back is off!

so here's the piece of maple I glued to the bottom of my neck block. it touches the back much better. I'm really glad that I did take the back off, because I discovered that my neck block was too short. I had trimmed it instead of sanding it, and I had taken too much off. it made it much easier for the center strip to slide under it the first time that I glued the back on.

enalnitram · March 21st, 2009, 12:59 AM

Whew, the back has been reglued, and this time it's much better.

I've only used a router once, so I asked my friend Mark Swanson if he wanted to trim the top and back. Actually, he offered to.

95% of the top crack got routed off during this procedure. the rest of it'll be super glued and sanded, unless I'm told I shouldn't do that.

It's really starting to look like a guitar now!

enalnitram · March 21st, 2009, 01:00 AM

RickG501 · March 21st, 2009, 02:26 PM

Looks good! Nice router work, I didn't see any burns or anything. Great. Onward and upward, hey?

RnB · April 6th, 2009, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enalnitram

Whew, the back has been reglued, and this time it's much better.

That looks familiar. Don't feel bad! I did something similiar on my neck block also. I got carried away w/ a grinder & shaved it down way too much. I had to shim mine back up too.

I also have a kit I bought from Kovacik, but I have to finish the one I'm working on first! One thing I've learned is, you can't rush into the next step of the build process w/o doing some pre-planning...& taking your time!

Your 000 should turn out fine. A Triple-0 is a great size. You're lucky to have a friend to see you through your project...Best!

PapaBeef · April 14th, 2009, 01:56 AM

Lookin' good.
I've wanted to try a kit myself.
I've done a few Teles & Strats...But never an acoustic.
I wish you luck. & I'll be keeping an eye on this to see how it goes for you.
I'm counting on you for some inspiration.

enalnitram · April 14th, 2009, 11:45 AM

RnB: thanks for posting your pic! I was just worrying about that shim some more yesterday. I guess we are ritualized acoustic kit soul brothers for sure!

I haven't posted an update because the project still looks much the same as it did the last time I posted pics here, despite me continuously working on it.

it's difficult being a perfectionist and also having very little skill or experience at the thing you're working on. what this means lately, is that in the past few weeks I've now re-attached the back to the rim 3 times. I've finally (kind of) got it where I can live with it, and am now about to move on to routing the body for the bindings and purfling. but in the mean time, I've used an iron and a pocket knife 3 times (!) to remove the back, and have tried various ways of clamping it down before I got a pretty good seal, all the way around. for the fourth try I wound up purchasing 12 four-inch bar clamps and clamped the back down without the mold. it was kinda tricky pushing in on the sides of the lower bout about 1/8th to 1/16th of an inch, while tightening the clamps and then making sure that the area near the tail wedge and the neck block were both perfectly perpendicular to the top. on the fourth try I think I got it. but this is not the way that they said to do it, anywhere I have ever looked. oh well.

in my last pictures, things looked ok, but there were actually gaps near the neck block and my glue job was just not very good.

a real guitar maker mighta used 20 or 30 spool clamps. but I'm a one-time kit guitar on a budget. and despite all this, I'm thinking everything is turning out ok ...

more soon.

PapaBeef · April 16th, 2009, 12:51 AM

I was just thinking, if you had to you could make a mess o spool clamps out of long screws,wing nuts, fender washers, felt washers & maybe some cheap tubing to cover the screw threads & prevent them from scratching the sides.
All stuff you could get at a regular hardware or home center & not break the bank.
Good luck.

BAW4742 · April 16th, 2009, 07:31 AM

Some spool clamps that I made.

I used a hole saw to cut out the blocks from 3/4" plywood. The same hole saw was used to cut the pads from cork and these cork pads were glued to the wood blocks. Then assembled them with carriage bolts, fender washers and wing nuts. They work great and there is enough thread on the bolts that I can use them on thinline guitars as well as acoustics.

enalnitram · April 16th, 2009, 11:14 PM

this is how I wound up re-re-gluing the back. It's indeed difficult being a perfectionist when you have no experience with what you're currently working on. Don't ask how many hours I put into fitting the back of the guitar to the rim. I'm not ready to start taking orders, yet. I'd make about $1/hr!

I finally got it to turn out ok, pretty tight and snug all the way around:

I used this hair curling iron to bend my binding (made out of maple), and it actually worked well. I couldn't believe how well it did work.

I soaked the wood strips in water for a while, first. And after bending them with the iron, I clamped them to that outline of the guitar, overnight. In the morning I found that they had held the shape. It was much easier than I thought it was going to be.

Here's the maple binding after bending, taped to the pieces of (pre-bent) herringbone purfling I ordered. I bought the binding from lmii.com. I could've used plastic for the binding, but wood will be much nicer.

Chiseling out the space for the tail wedge:

enalnitram · April 16th, 2009, 11:15 PM

[...continued...]

...and the tail wedge glued in and sanded sorta flush. This maple I used is not a perfect match with my binding but I'll figure that out later? ...

I cut out this space for the neck joint out of the top using a battery-powered drill and a chisel. Wow, in this picture, the holes in the top look really crooked but it's not as bad as it looks.

Putting the frets in the fingerboard went pretty quick -- it's one of the few things in this project that I've done before. I had it masked here while I worked on the fret ends.

This might be my best fret job yet. It really turned out nicely.

... and when I hold the whole thing up it feels pretty light and nicely balanced. if I can get it all to line up correctly when I do the neck set and the bridge placement, this might just be a dreamy 000. we'll see.

if it turns out nice I plan to buy one of those arched tweed cases for it and a Greven Tortis pickguard.

anybody have an opinion about grover vs gotoh vs waverly? I'm leaning towards grover.

RnB · April 17th, 2009, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enalnitram

I used this hair curling iron to bend my binding (made out of maple), and it actually worked well. I couldn't believe how well it did work.

I soaked the wood strips in water for a while, first. And after bending them with the iron, I clamped them to that outline of the guitar, overnight. In the morning I found that they had held the shape. It was much easier than I thought it was going to be.

Could you elaborate a little more about you went about bending the maple w/ a curling iron....Sounds ingenius! Did you just work you way around the curves w/ the iron till you got to the correct shape?

I've been looking at $400 benders, when all I have to do walk in my wife's dressing room..lol. Necessity is the mother of invention!

enalnitram · April 17th, 2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RnB

Did you just work you way around the curves w/ the iron till you got to the correct shape?

pretty much. I wish I could take credit for this idea, but I'm not the first person to do this.

I took the picture before I started working on it. what I wound up doing, was laying a heavy box on the other side of the iron. and, I used that shape of the outline of the guitar to mark the places on the binding that I wanted to bend. then, with the iron, I just started working the binding into the shape of the guitar.

I had a great big bucket full of cold water, and whatever piece I wasn't trying to bend, the other three were setting in there.

after about an hour or two, I had four pieces of binding that each had gentle bends in them that kinda followed the shape, but still were mostly straight. but that middle curve which is sharper, I did have that one pronounced in each piece. I did get a little split on one of the pieces, though. I think I'll be able to put some superglue in it and sand it out. I do have 2 extra pieces of binding ready in case it doesn't work.

so, once I had everything at this point, I again soaked everything in water, and then clamped them all around that outline, just like they would be shaped as finished pieces of binding. I let them set overnight that way and when I checked again in the morning, they had held the shape! then I taped 'em to that cardboard piece like I had pictured, where they've been waiting for me to do the binding channel routing. I hope to get that done next week. I'll enlist help again to do that. I don't mind "cheating." I want it to turn out good.

RickG501 · April 17th, 2009, 11:11 AM

Be careful with the super glue or any glue, as if the place where your putting it will show prominentely, the glue won't take stain and you could wind up with a prominent light spot on an otherwise beautiful finish.

It's coming along nicely though, actually it looks really great for a first build!

I'm not sure I'm ready to tackle something like this, heck I screwed up the shoe shine kit I made in shop class...

RnB · April 17th, 2009, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enalnitram

... and a Greven Tortis pickguard.

anybody have an opinion about grover vs gotoh vs waverly? I'm leaning towards grover.

Waverly's are pricey, but work great! Since I plan on building more than one, I purchased 6 sets of Grover 18:l Sta-Tites (3 nkl & 3 gld) from StewMac to get a better deal. For the price savings over 6 sets of Waves. I put a set on a Martin 0000 Model I also have...& can say, they work fine. Martin Tuners are made by Gotoh I believe & are OK...but have some backlash!

I also put a 30's TorTis pkgd on the 0000. That & the 50's style one are good choices...imo!

Your kit is looking good & I'd say you're on the right track. Keep us posted!

enalnitram · April 17th, 2009, 02:39 PM

as always thanks for the feedback, guys.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickG501

the glue won't take stain

I have already learned this the hard way!

in this case I was plannin' to put the glue in the binding where it would be within the channel. one of my pieces split slightly in the waist portion of it. the split is on the inside, not the outside, of the curve. it's not a big crack or anything and i think i could probably get away with not putting any glue in it at all. i guess i'll see how it works when i try to glue it and tape it down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RnB

I also put a 30's TorTis pkgd on the 0000. That & the 50's style one are good choices...imo!

what do you think about an OM guard versus a 000 guard? since my guitar is a 000, i feel like i ought to get a 000 guard, but it's so much bigger than an OM guard. the OM guard is smaller and looks more "elegant." I have a pretty light touch and rarely play in a strummy-strum-strum style. i tend to either be finger picking or flat picking single notes. i like the way the swirlies look in the 30's guard in pictures. how does it look in real life? i'm leaning towards a 30's OM guard, I think.

RnB · April 18th, 2009, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enalnitram

what do you think about an OM guard versus a 000 guard? since my guitar is a 000, i feel like i ought to get a 000 guard, but it's so much bigger than an OM guard. the OM guard is smaller and looks more "elegant." I have a pretty light touch and rarely play in a strummy-strum-strum style. i tend to either be finger picking or flat picking single notes. i like the way the swirlies look in the 30's guard in pictures. how does it look in real life? i'm leaning towards a 30's OM guard, I think.

An OM guard is more elegant! OTOH, I think a 000 guard is more suited for for that style guitar since that's what usually goes on there. But, I'm a traditionalist. Just my .02 cents. At first, I was never crazy about an OM sized guard, but they have since grown on me. You could always get both...then pick & choose. Or, since you're not an agressive player, you could go sans.

Are you going to put a toner on the top or let time tone it? The 30's TorTis is great looking pkgd. A little smokier or more aged in appearance. I also like the 50's too. I have those on a couple of other Martins...

30's on a 0000:

50's on a Jumbo:

50's on an OM:

enalnitram · April 19th, 2009, 12:36 AM

thanks for posting those pics, RnB.

an incredible thing happened in the saga of my guitar build today. I attended a gathering of the members of OLF today in Lake Zurich, Illinois, and I won the top prize of the door prizes handed out: a free finish by a guy that has just set up a business, and that does work with the same kind of finishes that Taylor does: Poly hardened by UV light or something like that. Joe White. Nice guy. And his work looks really nice. I had been planning to shoot it myself with nitro, probably from those stew mac spray cans. but now i'll have this pro finish done.

RnB · April 19th, 2009, 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by enalnitram

thanks for posting those pics, RnB.

an incredible thing happened in the saga of my guitar build today. I attended a gathering of the members of OLF today in Lake Zurich, Illinois, and I won the top prize of the door prizes handed out: a free finish by a guy that has just set up a business, and that does work with the same kind of finishes that Taylor does: Poly hardened by UV light or something like that. Joe White. Nice guy. And his work looks really nice. I had been planning to shoot it myself with nitro, probably from those stew mac spray cans.

Lucky You..way to go! I'm familiar w/ Joe White. He does great work. Nothing wrong w/ Poly as long you don't put it on too thick. One downside of Poly is that it's not as easily repairable as lacquer, when it needs it.

Lacquering a guitar is quite a time consuming, toxic process. What do you think I'm doing this weekend..lol? I was a pro painter for 40 years & have all the equipment, but if there's a way I can get someone else to shoot a guitar, I won't hesitate.

Just think of the 1st rate job you're going to get. I've gleaned some great info from the OLF. I've also seen some incredible acoustics come out of the hands of it's members.

Rich

otterhound · April 19th, 2009, 02:16 PM

Looks good so far . Have you considered trying what I call mummifying the body by wrapping it when gluing the top or back ? I have a 00028 Martin and I love it . I think that you will enjoy a very special treat every time you pick her up . Nice looking EIR . Very straight grain . I am envious .

March 11th, 2009, 11:22 AM	#1 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	I'm building a 000 from a kit What can I say? Rich's dread thread inspired me to get going on something I've been wanting to do for over 10 years. I started just after thanksgiving last year, and here's what I've got done so far: http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...662590&l=20f2b Feedback and pointers are welcome! __________________

March 12th, 2009, 12:14 AM	#2 (permalink)
studio1087 Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: May 2003 Location: Near Milwaukee Age: 45 Posts: 6,392 34 Photos	That's fantastic. I respect anyone with the patience and talent to built an acoustic. Is that a Stew Mack kit? The neck has a volute.....nice. I've built one Tele and it was a humbling experience. 000's are my favorite guitars. I have a Martin, Larrivee, Taylor and Rainsong 000. They are comfy and great sounding guitars. Keep posting the pictures. Very interesting. Hats off to you......if I tried to do what you are doing it would be a real train wreck. I have a hard time taking my time. Great work! John __________________ John

March 12th, 2009, 12:58 PM	#3 (permalink)
RickG501 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Age: 55 Posts: 1,346	What Studio said. You do know you're gonna have to do a thread, with PICTURES, on this don't you? You're a bettter man than me, Gunga Din. I've got enough on my hands just playin' a store bought one. Edit to add: Man that back is gorgeous. Short scale, scalloped bracing...sweet. __________________ I know my words sound strange to you but if you wait til my song is sung and my story's told you might come to understand...

March 12th, 2009, 01:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
jkingma Friend of Leo's Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N43° 11.943 ~ W079° 35.285 Posts: 3,083 18 Photos	I've been wanting to try a Stew-Mac kit. So I am curious for more detail. __________________ Creator of Fine Sawdust and Expensive Kindling.

March 12th, 2009, 01:22 PM	#5 (permalink)
Jerry J Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NoVa Posts: 867	I believe you can buy a Martin kit directly from Martin, so you can have the real McCoy. __________________ .....and that's why keith richards cannot be killed by conventional weapons.....

March 12th, 2009, 02:36 PM	#6 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	Thanks guys, I really do appreciate the feedback. Here in the eye of the hurricane, it feels like I'm doing nothing more than creating a $400 pile of firewood, sometimes. For example, I'm currently completely worried that the neck block isn't set up properly to give me the right neck angle. I thought I had it set up right, but after I glued it, it looked different and was flush to the level of the sides, rather than rising slightly above them as it pointed to the center of the top. I'm going to have a local luthier look at it before I glue on the back, and give me some pointers soon. Hopefully, I'm not hosed. This is a Martin kit With 100% Martin parts, but I didn't buy it from Martin. A guy named Steve Kovacik sells these kits on his website and thru ebay auctions. His website is http://www.guitar-repair.com/ and his ebay handle is "asaa." He seems to have a relationship with Martin and gets some very cool stuff and can send pictures of the pieces to you before you purchase from him. I asked him for something like a 000-28, and that's exactly what he was able to put together for me. I specified what woods I wanted, and type of binding, etc. He's a very nice and accomodating guy. I don't know much about the stew-mac kits, but I have heard nothing but good things about them. Rich Rice's build was a stew mac kit. I really like seeing what I'm going to buy, before I get it, though, which is why I went with Steve. __________________

March 12th, 2009, 05:02 PM	#7 (permalink)
ecwannabe TDPRI Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Eldridge Iowa Age: 61 Posts: 30	Good luck with the project. A couple of years ago I thought I'd like to try something like this so I bought a Stew-Mack 000 Kit. After seeing how nice the parts were I decided I was to much of a hack and I'd just mess the whole thing up so I enlisted the help of a friend who did lutherie as a hoby. It took him several months but it turned out to be a beautiful instrument. I've had more than one good musician (I'm a hack at playing also) tell me that it's the nicest playind and sounding small bodied guitar they've ever played. Please keep us up dated on your progress. I think you'll get lots of satisfaction from it.

March 12th, 2009, 06:17 PM	#8 (permalink)
RodeoTex Friend of Leo's Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 2,925	Good luck to you Enal. I built a D18 copy from a kit 4-5 years ago. Seems the brochure makes you think that you glue it together one day, paint it the next day and play it the next. WAY off. Luckily I had a lot of the specialize tools and some skills from building electrics. It still wasn't easy and I was amazed at how much tension was forced into the body. I kinda expected it to explode when I first strung it up. I got the neck set in a bit too low so the action is a little high and I need to replace the nut soit will stay in tune though. There were many times in the process where I wanted to give up and make it into a Kleenex dispenser or something. It resides in my closet nowadays and get zero playing. Hope your project turns out better. And yes, pictures are required. __________________ Turn it on, turn it up, turn me loose.

March 13th, 2009, 04:25 PM	#9 (permalink)
Brewboy Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Lake Wobegon, MN Age: 43 Posts: 639 8 Photos	I just ordered this book to start my research(no affiliation): http://www.nichebooks.com/kgm/bkag.html I may start with a Stew Mac Ukelele, so if I mess up, I'm not out a buch of money. __________________ http://www.myspace.com/christopherlaumb http://www.myspace.com/canneryrowband http://thebrewersdiary.blogspot.com/

March 15th, 2009, 12:49 AM	#11 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	An update ... and by popular demand, pictures! I had a really exciting night a few nights ago, because I was able to show my assembled rim (with the top glued to it) to a really fine local luthier, and he gave me some pointers. So here's my top before I glued it to the rim... Perhaps the most interesting things he said, were some comments he made about what he would've done to the top, if this were his project. he said he would've: * left out the popsicle brace * cut the cantilever off of the neck block * shaved off much of the bridge plate * made the x braces thinner * brought the middle of the scallops on the x braces shallower * only put in one of the side tone bars on each side * trimmed away the top and bottom of the end block at an angle, so it didn't touch the top, except near the kerfed lining. it would've been a much lighter guitar. but I think I feel safer going a little heavier on my first time. I have no idea what to expect. I just hope it's good. He thinks it will be, and he sounds sincere. So that was encouraging. I did trim the x braces in two places the treble side like he suggested. here's what happened there: I made the "scallop" a little shallower near the lower bout, and I made the slope start a little farther up the brace, on the one near the soundhole. He also suggested gluing on a piece of spruce right over top of my x-brace linen patch, along the brace that goes underneath the other one, and sanding it down smooth, for a little more stability there. Now I think I'm ready to glue the back on. Tonight I did a dry run. And I found that it isn't going to work, because the curvature of the back is too great. I need more clamps. Or maybe some very long, thick, rubber bands.... ... more soon. __________________

March 15th, 2009, 08:03 AM	#12 (permalink)
blue metalflake Friend of Leo's Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: ireland Age: 56 Posts: 2,725 10 Photos	Good to know you've got started. It's something I'd love to do, but I know I'd be too ham-fisted to get it right. Keep up the good work & keep the pics flowing.

March 15th, 2009, 01:42 PM	#13 (permalink)
RickG501 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Age: 55 Posts: 1,346	I thought the bracing looked ok to me. Question on the clamps. Do you need to go all the way across the back with the clamp blocks or can you use smaller ones just on the edge you are glueing and avoid the bow in the back all together? I love these threads. Thanks for sharing your project. __________________ I know my words sound strange to you but if you wait til my song is sung and my story's told you might come to understand...

March 17th, 2009, 10:30 AM	#15 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	This project is turning out like most of mine do, regardless of what it is: a song, a guitar, etc. When I show it to knowledgeable people, they might say, "oh, looks good, but you've got a couple of small problems here." and when I show it to unknowledgable people, they're blown away. the beginner still has dreams of greatness. but reality has a way of asserting itself. and I have to just keep telling myself that with the kind of money I'm putting into the project, I just couldn't buy the kinds of materials I'm getting in this guitar at guitar center. I just have to do my best. anyhow, I finally got to glue the back on last night, but I had a couple of problems. I used this method to do it: http://www.kennethmichaelguitars.com/attachback.html After spreading glue on my kerfed lining, I attached the back, and started putting clamps on my mold, so that the rubber bands wouldn't pull the mold upward. then, I started putting the rubber bands over the top. after getting them all on, I noticed that one of my clamps was cracking my top! it was on the edge, where a small piece of wood had got too near the top. the crack mostly is on the edge of the top that will be trimmed off, and it occurs over top of the end block. so after I noticed this, i quickly took everything apart and then put it all together again. I layed awake last night hoping the glue would hold, and worrying about the crack. this morning, everything looked ok, but the crack was still there. it is pretty small, but still a drag, of course. I'll have the opportunity to show the guitar to the luthier again this week. we're going to use his router table to trim the overhang off the back and sides. I ordered some maple binding from luthier's mercantile, which arrived yesterday. I hear that a ladies curling iron makes an ideal bending tool for maple binding. I also have ivoroid binding, which came with the kit. I haven't decided which to go with. the ivoroid would be much easier. I'm all for avoiding mishaps at this point, and doing what I can to insure a clean look. but the maple binding would look sharp if I can do it right. hmmm. __________________

March 17th, 2009, 11:05 AM	#16 (permalink)
Yman TDPRI Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Nashville, Tn Posts: 48	Keep it up man. The fact that you are trying inspires the rest of us to build! You could at least practice bending the ivoroid, and if you feel confident go for the maple. Your right though, the maple would look great. And this might be your only chance for a while to use it!

March 17th, 2009, 11:28 AM	#17 (permalink)
westex93 Tele-Meister Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Texas Age: 37 Posts: 147	Looking good, Martin. Building an acoustic guitar is quite an undertaking, but not outside the scope of someone who has the right "want-to" about them. Looks like you're off to a good start! It's good that you you have someone like Mark around to help you out. Take good advantage of that! There's also a local luthier group in Michigan that he may have told you about: http://kragenbrinkguitars.com/MGL/mi...f_luthiers.htm And check out the Official Luthiers Forum. Great bunch of guys there that run from absolute newbies working on their first build to some of the best veteran builders in the luthierie community. www.luthiersforum.com And don't sweat the small stuff. Mark's suggestions were good ones, and things to think about on your next build (there will be a next, right?), but there's no reason you won't be able to come out with a very good guitar with the start you have. Just take what you learn from this one and move forward! Re: the curling iron method. I have heard about using a curling iron on tight bends (such as an F5 mandolin) but I think you'll be better served with a hot pipe or a bending form. Were the sides already bent with the kit or did you bend them yourself? __________________ Wes McMillian Santo, TX http://www.reverbnation.com/c./a4/82...49/Artist/link

March 17th, 2009, 11:54 AM	#18 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	thanks, guys! there probably will be a next one, eventually. my sides came pre-bent. but the binding isn't. __________________

March 17th, 2009, 02:16 PM	#19 (permalink)
RickG501 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Age: 55 Posts: 1,346	I'd say at this stage the small crack shouldn't be a big issue, it's after the finish is on and several years down the road it is a big deal. At this stage you can use a little filler and go on down the road. Don't let it worry you, ( I know...easy for me to say). __________________ I know my words sound strange to you but if you wait til my song is sung and my story's told you might come to understand...

March 18th, 2009, 07:55 PM	#20 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	here's the crack in the top. nearly all of it will be trimmed off when I cut the top flush with the sides. but that's really the least of my worries. I'm no Rich Rice. after looking everything over yesterday, I realized that my center strip inside the guitar is resting underneath my neck block! It's only about 1/32". but enough to screw everything up. I'm going to take the back off, and reglue it. I can't believe it. It's all because I was in a hurry to get everything put back together after discovering the crack that happened while gluing the back. It was looking so nice, too. __________________

March 21st, 2009, 12:54 AM	#21 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	don't try this at home: after an hour of knifing and ironing, the back is off! so here's the piece of maple I glued to the bottom of my neck block. it touches the back much better. I'm really glad that I did take the back off, because I discovered that my neck block was too short. I had trimmed it instead of sanding it, and I had taken too much off. it made it much easier for the center strip to slide under it the first time that I glued the back on. __________________

March 21st, 2009, 12:59 AM	#22 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	Whew, the back has been reglued, and this time it's much better. I've only used a router once, so I asked my friend Mark Swanson if he wanted to trim the top and back. Actually, he offered to. 95% of the top crack got routed off during this procedure. the rest of it'll be super glued and sanded, unless I'm told I shouldn't do that. It's really starting to look like a guitar now! __________________

March 21st, 2009, 01:00 AM	#23 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	__________________

March 21st, 2009, 02:26 PM	#24 (permalink)
RickG501 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Age: 55 Posts: 1,346	Looks good! Nice router work, I didn't see any burns or anything. Great. Onward and upward, hey? __________________ I know my words sound strange to you but if you wait til my song is sung and my story's told you might come to understand...

April 14th, 2009, 01:56 AM	#26 (permalink)
PapaBeef Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: EN JAY Posts: 1,870	Lookin' good. I've wanted to try a kit myself. I've done a few Teles & Strats...But never an acoustic. I wish you luck. & I'll be keeping an eye on this to see how it goes for you. I'm counting on you for some inspiration. __________________ What I mean is, sometimes I just don't know what I mean. Ya know what I mean?

April 14th, 2009, 11:45 AM	#27 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	RnB: thanks for posting your pic! I was just worrying about that shim some more yesterday. I guess we are ritualized acoustic kit soul brothers for sure! I haven't posted an update because the project still looks much the same as it did the last time I posted pics here, despite me continuously working on it. it's difficult being a perfectionist and also having very little skill or experience at the thing you're working on. what this means lately, is that in the past few weeks I've now re-attached the back to the rim 3 times. I've finally (kind of) got it where I can live with it, and am now about to move on to routing the body for the bindings and purfling. but in the mean time, I've used an iron and a pocket knife 3 times (!) to remove the back, and have tried various ways of clamping it down before I got a pretty good seal, all the way around. for the fourth try I wound up purchasing 12 four-inch bar clamps and clamped the back down without the mold. it was kinda tricky pushing in on the sides of the lower bout about 1/8th to 1/16th of an inch, while tightening the clamps and then making sure that the area near the tail wedge and the neck block were both perfectly perpendicular to the top. on the fourth try I think I got it. but this is not the way that they said to do it, anywhere I have ever looked. oh well. in my last pictures, things looked ok, but there were actually gaps near the neck block and my glue job was just not very good. a real guitar maker mighta used 20 or 30 spool clamps. but I'm a one-time kit guitar on a budget. and despite all this, I'm thinking everything is turning out ok ... more soon. __________________

April 16th, 2009, 12:51 AM	#28 (permalink)
PapaBeef Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: EN JAY Posts: 1,870	I was just thinking, if you had to you could make a mess o spool clamps out of long screws,wing nuts, fender washers, felt washers & maybe some cheap tubing to cover the screw threads & prevent them from scratching the sides. All stuff you could get at a regular hardware or home center & not break the bank. Good luck. __________________ What I mean is, sometimes I just don't know what I mean. Ya know what I mean?

2009 TDPRI Giveaway Winners List is available HERE

IMPORTANT:Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult! No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.

April 16th, 2009, 07:31 AM	#29 (permalink)
BAW4742 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Maryland's Eastern Shore Age: 52 Posts: 1,228 4 Photos	Some spool clamps that I made. I used a hole saw to cut out the blocks from 3/4" plywood. The same hole saw was used to cut the pads from cork and these cork pads were glued to the wood blocks. Then assembled them with carriage bolts, fender washers and wing nuts. They work great and there is enough thread on the bolts that I can use them on thinline guitars as well as acoustics.

April 16th, 2009, 11:14 PM	#30 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	here's a progress report, everything that I got done in the last month. this is how I wound up re-re-gluing the back. It's indeed difficult being a perfectionist when you have no experience with what you're currently working on. Don't ask how many hours I put into fitting the back of the guitar to the rim. I'm not ready to start taking orders, yet. I'd make about $1/hr! I finally got it to turn out ok, pretty tight and snug all the way around: I used this hair curling iron to bend my binding (made out of maple), and it actually worked well. I couldn't believe how well it did work. I soaked the wood strips in water for a while, first. And after bending them with the iron, I clamped them to that outline of the guitar, overnight. In the morning I found that they had held the shape. It was much easier than I thought it was going to be. Here's the maple binding after bending, taped to the pieces of (pre-bent) herringbone purfling I ordered. I bought the binding from lmii.com. I could've used plastic for the binding, but wood will be much nicer. Chiseling out the space for the tail wedge: __________________

April 16th, 2009, 11:15 PM	#31 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	[...continued...] ...and the tail wedge glued in and sanded sorta flush. This maple I used is not a perfect match with my binding but I'll figure that out later? ... I cut out this space for the neck joint out of the top using a battery-powered drill and a chisel. Wow, in this picture, the holes in the top look really crooked but it's not as bad as it looks. Putting the frets in the fingerboard went pretty quick -- it's one of the few things in this project that I've done before. I had it masked here while I worked on the fret ends. This might be my best fret job yet. It really turned out nicely. ... and when I hold the whole thing up it feels pretty light and nicely balanced. if I can get it all to line up correctly when I do the neck set and the bridge placement, this might just be a dreamy 000. we'll see. if it turns out nice I plan to buy one of those arched tweed cases for it and a Greven Tortis pickguard. anybody have an opinion about grover vs gotoh vs waverly? I'm leaning towards grover. __________________ Last edited by enalnitram; April 16th, 2009 at 11:53 PM.

April 17th, 2009, 11:11 AM	#34 (permalink)
RickG501 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Oklahoma City Age: 55 Posts: 1,346	Be careful with the super glue or any glue, as if the place where your putting it will show prominentely, the glue won't take stain and you could wind up with a prominent light spot on an otherwise beautiful finish. It's coming along nicely though, actually it looks really great for a first build! I'm not sure I'm ready to tackle something like this, heck I screwed up the shoe shine kit I made in shop class... __________________ I know my words sound strange to you but if you wait til my song is sung and my story's told you might come to understand...

April 19th, 2009, 12:36 AM	#38 (permalink)
enalnitram Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 285 2 Photos	thanks for posting those pics, RnB. an incredible thing happened in the saga of my guitar build today. I attended a gathering of the members of OLF today in Lake Zurich, Illinois, and I won the top prize of the door prizes handed out: a free finish by a guy that has just set up a business, and that does work with the same kind of finishes that Taylor does: Poly hardened by UV light or something like that. Joe White. Nice guy. And his work looks really nice. I had been planning to shoot it myself with nitro, probably from those stew mac spray cans. but now i'll have this pro finish done. __________________

April 19th, 2009, 02:16 PM	#40 (permalink)
otterhound Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Manheim Pa. Posts: 1,285 12 Photos	Looks good so far . Have you considered trying what I call mummifying the body by wrapping it when gluing the top or back ? I have a 00028 Martin and I love it . I think that you will enjoy a very special treat every time you pick her up . Nice looking EIR . Very straight grain . I am envious .